Early SACD test pressings and format history

Discussion in 'Music Corner' started by Black Elk, Nov 10, 2009.

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  1. Jay F

    Jay F New Member

    Location:
    Pittsburgh, PA
    Great analogy, Chris.

    hiro 2009 = Lee S 2005
     
  2. charlie W

    charlie W EMA Level 10

    Location:
    Area Code 254
    I have a relevent question for you, Black Elk. If various divisions of Sony balked on the SACD format, why was it included a feature on the PlayStation 3?
     
  3. Black Elk

    Black Elk Music Lover Thread Starter

    Location:
    Bay Area, U.S.A.
    The only other title that I know Greg Penny had on his to-do list was "Blue Moves". The EJ titles were 24/96 PCM mixed, DSD mastered. Penny may well have received tapes and started mixing, but none of the above mentioned made it to the mastering to DSD stage.

    Joe Chiccarelli told me that they had mixed "Songs From the West Coast" direct to 2-track DSD, but that never saw the light of day either.

    I don't recall Steve Berkowitz (who managed the project within Sony Music) ever releasing a list of titles for the second round. "The Bootleg Series Vol. 6" was done. I seem to remember "Vol. 4" also being mentioned, since it was so popular. The only other album title that would have definitely been in the second round was "The Times They Are A-Changin'" because it came up so often during demonstrations -- no one could understand why it had been skipped for some of the later albums.

    Talking of the Dylan sampler, how about some more scans of some sealed copies (more details on these, with variations, can be found here http://www.searchingforagem.com/2000s/InternationalCompilationsDylan_2000s.htm (scroll to 2003):
     

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  4. Black Elk

    Black Elk Music Lover Thread Starter

    Location:
    Bay Area, U.S.A.
    Sticking with Bob Dylan for two seconds, here's a copy of "Blonde On Blonde" that you are unlikely to find in the local used bins (unless your name is Eddie Williamson!! :D). I'm afraid you can't see the gold frame it is mounted in because I was too lazy to stitch multiple scans together.
     

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  5. Black Elk

    Black Elk Music Lover Thread Starter

    Location:
    Bay Area, U.S.A.
    That's a good question, and I don't have the answer, but my guess would be, because they could. As I understand it, the only PS3s that supported SACD were those that had a special chip needed to do PS2 emulation. Once that was dropped, SACD as a feature went too, though, intriguingly, PS3 continues to support DSD-Disc.
     
  6. ToEhrIsHuman

    ToEhrIsHuman Forum Resident

    Location:
    San Diego, CA, USA
    That inclusion was a major factor in my purchasing decision for a debut model PS3 60GB back in Nov. 2006. I only had a single SACD in my collection at that point, and now I have about 50. I never could fathom the killing off of a perfectly viable format either, but here we are. :(

    P.S. My understanding is a more expensive (to manufacture) drive assembly was required on the PS3 in order to meet the specifications of SACD. When cost-cutting became necessary in order to make some traction in the console war, out the feature went. I wonder how many gamers who snapped up the majority of units that first holiday season have even heard of SACD, much less actually found a title at retail and played it on their system....I'm guessing I am in the minority.

    http://www.ps3sacd.com/
     
  7. Hiro

    Hiro Forum Resident

    Location:
    Poland
  8. Black Elk

    Black Elk Music Lover Thread Starter

    Location:
    Bay Area, U.S.A.
    Here's a copy of the Elias DSD-Disc before the artwork was finalized:
     

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  9. charlie W

    charlie W EMA Level 10

    Location:
    Area Code 254
    That Dylan SACD sampler was included with the original soundtrack to "Masked And Anonmyous" CD.
     
  10. Thank you very much Black Elk the info and link! Scrolling down to 2003 quote:

    "Leading off the demonstrations, Steven Berkowitz (Senior Vice President A&R, Legacy Recordings) played track one which is from a previously unreleased Bootleg Series album recorded live in 1964. He told the group that this Dylan Remastered SACD would be coming out in October and would be the 16th disc in the series. The song features a 22 year old Dylan, singing with some enthusiasm and raw energy. This track is also interesting since it sounds like Dylan may have had a drink or two before the performance. (There was some talk in the listening session about Dylan being "a bit tipsy")."

    But when one scrolls down to 2004, we find it was released only as a 2 CD set. So if I understand correctly, in 2003 Sony is giving away SACD Bob Dylan sampler's to promote the format, but in the next year (2004) has apparently dropped the format in favor of regular CD.

    BTW, I'm dying for the missing Elton John titles, including "Blue Moves." The SACD Elton John titles IMHO we're excellently done from beginning to end. I'd give anything to hear the Multi-channel mixes of the "missing" Elton John titles.
     
  11. Black Elk, what a great thread - thank you for sharing.
     
  12. ubsman

    ubsman Active Member

    Location:
    Utah
    [​IMG]

    So it all fits on a single disk after all? Or is the disk fake?
     
