Elvis Presley - The Albums and Singles Thread pt2 The Sixties

Discussion in 'Music Corner' started by mark winstanley, Oct 7, 2018.

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  1. czeskleba

    czeskleba Senior Member

    Location:
    Seattle
    Considering Speedway is the last soundstage recording, perhaps someone DID say something. It's notable that from here on, Elvis's soundtracks became significantly better in sound and material. Remember that the recording of Speedway predates the Guitar Man sessions (from which Mine originated),
     
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  2. shanebrown

    shanebrown Forum Resident

    Location:
    Norfolk, UK
    I'm not sure it says much - you would expect singers to create a vocal piecemeal now.
     
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  3. shanebrown

    shanebrown Forum Resident

    Location:
    Norfolk, UK
    But the point here is that Elvis films were not big-budget motion pictures, and Elvis had rarely had major co-stars from the beginning. That includes the likes of Walter Matthau in King Creole who had dozens of TV roles prior to that movie, but you could count the major film roles on the fingers of one hand. The same is true of Juliet Prowse, who had only had one film before G I Blues, and Carolyn Jones who had mostly worked in TV too (and soon went back to it). The suggestion that this was a new thing, and the reason why the films "felt like TV," during the 1964-7 period is nonsense. The reason for the change in look and feel is entirely due to directors (as I pointed out earlier) and not co-stars.

    As for Stanwyck, she had not yet made the transition from film to TV, and was only doing short guest appearances on TV shows at the time of Roustabout, and both she and critics fully expected a third act for her film career after Walk on the Wild Side (and quite right too, after all she had seen her contemporaries Bette Davis and Joan Crawford get back into major roles). It was on The Big Valley, over a year after Roustabout, that she made the transition.
     
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  4. RSteven

    RSteven Forum Resident

    Location:
    Brookings, Oregon
    Yes indeed and that was my father's biggest beef with Parker that he would not secure a better budget and a better director for most of Elvis's movies. Its funny too how things kind of come around full circle in Hollywood. I now think a lot of the great writing and directing is going on in television as opposed to the movies during the last few years. I am thinking of shows like Breaking Bad, Justified, Longmire and The Americans, which seem far superior to me with regard to writing and directing than the CGI dominated movies that are produced these days.
     
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  5. I really enjoy the album Nancy & Lee, although I’m sure most of that is Lee’s doing. Still, he brought out the best in her.
     
  6. RSteven

    RSteven Forum Resident

    Location:
    Brookings, Oregon
    The duets with Lee are great and there is an SACD available with most of her best stuff on it that has great sound to my ears, but there is some disagreement on whether is is a legitimately licensed release or not. It was produced in Germany and released in Japan IIRC.
     
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  7. Dave112

    Dave112 Forum Resident

    Location:
    South Carolina
    I liked her duets with Lee on my compilation CD so I will definitely need to check those out. Thanks!
     
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  8. NumberEight

    NumberEight Came too late and stayed too long

    This is now. That was then. :)
     
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  9. RSteven

    RSteven Forum Resident

    Location:
    Brookings, Oregon
    Some Velvet Morning is a bit of a mind bender is it not, but I love it?
     
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  10. shanebrown

    shanebrown Forum Resident

    Location:
    Norfolk, UK
    My point is that it doesn't make someone any more or less of a singer - and that's providing the story is true and not something of a myth or exaggeration, or some misinterpretation of the facts.

    Another site says she needed twenty-five takes before there was enough usable material with which to compile a master. That isn't the same as saying that material from 25 takes were used (as Wikipedia states) just merely that a splice from take 25 and one other was used. It's no different to Elvis needing 40 takes to compile a master for Doncha Think It's Time, for example.
     
  11. If they did use a combination of 25 vocal edits, they did an amazing job splicing them altogether as I certainly don't hear that many when I listen closely on headphones! Taking away the instrumental intro, that would be an edit occurring on average, what, every four seconds? Seems highly unlikely to me.
     
  12. shanebrown

    shanebrown Forum Resident

    Location:
    Norfolk, UK
    As I said in my edited post (which might have crossed over with yours), the use of 25 takes isn't really credible. And the telling of the story on the songfacts website that they needed twenty-five takes before they could splice it together (from several of those 25 takes) makes far more sense.

    The song itself is only 2:48, and 30 seconds of that doesn't even feature Sinatra. Material from twenty-five takes would require approximately 5 seconds of material per take. It's a ridiculous story, clearly misunderstood by the writer of the Wikipedia article.

    On top of all this, Nancy Sinatra was doing the whole session under the watchful eye of movie execs, journalists and reporters, which can hardly have helped.
     
  13. NumberEight

    NumberEight Came too late and stayed too long

    According to Geoff Leonard and Pete Walker's liner notes to the 2007 4-CD John Barry compilation Themependium (where I first came across the cut and paste story):

    "[Nancy Sinatra's] trepidation over getting the job was borne out in the studio bu way of numerous nervous and tentative performances. Barry secured the perfect master by cutting and pasting the best parts from a number of takes."

