Degritter Users

Discussion in 'Audio Hardware' started by WntrMute2, Jun 30, 2019.

  1. 5-String

    5-String μηδὲν ἄγαν

    Location:
    Sunshine State
    Probably a silly question or not, I don’t know. I would like to hear your opinion on this.

    Before I purchased my Degritter a year ago, I owned one of these Chinese ultrasonic tanks, and a CLAudio before, which I sold.
    Anyway, I still have my ultrasonic tank with its spinner and it was unused for a year. I thought to use it to see if it works.

    So, 5 minutes in the ultrasonic tank with plain distilled water, played the record, sounded great but not 100% silent, next day, same record medium program on Degritter with two drops of tergitol 15, bam, perfectly silent record!

    My silly question/concern.

    How much exposure to ultrasonics is too much? Is there anyone here who uses another ultrasonic as a prewash step before the Degritter and achieves great results?
     
  2. madrac

    madrac Forum Resident

    Location:
    houston, texas
    I had one of those Chinese Ultrasonic/Spinner set ups before getting my Degritter. Never used it in conjunction with the Degritter. I'd guess that your routine (5 minutes in the Chinese machine, medium or heavy in the Degritter) isn't too much exposure.

    I used to use my VPI vacuum machine, followed by the Degritter, on all records. That said, now I just use the Degritter. I can't tell much difference between the two methods. I still have the VPI which I'd likely use first on used/really dirty lps.
     
    5-String likes this.
  3. pacvr

    pacvr Forum Resident

    Location:
    Maryland
    There are a number of people who use two ultrasonic tanks for cleaning. The first tank is for cleaning with a surfactant concentration high enough for detergency, and the second is for final-clean-rinse. Two examples - The Ultrasonic vinyl cleaner owners thread tima's DIY RCM . Note that in these examples, both tanks are being filtered.
     
    Old Zorki II and 5-String like this.
  4. recstar24

    recstar24 Senior Member

    Location:
    Glen Ellyn, IL
    So I was finally able to procure that Nalgene dropper bottle recommended by @pacvr so figured might be a nice time to experiment using the tergitol 15-s-9 (of which I have a plenty), and am due for my typical clean and water refresh anyways. Below are complete anecdotal and unscientific observations:
    • Tergitol “sheets” nicely, but I would say the stock degritter fluid provides even more sheeting (maybe a bit too much even? I could probably afford to drop my 1.5ml to 1ml of usage)
    • The tergitol dries very well! The fact that it does without the additional alcohols from the stock degritter fluid is impressive.
    • Tried it out on a AP33 of Muddy Waters folk singer. Beautifully simple and spacious sounding record. The presentation did not suck. Whereas the stock degritter fluid, I always notice the bass first and foremost, with this muddy waters disc and tergitol it was the clarity in the highs and the snappiness of the drums that first caught my ear. I could really hear the metallic twang in the strings compared to my previous listen (which had not been degrittered).
    So again taken with grain of salt but I’m happy with the results. I’ll probably switch back to degritter fluid on next tank refresh just to check out but would drop down to 1ml of usage. The Nalgene dropper bottle though works wonderfully and was super easy to get two very precise drops of tergitol into the tank which was appreciated.
     
    Andrea_Bellucci and pacvr like this.
  5. Hi, I wish I could figure out how to properly search this forum. I went back and read everything a while back and then … well that was 70 pages ago. :/

    I am having a problem with my Degritter in that it seems that it won't drain entirely. The bottom of my LPs is wet after drying. Any ideas?
     
  6. 5-String

    5-String μηδὲν ἄγαν

    Location:
    Sunshine State
    I have noticed the clarity in the highs too whenever I use Tergitol 15-S-9.
    I noticed it the first time many years ago when I started using ultrasonic cleaning and posted about it in this forum although originally I thought it was the ultrasonic cleaning that created that effect. After a while, I realized that it was the Tergitol because when I stopped using it the clarity that can be excessive sometimes wasn't there anymore.

    Then I noticed it again when recently I started using two drops of Tergitol with the Degritter instead of the Degritter fluid.

    As a matter of fact, the record that was cleaned with Tergitol in the Degritter tank mentioned in my previous post had that clarity in the highs vs the same record cleaned only with distilled water in the Chinese ultrasonic tank. It was very obvious.

    Is this the result of more effective cleaning due to Tergitol or is it due to a film left behind?
     
    Andrea_Bellucci likes this.
  7. Greenmonster2420

    Greenmonster2420 Forum Resident

    Location:
    Central Ohio
    I think it would have to be the former, wouldn't it? I struggle to rationalize how a residue would induce more clarity
     
    pacvr, recstar24 and 5-String like this.
  8. In a case where one hears more clarity, it's likely that you've done something good—like cleaning off muck—that exposes a problem elsewhere, like a problem with highs in the signal path or speakers (are speakers part of the signal path?). I had that issue with Led Zeppelin LPs, actually. They are easy to reproduce on low-end gear, but then I found them quite difficult to listen to on a mid-fi system. Now that I have a silly level of audio gear, they sound great and balanced again. It's quite common with cables, where muck introduced by relatively expensive cables makes a system sound better since it covers up a defect in the signal path or speakers.
     
  9. Regarding this, I am also noting that the Degritter is not fully draining.
     
  10. VinBob

    VinBob Forum Resident

    Location:
    New Jersey, USA
    How much of it is wet? I have had this with my unit in that there is a tiny little droplet or two of water on the lead in groove of the LP - increasing the drying solved it for me...
     
