Don Covay - Jimi Hendrix "Mercy, Mercy" mono/stereo differences?

Discussion in 'Music Corner' started by Chris M, May 25, 2008.

  1. Chris M

    Chris M Senior Member Thread Starter

    Location:
    Baton Rouge, LA
    I've been listening to the Razor & Tie Don Covay set the sound quality of some of that stuff is simply amazing. My favorite song is Mercy, Mercy which features a young Jimi Hendrix on guitar.

    Mercy, Mercy is stereo on the Razor & Tie set. Is there any reason to seek out the mono mix? As a Jimi completist I'm wondering if it has a longer fade, more of Jimi guitar track in the mix, etc.

    thanks in advance!

    Chris
     
  2. MikeP5877

    MikeP5877 Senior Member

    Location:
    OH
    I have it in mono on the Rhino R&B box but I can't remember if it's really that much different. I'll check it out tomorrow.
     
  3. Chris M

    Chris M Senior Member Thread Starter

    Location:
    Baton Rouge, LA
    Thanks Mike!
     
  4. Steve Hoffman

    Steve Hoffman Your Host Your Host


    I've heard the masters of both and the stereo is more "open" sounding with more dynamics, the mono has one key difference. The guitar solo part is raised 5 db from the rest of the song. In other words, it's edited to be louder than the surrounding song. Other than that, it's the same take and mixed from the same three track tape at A1, NYC.

    On re-reading the above, please don't misunderstand me here, Jimi isn't louder by himself, the entire "track" is raised" on the mono mix via an edited "insert" piece. The music was recorded all on one channel of the tape.

    Theoretically one could do the same with the stereo version. Just bump the first note of the guitar solo up a few db and lower it down again when the verse comes back in. Exactly what they did.
     
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  5. Chris M

    Chris M Senior Member Thread Starter

    Location:
    Baton Rouge, LA
    Thanks! I was hoping you would weigh in :)

    Do you remember if the Mercy, Mercy tape you used had a cold ending?
     
  6. Steve Hoffman

    Steve Hoffman Your Host Your Host

    Cold ending? You kiddin'? I would have used it, dude. No, the stereo fades and the mono fades. In fact, the mono fade is a tad sooner than the stereo....


    Did Mick Jagger take this guy's persona or something? It's uncanny. Play MERCY, MERCY for anyone, tell them it's the Rolling Stones. They will believe you.
     
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  7. Chris M

    Chris M Senior Member Thread Starter

    Location:
    Baton Rouge, LA
    Thanks. Yeah, Jagger was obviously familer with Covay :laugh:

    BTW, did you know the JHE played Mercy, Mercy live as late as September 1967? When Jimi visited Stax in 1965 Steve Cropper kind of blew him off until Jimi told him he played on Mercy, Mercy :)

    Another Hendrix/Covay connection is the Little Richard Vee Jay 45 I Don't Know What You've Got But It's Got Me (part I and II). Covay wrote the song and Jimi plays rhythm guitar on it..
     
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  8. Steve Hoffman

    Steve Hoffman Your Host Your Host

    I didn't know that.

    I had the Stones version on the brain for 10 years until I heard the Don Covay original. It blew my mind. Loved the guitar, never knew it was Jimi Hendrix until I read it in a book in the 1990s..
     
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  9. MikeP5877

    MikeP5877 Senior Member

    Location:
    OH
    I just took a listen to both, and while the mono mix is very good I'm not sure I'd seek out a comp just for that.

    I love the Razor & Tie CD. Bought it new five years ago at a Borders Outlet for $4.99. :thumbsup:
     
  10. Steve Hoffman

    Steve Hoffman Your Host Your Host

    Check that song "Daddy Loves Baby". Crank it really loud. Nothing like it!

    "Da, da, da, da, da, da, daddy loves baby"...

    ------------------------------------------------------------------

    Also, compare two of the tracks recorded at STAX in Memphis, Tenn.:

    Sookie, Sookie and See Saw....


    See Saw was "redubbed" by Tom Dowd in NYC with a treble boost (just like all those hissy Otis Redding stereo redubs) but Sookie, Sookie is unmolested and I transferred it straight from the original Stax stereo session tape. Hear the difference? Amazing, ain't it?
     
  11. Steve Hoffman

    Steve Hoffman Your Host Your Host

    Yeesh, I just took a listen to the Razor & Tie CD and the stereo MERCY, MERCY. Guess I forgot that I boosted the Jimi Hendrix solo in the mastering to match the mono version. Totally forgot I did that. I guess I was being thorough.. So, no need to do it in Pro Tools!
     
