Endless Defective Brand New Vinyl

Discussion in 'Marketplace Discussions' started by Talisman954, Sep 4, 2017.

  1. Porkpie

    Porkpie Forum Resident

    Location:
    UK
    I had no idea what you guys were referring to, then I checked "show ignored content" :laugh: (that's why we have an ignore button, make good use of it!)
     
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  2. Porkpie

    Porkpie Forum Resident

    Location:
    UK
    Obviously vinyl is not a faultless medium, one of the reasons so many switched over to CDs, but accepting that, how much "fault" are you happy to live with?

    I don't particularly mind light surface noise or crackle on older vinyl or slight warps with any vinyl (so long as it doesn't affect playback) but with modern vinyl non-fill drives me mad and once I've heard it I can't unhear it each time I play that track. I've returned faulty vinyl and in most cases the replacement has been fine (only a couple times did I give up completely and get a refund - one of Lana Del Rey's albums I tried 3 copies before giving up).

    I would be careful though returning endless amounts of vinyl to Amazon, I've read about people getting their accounts shut down because of the amount of returned items (not just vinyl).
     
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  3. Classicrock

    Classicrock Senior Member

    Location:
    South West, UK.
    I've twice had emails asking why I have returned so many items. Honest reply has stopped further action for a while. I think high value items may trigger action being taken as I recently returned/exchanged 3 faulty box sets. Unfortunately first record I buy after they accepted my explanation was another dud that was so bad it had to go back.
     
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  4. Porkpie

    Porkpie Forum Resident

    Location:
    UK
    That's bad luck and unfortunately the problem with vinyl. If it is faulty you have a choice, keep something that cost upwards of £20 that doesn't play great (knowing you could have got the CD for £10 or under) or risk the wrath of Amazon. I guess from their point where do they draw the line between people with genuinely faulty products and those who are just being anal with an unrealistic expectation of vinyl's performance. The problem is, once you've had a great pressing that's well mastered, you can't help but demand that of other new records even though they're getting pressed at some questionable plants. Maybe Amazon and other retailers should threaten to stop carrying stock from known offending pressing plants until the QC improves. Not gonna happen but would be nice to see.
     
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  5. Classicrock

    Classicrock Senior Member

    Location:
    South West, UK.
    The problem is the bad ones I get are really bad with a click running through one track for instance. I learnt to live with the odd pop and crackle 45 years ago. My criteria for returning a record as faulty is pretty much the same now as it was then (when quality was in fact rather patchy). I also think people have the right to be picky if they splash near £400 on a big box set.
     
  6. Porkpie

    Porkpie Forum Resident

    Location:
    UK
    Absolutely. I return albums if there’s non-fill or, as you say, a constant click/scratch running throughout a track (it’s always on a quiet track too)
     
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  7. Danby Delight

    Danby Delight Forum Resident

    Location:
    Boston
    Skips, stuck grooves, and warps that affect playability are right out, but apparently I just lead a blessed life or something when it comes to new vinyl, because those things basically never happen to me. The last new LP I had to return was a copy of Alvvays' Antisocialites that basically had a giant thumbprint or something that had damaged the record right out of the press and then cooled into a gouge. Replaced it without a problem through Amazon. Previous to that, I'd had to return two copies of The Pacific Age by OMD before giving up and just buying the cassette, in 1986, and a copy of Joy Division's Still with a massive scratch across side three in 1983. Three LPs out of the literally thousands of new LPs I've bought since 1974 is not a bad percentage at all.

    But like an occasional pop or tick? A tiny bit of edge warp that tracks fine regardless? A split-second of non-fill noise? A slightly off center spindle hole that doesn't cause pitch problems? Nah. Not bothered.

    I've even seen people get bent out of shape here because an LP arrived in the mail with a small ding on one corner of the sleeve. All I can say to that is never look at the LP stacks in my house, where decades of cats have lived: your OCD will send you round the bend.
     
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  8. Porkpie

    Porkpie Forum Resident

    Location:
    UK
    I’ve also never had a record skip, ever, but I do clean vinyl (new or old) before I play it so there’s no dirt for the stylus to catch on. I’ve also not noticed any issues with any of my records being off-centred. The worst issue is just lousy pressings, I tried 2 copies of Vampire Weekend’s debut album but the entire record was constant crackle so stuck with the CD. The subsequent 2 albums though sound great on vinyl.
     
  9. Danby Delight

    Danby Delight Forum Resident

    Location:
    Boston
    Very occasionally, I'll get a used record that skips even after a thorough cleaning. I just throw it straight in the garbage. Life's too short, and there are other copies out there.
     
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  10. Jrr

    Jrr Forum Resident

    Non-fill is where I have a zero tolerance policy. No excuse for that and even a little of it takes me completely out of the recording. However, I will put up with a certain amount of most other types of defects because, as you rightly said, it isn’t a perfect medium. And yes, one has to be a little careful about going overboard with Amazon returns. I order a lot of items for my business and I cannot get banned over a record not playing correctly. That said, I did go through a period where I felt I was pressing my luck. I probably returned five in a four week period. I called them and of course they are not going to tell people what the metrics are, but I was told in my case I wasn’t even close. But bear in mind I spend a few thousand dollars some months on a huge variety of products so in my case it might be the other way around, ie, they aren’t going to dump a good customer over a few records coming back when I do keep most of them. I suspect they watch both what is returned, why, and do you order another copy? Someone buying albums and returning a lot but not ordering a replacement copy likely looks like a “rental” customer and they aren’t in that business and will likely cut you off. If you order one or two more after returning a defective, I think they are likely to think you are indeed exchanging it for a better copy. Clearly you could still game the system, but I think a little common sense is likely used. I have heard if you do get banned, it’s virtually impossible to get your account reopened, which tells me they do look closely and must feel pretty confident you are abusing their return policy. So, don’t worry about it but don’t be stupid either and return a lot of albums simply because you didn’t like it.
     
