Eliminate Grado Hum

Discussion in 'Audio Hardware' started by 500Homeruns, May 12, 2017.

Thread Status:
Not open for further replies.
  1. 500Homeruns

    500Homeruns Peaceful Punk Thread Starter

    Location:
    Lehigh Valley, PA
    I know this has been discussed here and all over the Internet, but is there anything I can do to reduce the hum I am getting from a Grado Reference Sonata 1 mounted on a VPI Scout II with a JMW-9 tonearm?
    It is more noticeable as the tonearm and cartridge move towards the middle of the record (closer to the motor).
     
  2. sfrost

    sfrost Forum Resident

    Location:
    NJ
    Probably not, check with VPI since they have sold their tables with Grado cartridges in the past.
     
  3. rebellovw

    rebellovw Forum Resident

    Location:
    hell
    I had a very slight hum with my Grado Reference Master (pictured) on my VPI Classic - wasn't too bad - not noticeable at all when music was playing - only noticeable during queuing. I'm using the high quality VPI interconnect cables.
     
  4. 500Homeruns

    500Homeruns Peaceful Punk Thread Starter

    Location:
    Lehigh Valley, PA
    So, you are saying that the interconnects I have (Audioquest Evergreen) running from the Scout to the phono preamp may help with the hum?
    I will experiment with some different interconnects, but the only ones I have on hand are cheaper than the current ones that are hooked up now.
     
  5. Jack Flannery

    Jack Flannery Forum Resident

    Location:
    Houston, TX
    I gave the Statement Sonata. Zero hum. Sorry to hear about your difficulty.
     
    500Homeruns likes this.
  6. Rega TT's are notorious for not playing well with Grado cartridges, and as I found out after I purchased my Oracle, neither are they. Real bummer as I'm a huge fan of the Grado wood bodies. I'm surprised you're having an issue with your VPI TT/Arm combo for the reason already mentioned by @sfrost . I've had an issue with hum which was caused by the tonearm wiring. The connection within the junction box (?) where you attach your phono cable was faulty.
     
    McLover and rogertheshrubber like this.
  7. KT88

    KT88 Senior Member

    Hum caused by proximity of a cartridge to a motoer and by tonearm wiring / grounding are two entirely separate issues. It could be that the OP has both and the wiring may cause a slight but not bothersome hum, as does the unshielded cartridge picking up EMI from the motor, and it is oly the additive levels of both that make it bothersome for him. Hard to say from here. If his arm is quiet with a different cartridge, then it is only the cartridge that is causing that, and indeed there is no real cure. Just use a different cartridge.

    I have used Grado cartridges many times on Rega tables and while the cartridges do pick up some small amount of EMI from the motor, it is very low level, so low that it really is only noticeable when cuing or during silent portions of the groove. Customers have actually laughed out loud when they heard it in action, commenting "You mean that is what I read people complaining about?!...". So it is so low in many systems that only the most critical would consider it to be an issue. On some other tables, I suppose it could be worse.
    -Bill
     
    500Homeruns likes this.
  8. I'm guessing then that most are over-exaggerating the issue then? The hum with my Oracle/Grado combo wasn't severe, but bothersome enough that I went with another cartridge.
     
  9. 500Homeruns

    500Homeruns Peaceful Punk Thread Starter

    Location:
    Lehigh Valley, PA
    OK. Just finished trying a few different interconnects and it hasn't changed anything.
    I also tried plugging the turntable directly into the wall outlet instead of my Panamax power conditioner. Still have the hum.
    At this point, I don't think it's a deal breaker. I really like the sound of the Grado in my setup. It has that nice, warm Grado sound. Plus, I am not picking up a ton of surface noise I was getting with the Ortofon 2M Black I had before this.
    I'm going to keep trying some different things and see what happens. Also try and get the VTA dialed in (I know that won't help with hum).
     