    No mention of 25 takes, but it certainly doesn't sound as if only a couple of edit pieces were spliced in.
     
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  14. SKATTERBRANE

    SKATTERBRANE Forum Resident

    Location:
    Tucson, AZ
    Do you know how much a "lost" Elvis song would be worth? I think that is why there are so many fake attempts. There have been more than a few "lost Elvis" recordings appearing on YouTube in hopes that Sony (RCA/BMG) buys the tape for a fortune. I recall one recently "discovered" tape from the 50s. But if anyone comes up with the stereo masters for Follow That Dream or the Binaural safety tapes for King Creole, they will probably see a significant windfall.
     
    Last edited: Apr 13, 2019
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  15. czeskleba

    czeskleba Senior Member

    Location:
    Seattle
    Well, you're engaging in something of a straw man argument here, because I never said that Elvis's co-stars were the sole reason his mid-60s films felt like TV shows. In fact, my original comment was "Elvis's 1964-67 movies feel like nothing so much as mid-60s TV shows. The cheapness of the sets, the overall feel and direction, and the fact that his co-stars (if they were known at all) were TV stars rather than movie stars." So I did acknowledge that direction was a factor, as you've emphasized.

    In his earlier films, Elvis had some co-stars who were solely known as film actors at the time they worked with him: Debra Paget, Lizabeth Scott, Mickey Shaughnessy, Juliet Prowse (despite her limited body of work), Hope Lange, Ursula Andress, and Ann-Margret come to mind. In the 1964-67 period, he didn't have any co-stars who were solely known as film actors (Barbara Stanwyck had made the transition from film to TV at that point, having guested on several TV shows and starred in the short-lived Barbara Stanwyck Show in 1960). Going from occasionally working with film stars to not working with them at all IS a change. It may not be a major change, but it is a change. We know that after Viva Las Vegas there was a conscious decision to cut the budgets of Elvis films, and it stands to reason this had an effect on who they could get to co-star with him.
     
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  16. czeskleba

    czeskleba Senior Member

    Location:
    Seattle
    How much attention do you think that song would receive on youtube if it was not being passed off as Elvis? It's all about attracting viewers.
     
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  17. MaestroDavros

    MaestroDavros Forum Resident

    Location:
    D.C. Metro Area
    Count me in as a fan of this song, in spite of the RTS similarities. Great feel and harmonies by The Jordinaires.
     
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  18. shanebrown

    shanebrown Forum Resident

    Location:
    Norfolk, UK
    It doesn't say that's not the case either. A "number" could easily mean three or four - especially when you take into account that the backing track was recorded separately. Elvis was no stranger to using three or four different takes, looped endings, or workpart endings.

    The original mention of the way this song was put together was done to try and undermine Nancy Sinatra as a singer, and whether this song was made up of two, twenty, or two hundred takes, to base such a conclusion on one song seems prejudiced at best.
     
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  19. Funky54

    Funky54 Coat Hangers do not sound good

  20. NumberEight

    NumberEight Came too late and stayed too long

    You’re misreading my intentions. While reading the posts in this thread commenting on her not-so-stellar voice, I was reminded of what I’d read about her recording of You Only Live Twice and shared it on this thread because I thought it would be of interest to other members. I have no particular axe to grind.
     
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  21. :drool:
     
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  22. Brian Mc

    Brian Mc Member

    Location:
    Denver, CO
    Just ran across this video on YouTube where the lyricist of "It's Now or Never", Aaron Schroeder, appeared on the game show To Tell the Truth. Nothing revealing and not more than several seconds of him speaking, but I figured it may be of interest to some Elvis fans.
     
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  23. Dave112

    Dave112 Forum Resident

    Location:
    South Carolina
    I really like that one and Something Stupid with her dad. That era of Frank's music is my favorite anyway.
     
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  24. EPA4368

    EPA4368 Forum Resident

    Location:
    Sacramento CA
    Agree, but I'd say, they brought the best out of each other. Too bad, can't say the same for her and Elvis. I don't recall Speedway helping her career, but probably the opposite. Believe me, DJs were not prejudice, they criticized both equally.

    Also agree, if she wasn't Franks' daughter, she probably wouldn't have made it, but so what? I give her a ton of credit for recording "Boots" and keeping in mind, this was back in '66. From wiki..."Lee intended to record the song himself, saying that "it's not really a girl's song", but Nancy talked him out of it"

     
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  25. mark winstanley

    mark winstanley Certified dinosaur, who likes physical product Thread Starter

    Goin' Home
    Written By :
    Joy Byers

    Recorded :

    RCA's Studio B, Nashville, January 15-17, 1968 : January 16, 1968. take 30

    We start with a pulsing beat and then move into a song that is a song of sentimentality for a home land, that is obviously the US. I actually really like this track, it sounds different to the other tracks for some reason that I can't quite put my finger on. It is a travelogue much more than a traditional lyric it seems, but for me it works.

     
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