Do solid state amplification benefit of warm up?

Discussion in 'Audio Hardware' started by EddieVanHalen, Nov 24, 2012.

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  1. EddieVanHalen

    EddieVanHalen Forum Resident Thread Starter

    I know tube equipment don't sound the same cold, when they're just turned on than after some time working and being warm, sometimes I'd say HOT.
    My question is if this also happen, up to a certain degree with solid state amplification.
    I have an ancient Marantz A/V receiver, an SR-7000, bought new in the year 2000. I just love the sound of it either in stereo or with DTS-HD Master Audio, Dolby TrueHD or SACDs (played on its native dsd, not converted to PCM) coming from te analog outputs or an Oppo BDP-93. The Hi Rez audio, DTS-HD Master Audio, Dolby TrueHD or DSD from an SACD get into the Marantz SR-7000 through the 5.1 analog inputs (using three pairs of high quality Philips cable, beware, I live in Europe): I like the sound that I get from my humble mix or ancient out of fashion (the A/V Receiver, which is 12 years old), my "new" piece of equipment is an Oppo BDP-93, now not so new now as Oppo is introducing a new line of BD-Players. It's yet to bee seen how much over their previous models, not feature, but sound quality-wise they have improved their sound quality, at least on the mid
    . Maybeybe on the BDP-105 as they got rid of the fans, but I don't think the difference between the BDP-93 and the DP-103 must be so big at least on the audio side.
    So I'll stick to my question: sould I warm up my solid state equipment before a serious litenning? In my experience when the Marantz A/V 7000 is hot after several hours of us is whn it sounds the best, but all could be snake oil...
    Thanks in advance.
     
  2. Wasatch

    Wasatch Music Lover!

    Yes, they do in my book. When I had SS gear I would leave them on all the time or at least an hour before listening.
     
  3. Steve Hoffman

    Steve Hoffman Your host Your Host

    Yes, of course.
     
  4. EddieVanHalen

    EddieVanHalen Forum Resident Thread Starter

    Thanks you for your answers. So it's not my imagination.
     
  5. thegage

    thegage Forum Currency Nerd

    Just wait, someone will jump in to tell you it is. :D

    John K.
     
  6. Doug Sclar

    Doug Sclar Forum Legend

    Location:
    The OC
    I used to leave my amps on 24/7 but I got tired of paying so much for electricity. I notice it really takes 24 hours or so for my main amp to sound it's absolute best, but after 2 hours it's much beter than when it's first turned on. Consequently, I have now turn mine on in the afternoon, so it's got at least 2 hours before I consider listening to it. If I don't wait, I'll get disinterested, soley based on the sound, and I've experienced this many times.

    I can't say definitively, but I think I was able to measure this phenomina. Back in 1983, I did some upgrades to my Threshold and I had to rebias it. I got the procedure from Nelson, and I had to monitor the bias current. It actually took 24 hours for it to stabalize. After a few hours it's variations were reduced from initial turn on, but it actually took a full day for them to settle down enough to precisely match the channels.

    Granted these variations weren't major, but I think the bias current has to settle down for the amp to sound it's best. One of the major attributes of my system is stability, and if these currents are fluctuating things are obviously not as stable as when those fluctuations are reduced.
     
  7. Metralla

    Metralla Joined Jan 13, 2002

    Location:
    San Jose, CA
    Yes from me. In particular, digital should be left on, in my opinion.
     
  8. Wasatch

    Wasatch Music Lover!

    Yup.
     
  9. Baron Von Talbot

    Baron Von Talbot Well-Known Member

    Definitely true, after a while it just sounds better. But we also get more and more in the mood to listen if setting, source (right type of music chosen) and physical well being increases. Plus later in the evening the electricity is usual less busy. So I think a lot of aspects come into play and leaving the amp on 24/7 is not necessary. If you can afford it no prob, I know people who used to leave the lights on in corripors or garages all the time since the bulbs last longer that way. Switching on and off is the most stressful part on any piece of electronic. Heat is contra productive, too - so we are in a jam and should be open for Class D amps IF done right they beat the typical A/B sound anyway. Mos-Fets being used etc. Just check Audio Research...or PRIMARE - In fact the only amp i got that has a WARMING UP Period when started from scratch about 15 to 30 seconds is an in house CLASS D development. musical Fidelity came up with their first CLASS d Power amp, too - Okay the entry half size model M1 PWR, but still.. Not a bad sounding amp neither.
     
  10. jhw59

    jhw59 Forum Resident

    Location:
    Rehoboth Beach DE.
    if I leave my equipment on standby mode, doesn't that keep it at full performance status?
     
  11. EddieVanHalen

    EddieVanHalen Forum Resident Thread Starter

    When I bought my Oppo BDP-93 last year I had it on and working for two days in a raw, it didn't stopped playing CDs or BDs, sometimes I was listening or watching, sometimes not, but I left it working anyway. I think mechanical pieces on the reading drive need to settle on and the analog stages need to be brought "alive" when is a new piece of equipment.
    As I've said on my first thread, as humble as my set is (Marantz SR-7000 A/V Receiver, bought here in Spain in 2000, but I suspect it's actually a 1999 model that came here for the next year catalog, Oppo BDP-93, a Goldring GR-2, one, if not the most basic on their catalogue, coupled with a Denon MC cart and a Goldring phono stage, the speakers are set of four B&W 600 from 1996 (so they were stil made in the UK, not in China) and B&W 600CC for the center channel), when left on a couple of hours My Steve Mastered CDs of Phil Collins, my Wally of Boston's Don't Look back, The Steve mastered Van Halen S/T vinil or the SACD soundtrac for E.T. The Extra-Terrestial, they all shine and come to life.
    If I told about this to the average Spanish he would thing I was going nuts.
     