  11. recstar24

    recstar24 Senior Member

    Location:
    Glen Ellyn, IL
    Random aside - I had changed my normal water level from medium to low for a particular record. Holy foam! Last time I saw that amount of foam was in college (don’t ask). Apparently the manual recommends keeping water level to medium, as it quotes “the surface skimming filtration is pulling water into the filter quite close to the water line. In rare cases the low water setting can cause the filtration pump to suck in air which will cause additional foaming”. Could be specific to the tergitol but I changed back to medium water level and no foam.
     
  12. Last inch or inch and a half. Water spraying out too, onto label and etc. It stopped with ERR04 later on.
     
  13. r.Din

    r.Din Seeker of Truth

    Location:
    UK
    During some of my cleaning tests I've had records go through the Degritter 20-30 times in pretty rapid succession. Each time recorded for assessment. Blind testing the last clean against the first confirms there is no degradation. I've also previously regularly used a Kirmuss before the Degritter without issue. The only degradation from these tests was in the lead in groove from the stylus dropping in over and over again, which starts to build up some clicks.

    I'm convinced that as long as you aren't running the record into the hot/melting zone, eg 20+ minutes of constant ultrasonics then there is unlikely to be any problem whatsoever with them. Other machines may be different of course, especially if not design with vinyl cleaning in mind.

    Using the Kirmuss first did improve results over the Degritter, but the semi-manual Kirmuss process lead to full manual cleaning which is even better. So, now, it's manual cleaning, following @pacvr's guide and then into the Degritter for final polish and rinse. Perfection.
     
    Budley, SpinIt, Bill Hart and 4 others like this.
  14. luckybaer

    luckybaer Thinks The Devil actually beat Johnny

    Location:
    Missouri
    For all of you with frequent shut downs to cool the water:

    1. Is your Degritter operating in a climate-controlled environment - i.e. do you have air-conditioning?

    Mine would be in a room where the temperature rarely exceeds 72F. I'd really be disappointed if I had frequent shut downs due to temp of the water.
     
  15. Vinyl Archaeologist

    Vinyl Archaeologist Forum Resident

    It doesn’t shut down. The cycle just takes a bit longer.
     
    madrac likes this.
  16. madrac

    madrac Forum Resident

    Location:
    houston, texas
    As vinyl archaeologist posted, the cycle is extended a few minutes. I usually use the heavy cycle and generally can get around 4 records cleaned consecutively before the cooling cycle kicks in on the 5th. My room is climate controlled. It's not a big deal as it's a precaution to protect the vinyl from overly hot water. Obviously, as you probably know, the ultrasonics will generate heat in operation.
     
    luckybaer likes this.
  17. 12 Hz

    12 Hz Well-Known Member

    Location:
    Covina, CA
    Is anybody using Tergikleen in your Degritter? If so, how many drops are you putting into the 1.3 L Degritter tank?
     
  18. Whistlerskibum

    Whistlerskibum Forum Resident

    Location:
    Whistler, BC
    Recent purchaser of the degritter using 4 -5 drops however I’m still experimenting to get to the ideal number
     
    12 Hz likes this.
  19. Ramiro Orta

    Ramiro Orta Well-Known Member

    Location:
    San Francisco
    I just received my Degritter Ultrasonic Cleaner (v1) and tried it out on a couple of used records I just bought. I was skeptical at first how much it would affect audio performance, but WOW! I did not expect how much better fidelity I would gain from using this device. I am a true believer now! It also helped that I bought a brand new unit with an extra tank for $2700. Awesome! I'm looking forward to this weekend and cleaning a bunch of LPs!
     
    JamsOnly likes this.
  20. drmoss_ca

    drmoss_ca Vinyl Cleaning Fiend

    Location:
    NS, Canada
    Welcome to the club. Vinyl lives again, better than new, with ultrasonic cleaning!
     
    Ramiro Orta likes this.
  21. SME12A

    SME12A Takumi forever

    Location:
    PA
    So far, I have 1100 cycles on mine and no issues whatsoever.... all my records are cleaned before being played for the first time. On the negative side - I have never had noisy record being miraculously saved by multiple runs in the machines...
     
  22. Ramiro Orta

    Ramiro Orta Well-Known Member

    Location:
    San Francisco
    Are they new records that are noisy or older used copies?
     
  23. SME12A

    SME12A Takumi forever

    Location:
    PA
    I tried both new and used - if they noisy after first "heavy" cycle run, they stay noisy no matter how many more times they get cleaned. I use Degritter's own solution with no additional baths/scrubbing/rinsing etc..
     
    Tiger Rag and elvismcdouglas like this.
  24. Old Zorki II

    Old Zorki II Storm Watcher

    Location:
    near Tampa, FL
    I have several UK and Japan pressings which multiple runs made much quarter. I never had that US pressings. Weird.
     
  25. Ramiro Orta

    Ramiro Orta Well-Known Member

    Location:
    San Francisco
    I keep being amazed by the Degritter. I have a 1973 Australian Quad copy of DSOTM that sounded very nice after cleaning it with a Okki Nokki, but there was still some bits of noise on it. Ran it through the Degritter on Medium. Amazing! Is the only word I have for it. The LP sounds dead quiet with incredible fidelity. The soundstage is incredible! I will clean my other 5 versions of DSOTM and compare. I did the same to a 1981 MOFI copy of DSOTM and again, it brought it back to life. If you are thinking of buying a Degritter and have a nice collection of LPs, run, don't walk and buy one now! You will not regret it. It's worth every penny.
     
    Charile, VinBob, drmoss_ca and 2 others like this.

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