  10. KT88

    KT88 Senior Member

    More likely just repeating crap that they read on the internet, without any personal experience... or being the OCD type, flipping out over nothing. The audio boards are filled with these types.
    -Bill
     
    500Homeruns and Johnny Vinyl like this.
  11. rogertheshrubber

    rogertheshrubber Senior Member

    Location:
    Freehold, NJ, USA!
    My Grado Gold hummed on both my Rega Planar 2 (original) and my VPI Jr/RB 300 'tables. No problem when used on my Dual 505-2.

    Was it a lot of hum, was it a little hum? Bottom line is that it was an UNACCEPTABLE amount of hum - after a while it's all you listen for! I tried all types of shielding tricks to solve this but no luck.

    So the "Grado hum" is not an internet fable - please add my testimony to the official record!
     
  12. RiCat

    RiCat Forum Resident

    Location:
    CT, USA
    Is the hum present when the TT is not plugged in? And I am constantly amazed that "a little hum" is accepted by so many vinyl users. With such a variety of gear available why anyone would select pairings that are not optimized to work together is something I do not understand. It is not OCD or any other behavior disorder to expect things you buy often at expensive price points to work properly.
     
  13. 500Homeruns

    500Homeruns Peaceful Punk Thread Starter

    Location:
    Lehigh Valley, PA
    It is when the motor is turned on and the platter is rotating.
     
  14. KT88

    KT88 Senior Member

    I think the motor has to be on and that it's the magnetic field generated that interferes with the Grado carts. Tables with metal platters might provide better shielding between the motor and an unshielded cartridge. It's been a while since I had one installed and gave it a serious listen. I have installed many on many Rega decks over the years though; other decks as well. The reason that people buy the Grado cartridges despite having some slight hum is that they otherwise sound very good, better to those listeners than some other choices, which are more well shielded and which do not have any hum. Moving coils for instance, are silent on the Rega decks, where the Grados will have some slight hum present. The fact remains that they sound different, with or without hum and any hum is so low in level that they find it inaudible when any music is actually playing. So they choose the cartridge sound they prefer regardless of whether they have any noise when at idle.

    OCD is a factor that does weigh in on this. It isn't always the case of course, that someone simply chooses a different cartridge because of OCD, but it happens as does many other odd choices they make based upon any suspicion of any fault as they just can't deal with it. Other people are more at ease and can enjoy listening to records without some crazy ritual they have to go through before and after each disc spins. I don't use the Grado carts on my Rega tables either, but I have heard various combinations of them many times and so can vouch for the noise being very low. So much so that I have had many customers laugh at the thought of another choice when they like the Grado sound so much. To each their own there. I prefer a LOMC for my personal tables. But I'm not so opposed to great sound that I can't tolerate a little tiny bit of noise to get it. Same goes for tube amps vs SS amps. A tube system might have a bit more noise from the speaker when the system is at idle and if you get up close and listen for it, but if you can't hear it when playing music and the tube system sounds better when listening to music, then you'll understand why so many people choose them despite their several shortcomings. Record playback always includes some noise, surface noise, some old records might have some ticks and pops, some new ones too. If there were not people who could overlook those faults to enjoy the other benefits that the medium affords, then there would be no vinyl revival, nor even any vinyl fans aside from collectors after the introduction of the CD.