  12. Maidenpriest

    Maidenpriest Setting the controls for the heart of the sun :)

    Location:
    Europe
    This is a side to Hendrix I know nothing about, I understand the Hendrix sessions from this time have been exploited on rubbish releases over the years, so which Cd(s) give a good comprehensive overview of this material and is the best buy?
     
  13. texron

    texron Forum Resident

    Location:
    Texas USA
    Does anyone have an answer? I have a lot of his early material spread out on several LP's. Is it available as a single source anywhere?
     
  14. Steve Hoffman

    Steve Hoffman Your Host Your Host

    No idea, sorry.
     
  15. Chris M

    Chris M Senior Member Thread Starter

    Location:
    Baton Rouge, LA
    Not really. Some fans have put together homemade comps of the early stuff but they have lots of non-Jimi on them.
     
  16. texron

    texron Forum Resident

    Location:
    Texas USA

    It was worth a shot, maybe I'll make my own:shh:
     
  17. Chris M

    Chris M Senior Member Thread Starter

    Location:
    Baton Rouge, LA
    My main CDR project is a 1 CD comp of the best of the early session work using vintage mixes where available.
     
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  18. vinyldreams

    vinyldreams Forum Resident

    Location:
    Main St.
    Title: The Authentic PPX Studio Recordings
    Artist: Jimi Hendrix
    Record Label: SPV
    Notes: SPV Recordings, a division of SPV GmbH
    Release Year: 1997
    CD in Set: 6


    FULL ARTWORK


    THE COMPLETE & AUTHENTIC PPX STUDIO RECORDINGS...

    In 1997, SPV Records in Germany released six volumes titled The Authentic PPX Studio Recordings.

    During two studio sessions in 1965 and 1967, plus a live set at George's Club in Hackensack, New Jersey, Jimi Hendrix recorded tracks with Curtis Knight. Under contract to, and under the direction of producer Ed Chalpin, these studio sessions at PPX Studios in New York became infamous. Not only for being one of the earliest known studio sessions featuring Hendrix as a lead performer, but for the legal embattlement the sessions created.

    The tapes have been released on various album combinations over three dozen times, as Chalpin continuously licenses them to record companies throughout the world. "As long as there are record companies who want to distribute this material in their market, I will license it to them accordingly," Chalpin once indicated, noting that each of those companies is only supposed to distribute the product in the country they are licensed.

    But, according to CBH, the Knight material has never before been officially licensed on compact disc. That is, until now. Of course, we can document numerous pseudo-legitimate releases with some of the Hendrix- Knight material included, but certainly, this is the most comprehensive compilation of such material to date.

    Chalpin has licensed the tapes to CBH Records in Germany. Engineers Kalle Trapp and Rainer Hansel went in and recut, re-edited and remastered the material into a six volume set. Some songs have been remixed, some mixed down to only include Jimi's guitar and vocals. Others have been completely re-edited, cut and spliced in such a way that choruses are repeated, verses are re-arranged, and guitar parts are extended. "Butchered," say some; "creative" argue others. Either way, we do get some new material. We get plenty of old material that's been cleaned up and made more presentable and listenable. And, we get the doctored tracks, which will always get challenged in the Hendrix circles.

    Hopes ran high when news came of the official German release of The Authentic PPX Studio Recordings that maybe this time we'd have these Hendrix-Knight sessions presented in a sympathetic context with perhaps some detailed liner notes and new information to shed light on these sessions. Dream on!

    Let's start with the liner notes, claiming these recordings are available for the first time on CD. Well, what about Historic Hendrix and Prologue, amongst others, which have been around for ages. The liner notes by Gitti Gulden may as well have been written by Chalpin himself as yet again we have a very rose-tinted version of events where he appears to be the innocent part who has been badly done to over the years.

    The most interested part is the line-up details which lists: "Drums: Johnny Star. All other instruments played by Jimi Hendrix. Lead Vocals: Curtis Knight. Additional Vocals: Jimi Hendrix." Johnny Star's name has only appeared in historical references previously as a suggested engineer. Noted session drummer Bernard Purdie has made claim he was involved with some of these sessions. And, as far as Jimi playing all instruments on all the tracks, there's enough historical evidence to discount this statement as total rubbish. Even the photos included in some of the booklets show additional musicians in the studio.

    In the original SPV releases, each disc comes with an eight page booklet. Graphic continuity brings this six volume set into a unified perspective. The six covers feature different photos from the Gered Mankowitz photo archives. Each inside cover features two different rare (some never before published) photos of Hendrix during the Curtis Knight period and sessions. On the Nippon Crown box set, the SPV covers are re-used on the individual discs. Each disc comes in a cardboard slipsleeve. A 16-page booklet, encapsulating the same pictures and text that appeared in the SPV releases, is included. The six discs are then encased in a thin cardboard "box", another Mankowitz shot used on the metallic-ink four-color cover.