  13. Black Elk

    Black Elk Music Lover Thread Starter

    Location:
    Bay Area, U.S.A.
    :biglaugh:

    Good grief!!! I've had this thing for 6 years, it's been staring me in the face, and I didn't even realize it. Of course, I have the box-set of hybrids where this is a 2-disc set. I haven't taken it apart, but I would assume it is a fake disc, as the silk-screening bears no relation to the released version, and it carries no cat. no. The bounders!! :biglaugh:

    Talk about not seeing the forest for the trees.
     
  14. Black Elk

    Black Elk Music Lover Thread Starter

    Location:
    Bay Area, U.S.A.
    Quad mixes were not liked by the electronics divisions because consumers now associate 5.1 with surround, and if something is not coming out of each speaker they call the troubleshooting hotlines. That's why several of the quad mixes were re-worked to 5.1.
     
  15. It comes down to how Sony was structured as a corporation. The U.S. division of Sony Music was the entity that basically folded on SACD support. Sony in Japan was an insular entity unto itself that wanted to continue supporting SACD. Hence why their hardware division continues to make SACD players to this day. But they do not control the popular music releases of course for the rest of the globe for the company in any way.

    The decision to include SACD on the first-generation PS3's can directly be attributed to programmers at SCEA in Japan, who threw it in as a cool talking point/feature on the system. When the PS3 did not sell well initially, the PS3 had to be streamlined and SACD was one of the first things eliminated.
     
  16. PTgraphics

    PTgraphics Senior Member

    Great info Black Elk!

    Pat
     
  17. JonUrban

    JonUrban SHF Member #497

    Location:
    Connecticut
    I read that the whole Elton John 5.1 series started with "Made in England", which was the current title at the time. Allegedly, Penny played the 5.1 mix for Elton, who loved it, and gave the go ahead for the remixing of his catalog, starting with the early titles. In the mean time, Elton's next album, "Peachtree Road" was created from the get go with a 5.1 mix and was released along with phase one of the catalog.

    The first phase was to be followed by the remaining "classic" titles, along with "Made in England".

    Or so the story goes. There was a glimmer of hope presented over at QQ when a UMG employee hinted that the Phase 2 titles still had a shot of hitting the marketplace, although he did not comment on what format they would be.

    As of now, there are only 5.1 crickets chirping off in the distance! :D
     
  18. soundboy

    soundboy Senior Member

    I wonder if the Sony BMG merger has anything to do with this? Sony Music in Japan, AFAIK, was not part of that merger and may reflect their "individuality".
     
  19. Kossjak

    Kossjak Forum Resident

    Location:
    MW
    I don't think that it was never mentioned that Oasis's Standing On The Shoulder Of Giants was also mixed for SACD, even a catalogue number was allocated. It's ES63586.
     
  20. plickfu

    plickfu Active Member

    Location:
    Chicago, IL
    I think Heathen Chemistry was also nearly out on SACD, too. Wasn't there even a release date that came and went without any trace of an actual SACD?
     
  21. Kossjak

    Kossjak Forum Resident

    Location:
    MW
    Yes, it was. And a catalgoue number too.
    ES86586. Release date - 02.03.2002
     
  22. Hiro

    Hiro Forum Resident

    Location:
    Poland
  23. nukevor

    nukevor Active Member

    Location:
    CA
    I just picked up that album today, used (digipack version) for $3.99. When I saw that the SACD sampler had a song from "Masked And Anonmyous" on it, I just about died. Why didn't Sony release the entire album as a hybrid SACD? Another wasted opportunity...
     
  24. nukevor

    nukevor Active Member

    Location:
    CA
  25. Taurus

    Taurus Senior Member

    Location:
    Houston, Texas
    Arrgh. :sigh:

    I bet to ease the worries of most consumers, all they had to do was print somewhere in a bolded font on the packaging that the 4.0 recording within was the original recording produced by the artist at that time, and that the lack of a center channel will not ruin the surround experience; but especially, that the "subwoofer" channel will be created by the user's playback equipment so he will not be missing out on anything.*

    As far as quad recordings themselves, I hate to think of all those 4.0 tapes sitting in vaults, ready *right now* to be transferred to a modern digital playback format, with no re-mixing expense required.

    Before the merger, BMG had already issued titles in the dvd-audio format, including the Elv1s surround track disc (the first disc I know of with no video whatsoever i.e. basically played like a CD). IIRC a Foo Fighters Dual Disc w/dvd-audio (no surround tracks though) was their last one, which came out after the merger but which was already "in the pipeline" during the merger talks.


    * there are already quite a few modern surround mixes created in the 2000s with no separate .1 channel. And with so many center channels used for HT purposes being in questionable to downright awful locations, the lack of a center in a surround music mix can actually be a big plus. For example several multichannel albums that Elliot Schiener created don't use the center & they sound fine to me!
     
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