    My favorite story about the Grado on a Rega table is thus: I had a customer who came in and listened to several table / cartridge combinations that I had one day and the one that he liked for performance and budget turned out to be a Rega that I had installed a Grado Platinum cartridge on. While it did have a tiny bit of hum when you swung the arm over the record all the way to the end, near the label, it really didn't have any noticeable at the beginning or middle of the Lp and the noise at the end was so low in level that once the needle was dropped onto the record, it became inaudible. So the guy bought the combo and was listening to records and enjoying his great sound at his home with a business colleague of his who was equally impressed. So much so, that this other fellow came in a week later and ordered the exact same set-up as his colleague had bought. That is a 100% true story. So, you see, not everyone bases everything they know on what someone types on the internet, but by real experiences and their decisions are personal ones, not yours, nor mine to make. I would have been happy to have sold the fellow a different cartridge or a completely different set-up, but that is what he chose after listening to several options, all of which sounded nice in their own way. Analog sound really is so imperfect that every set-up sounds a bit different, no matter how good the systems are. It's these differences and this personal choice that makes system matching so important for people who are really interested in the best sound and want to buy separate components to achieve that. They can match whatever speaker to whatever amp and feed it with whatever cartridge they choose. So amazed or not, it happens every day and the people who make these choices are not in the least bit sorry nor are they misled. They have heard the options and made their own personal selections which makes them feel closest to the music that they love. You and I don't have to listen to their systems, and they don't have to listen to ours. I clearly would not belittle your choice of food at a restaurant where I could make my own choices. That's why they servve red and white wine, white and dark meat, chocolate and vanilla desserts.
    -Bill
     
    Apesbrain and 500Homeruns like this.
  15. libertycaps

    libertycaps Forum Resident

    Location:
    Portland, OR, USA
    But can you get rid of that Dinah-Moe Humm ?!? :nyah:
     
    gregorya and KT88 like this.
  16. KT88

    KT88 Senior Member

    Oh yeah... just need to work out your angles. ;)
    -Bill
     
    500Homeruns likes this.
  17. 500Homeruns

    500Homeruns Peaceful Punk Thread Starter

    Location:
    Lehigh Valley, PA
    Bill,
    I hope you don't mind, but I sent you a PM.
     
  18. dachada

    dachada Senior Member

    Location:
    FL
    Phono-pre with balanced input will be the best solution
     
  19. 500Homeruns

    500Homeruns Peaceful Punk Thread Starter

    Location:
    Lehigh Valley, PA
    Thanks, but I am not changing my phono preamp at this time.
     
  20. libertycaps

    libertycaps Forum Resident

    Location:
    Portland, OR, USA
    My Grado Gold1 sounds fab and hum free with my Denon DP-47F. Dynaco MKIII amplification.
    /2 pence
     
  21. KT88

    KT88 Senior Member

    No problem. You can also call whenever you'd like to discuss something. It's always more efficient and productive.
    -Bill
    (540)387-5050
     
    500Homeruns likes this.
  22. RoyalScam

    RoyalScam Luckless Pedestrian

    I had a Grado Red on a Denon DP-DJ151 and a Technics SL-1200mk2. Both exhibited hum. The only way I was able to eliminate it was to switch to an AT-440mLa. YMMV.
     
  23. 500Homeruns

    500Homeruns Peaceful Punk Thread Starter

    Location:
    Lehigh Valley, PA
    I want to thank everyone who posted and tried to help (especially you Bill).
    I have to say that I am embarrassed to admit that I had the electrical connections to the back of the cartridge messed up. Don't ask me how I did that, but now that they are correct, the hum is gone.
    I am very happy with the way the Grado sounds in my system and I am glad I figured out that I was the problem. Not the cartridge. :hide:
     
    dolsey01, morinix and H8SLKC like this.
  24. libertycaps

    libertycaps Forum Resident

    Location:
    Portland, OR, USA
    Awesome, brother in audio! We've all been there. It ain't a sprint. It's a marathon. :thumbsup:
     
    500Homeruns likes this.
  25. You are a true gentleman for admitting this faux pas. It can happen to anyone! Once I went to a posh house of a Grammy winning post production audio mixer in Brentwood with a million dollar view of Santa Monica Bay only to find he had done just what you did. Also had a call just last week with the same scenario.

    I got a free Thorens TD165 a few years ago with well oxidized tone wire clips on the removable headshell. My wife looked over my shoulder and said "those look pretty dirty". I said "yes they do but they work just fine and this is a nothing special Shure cart.". She forced me to get a clean set. I put them on and sarcastically said "happy now". I drop the needle and had to eat big time crow! :hide: The sound was definitely more resolving!:faint:
     
    500Homeruns likes this.
Thread Status:
Not open for further replies.

Share This Page

molar-endocrine