  12. hi_watt

    hi_watt The Road Warrior

    Location:
    San Diego, CA
    I'd like to leave my amp on all the time, but I'm paranoid about it overheating. I'll have to get over it. Regardless of that, my Adcom does sound nicer when it's always on. ;)
     
  13. In my experience the answer is yes but I guess it depends on the amp. I first bought my Plinius 8200 MkII Class A/B Integrated (175W into 8 Ohm) about ten years ago. The user manual recommends it be left on continuously and when not in use to be switched to standby mode and this what I have always done. It has been switched off maybe half a dozen times in those ten years, mainly for cleaning purposes or if I am going away for any extended period of time. It takes a good day or two to properly warm up and always sounds like **** until it does.
     
  14. motorcitydave

    motorcitydave Enlightened Rogue In Memoriam

    Location:
    Las Vegas, NV, USA
    I leave the preamp, amp, and cd player on all the time. It does indeed sound better that way.

    Now if I had a Class A amp, I probably would not leave it on all the time as they tend to get hot and suck up the electricity.
     
  15. Except for my turntable I leave everything on all the time. Although theoretically my Nottingham's motor is always on...I just stop it from rotating.
     
  16. ElizabethH

    ElizabethH Forum Resident

    Location:
    SE Wisconsin,USA
    I agree Solid state wlwctronics I have owned sounded better after being on for some time.
    usually a few hours to sound good. Though itdoes take longer to sound best.
    Since i listen to music every day most of the daay now i am retired, I leave all my equipment on 24/7/365.
    Including a four tube preamp.
    Even when I owned a Class "A" amp, I liked to leave it on all the time (though it cost be $10 extra all by itself in additional power costs)
    My system sounds great. amd the extra money spent of electricity is not a problem.
    At this time I would guess 24/7 costs me an extra $10 a month?
     
  17. Doug Sclar

    Doug Sclar Forum Legend

    Location:
    The OC
    Lucky you. It was costing me hundreds more. Part of my problem is that I use a lot of power so I'm in a higher tier. My amps also idle at over 500 watts.

    I've cut my electric bill in half by conserving and it's still between $250 and $500 per month depending on the season. My AC costs a lot to run in the summer months, and I've cut that down considerably with a thermostat that I can control from my computers, tablets or phones.
     
  18. Drew

    Drew Senior Member

    Location:
    Grand Junction, CO
    The amplicication properties of a solid state device vary based on temperature. It can easily be demonstrated by any first year tech or engineering student.
     
  19. back2vinyl

    back2vinyl Forum Resident

    Location:
    London, UK
    Yes, solid state equipment benefits from warming up but five minutes is plenty and you should switch it off when it's not being used. Don't take my word for it - this is Tim de Paravicini:

    "There has been considerable debate over the question of "breaking in" and "warming up" audio equipment. All [EAR] Yoshino amplifiers are designed to work to full specification from day one, requiring no more than a few minutes to reach full operating condition. Because the 324 uses transistors, which unlike tubes do not need to warm up as such, all that is required is for all capacitors to charge up fully and for all internal voltages to stabilise, which takes less than five minutes. However, very frequent switching on and off of any electronic equipment places some stress on components, particularly in the power supply, and for this reason Yoshino recommends as a general practice that amplifiers should be left on for the duration of a typical evening's listening. They should be switched off at night to save electricity and to maximise operating life - although the [EAR] 324 in particular places very low stress on all its internal components."

    - EAR 324 Owner's Manual, current edition, p6

    As motorcitydave points out, you can't leave class A equipment on all the time anyway - you'd melt the planet.
     
  20. motorcitydave

    motorcitydave Enlightened Rogue In Memoriam

    Location:
    Las Vegas, NV, USA
    Thanks back2vinyl.
     
  21. sberger

    sberger Dream Baby Dream

    My ss tuners definitely seem to be better at tuning in weaker stations after being on for awhile. And yeah they do sound better as well.
     
  22. JBStephens

    JBStephens I don't "like", "share", "tweet", or CARE. In Memoriam

    Location:
    South Mountain, NC
    Absolutely. Plus, the constant cycling of heating and cooling can shorten the life of semiconductors, so my amps are always on "standby" instead of completely turned off.
     
  23. bilgewater

    bilgewater Forum Resident

    Location:
    Michigan
    See now I'm confused. After years of reading here, I thought the only thing that could warm up solid state components was .... tube components.
     
  24. AJH

    AJH Senior Member

    Location:
    PA Northern Tier
    A very good friend of mine, who owned a high end audio store, always made sure that his high end solid state equipment was on for at least four hours (or hopefully longer) when a client was scheduled to come into the store to seriously listen to any of the solid state high end equipment. Personally, I feel my own solid state gear sounds much better if it is on (not just in standby) for at least several hours prior to any serious listening.

    AJH
     
  25. Doug Sclar

    Doug Sclar Forum Legend

    Location:
    The OC
    Well I'm not sure that is the issue. I imagine my amp can meet it's listed specs a few minutes after it's turned on. That does not mean that it will sound as good as it does after it's been on for several hours or longer. To me, it means the listed specs are not inclusive enough to determine how an amplifier will sound.

    The types of sonic differences I'm talking about are not easily defined by specs. Assuming that my premise that the variations in bias currents are affecting what I'm hearing, I've never seen bias current regularity listed as a spec an amp has to meet.

    Regardless of what specs a manufacturer is going to list, it would be tough to list a spec that could take several days to measure and be able to correlate it to what we hear?
     
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