    Most of the material has been previously released on numerous titles, the German Astan and Babylon labels providing in vinyl versions the prominent portion of the material presented here.


    Tracklisting:

    Vol.1 - Get That Feeling (30:23)

    1 Get That Feeling (5:18)
    2 How Would You Feel (3:10)
    3 Hush Now (5:10)
    4 No Business (3:15)
    5 Simon Says (3:12)
    6 A New Dress (3:10)
    7 Strange Things (3:19)
    8 Welcome Home (3:31)

    Vol.2 - Flashing (31:50)

    1 Love, Love (5:13)
    2 Day Tripper (3:16)
    3 Gloomy Monday (3:31)
    4 Fool For Your Baby (2:49)
    5 Don't Accuse Me (3:56)
    6 Hornet's Nest (3:40)
    7 Flashing (3:43)
    8 Oddball (3:02)
    9 Happy Birthday (2:20)

    Vol.3 - Ballad Of Jimi (39:29)

    1 UFO (2:54)
    2 You Don't Want Me (Instr.) (3:02)
    3 Better Times Ahead (2:33)
    4 Future Trip (2:27)
    5 Wah Wah (Instr.) (1:19)
    6 Everybody Knew But Me (1:32)
    7 Mercy Lady Day (Instr.) (8:37)
    8 If You Gonna Make A Fool Of Somebody (2:43)
    9 My Best Friend (Instr.) (2:27)
    10 The Ballad Of Jimi (2:25)
    11 Second Time Around (Instr.) (9:08)

    Vol.4 - Live At George's Club (39:19)

    1 Drivin' South (Instr.) (6:10)
    2 Ain't That Peculiar (3:22)
    3 I'll Be Doggone (2:34)
    4 I've Got A Sweet Little Angel (4:42)
    5 Bright Light, Big City (3:09)
    6 Get Out Of My Life Woman (3:39)
    7 Last Night (Instr.) (3:13)
    8 Sugar Pie, Honey Pie (2:56)
    9 What'd I Say (3:58)
    10 Shotgun (5:15)

    Vol.5 - Something On Your Mind (42:25)

    1 California Night (Live) (5:05)
    2 Level (Studio, Instr.) (2:49)
    3 I Feel Good (Live) (2:59)
    4 Left Alone (Live) (2:21)
    5 Knock Yourself Out (Studio, Instr.) (5:58)
    6 Something On Your Mind (Live) (5:30)
    7 I Should've Quit You (Live) (3:31)
    8 Hard Night (Live, Instr.) (4:15)
    9 I'm A Man (Live) (4:53)
    10 Instrumental (Studio, Instr.) (4:46)

    Vol.6 - On The Killing Floor (41:41)

    1 On The Killing Floor (Live) (3:45)
    2 Money (Live) (3:59)
    3 Nobody Loves Me (Live) (3:46)
    4 Love (Studio, Instr.) (8:28)
    5 You Got Me Running (Live) (3:53)
    6 Mr. Pitiful (Live) (3:06)
    7 Torture Me Honey (Studio, Instr.) (6:39)
    8 Sleepy Fate (Studio, Instr.) (2:51)
    9 Satisfaction (Live) (4:57)
     
  19. From Youtube, JIMI HENDRIX - HAVE MERCY - FLAMINGO CLUB, LONDON 04/02/67.

    Wow, I've heard a lot of Hendrix over the years, but never this. :)
     
  20. alchemy

    alchemy Forum Resident

    Location:
    Sterling, VA
    FYI 'Mercy, Mercy' can also found on 'West Coast Seattle Boy: The Jimi Hendrix Anthology' along with other slices of Jimi's per-fame years.
     
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  21. Steve Hoffman

    Steve Hoffman Your Host Your Host

    So, an SH Forums member has pointed out to me that, due to an advertisement that was in a trade mag when "Mercy Mercy" was on the charts, it looks like it was recorded at Talentmasters in NYC by Bob Gallo and NOT A-1 (Atlantic 1).

    If this is true, they also recorded a bunch of others (same sonic signature and mix style.)

    What have y'all learned about this since this thread was active?

    Don Covay - Atlantic sessions
     
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  22. Steve Hoffman

    Steve Hoffman Your Host Your Host

  23. I’ll sheepishly admit I was not familiar with the Covay version. Having listened to it now, the Stones’ cover is nearly identical to the original! Great song either way.
     
  24. chacha

    chacha Forum Resident

    Location:
    mill valley CA USA
    [​IMG]
    I love it. Last track side 2.
     
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  25. Arnold Grove

    Arnold Grove Senior Member

    Location:
    NYC
    That cover scares me... ;)
     

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