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  11. Jrr

    Jrr Forum Resident

    OCD people should not get into vinyl imo! In fact, I own a business and if I suspect a person has a fairly high level of OCD in them, I pass on their business. We simply don’t have the time for that.
     
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  12. That's a lot of lost business, in this forum alone! :D Seriously though, you are quite right. OCD and LP do not go together.
     
    willboy likes this.
  13. richbdd01

    richbdd01 Forum Resident

    Location:
    London
    A business will much prefer someone who says ‘yeah, i love the surface noise and pops...its what makes records sound more authentic. Have you got any coloured vinyl in stock that i can put on my wall cos it skips on my Crosley’ :laugh:
     
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  14. mark winstanley

    mark winstanley Certified dinosaur, who likes physical product

    i stopped buying vinyl due to annoyance at it being less of a product than i got back in the day ....
    i sometimes wonder if that is merely an illusion in my mind, and from years of listening to cd's, sacd's, dvd-a's, bluray a's etc but i honestly feel it is not up to the standard that i used to get. i will probably keep the couple of hundred i bought, but i'm not buying any more.
     
    Talisman954 likes this.
  15. Classicrock

    Classicrock Senior Member

    Location:
    South West, UK.
    I'm beginning to think too much vinyl is aimed at the people who don't have a record player, put it on the wall and download the Mp3 code supplied. It means only half of potential purchasers will play it and the 5% that are audiophiles are only ones likely to return a bad copy. Returns must be low otherwise they would give up pressing and retailers would stick to other formats. Based on my own experience serious faults (not surface noise or isolated pops) are running at at least 20%.
     
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  16. I consider "dished" LP's and warps, however small, a "serious fault" but given that nearly EVERY new LP I've ordered during the past decade has been dished to some degree I've kind of given up on the idea of returning them. I mean, what's the point? As Dylan said "I used to care but things have changed". I prefer CD's again.

    BTW, you're extremely lucky with only 20% faults. I'm closer to 95%. I can't even recall the last LP I bought new which was perfectly flat on both sides.



     
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  17. nosliw

    nosliw Delivering parcels throughout Teyvat! Meow~!

    Location:
    Ottawa, ON, Canada
    It's also possible that some people that buy new records and spin them on really low-end junk players but think that skips, pops and clicks are 100% inherit (or baked in altogether) to the medium.
     
  18. Classicrock

    Classicrock Senior Member

    Location:
    South West, UK.
    I don't think many are perfectly flat if you are going to include that criteria. Serious warps or dishes I do return. Most minor dishes can be clamped or some mats take up the slack to a degree. I can usually feel if a disc is dished before taking out of the inner sleeve but some end up sitting flat on the TT even if they look wrong. I just don't get many bad warps but loads with audible scratches of late. Optimal are the worst culprit in this respect followed by MPO.
     
  19. Jrr

    Jrr Forum Resident

    Warped records are the one issue I almost never have. I’m surprised how many come perfectly flat considering that many sit in hot mail trucks as they travel to the mailbox. In the early on line days I really didn’t think that was going to fly, assuming so many records would warp. There are so many elements out of the mfg hands once it leaves the plant. If nothing else, some sit on a porch for hours and the sun could be hitting it. I guess it’s not a serious issue though.
     
  20. Talisman954

    Talisman954 Forum Resident Thread Starter

    I have had so much good luck lately with vinyl.
    Including the brand new japan half speed masters, and Genesis calling all stations and We can’t dance both very quiet and issue free.
    Last few days my good luck ended with T.REX Gold 2 lp from Demon records.
    This is a brand new release.
    First one arrived from Amazon factory sealed and I could see the vinyl looked scuffed,and not perfect but this rarely impacts playback.
    This vinyl played back with so many crackles , so much surface noise and is really a poor pressing considering it’s $30.
    I ordered a replacement which arrived today, OMG it was 10 times worse, huge knife like scratches on the vinyl, and all tracks are horrid for surface noise.
    Since I last posted here I’ve had maybe 60 pieces of vinyl, and all of it for the most part has been perfect,or near perfect.
    I have contacted Demon records, so we will see what they have to say about this brand new release.
     
  21. Tullman

    Tullman Senior Member

    Location:
    Boston MA
    My Analog Spark Brubeck Goes to College, has a very noisy track three side one. If fact, all of side one is unacceptable. Needs to be returned.:realmad:
     
  22. Danby Delight

    Danby Delight Forum Resident

    Location:
    Boston
    As a matter of fact, my lifetime record went up to 4 returns this afternoon: side three of the new Lemon Twigs had two big skips. Getting a replacement from Amazon on Thursday and there's a brick and mortar Amazon pickup/dropoff -location a block from my gym. Walk in with the LP, print a return label at the kiosk, stick it and the record in a bag and hand it to the guy at the counter. Couldn't be simpler.
     
    Talisman954 likes this.
  23. Dolemite

    Dolemite Forum Resident

    Location:
    Chicago
    New vinyl has made me realize dynaflex is more audiophile than 180 gram
     
  24. rstamberg

    rstamberg Senior Member

    Location:
    Riverside, CT
    I haven’t had many brand new records shipped to me that arrived in bad shape in the past few years. It’s the abum covers that often incur any damage. lol
     
    Talisman954 likes this.
  25. Talisman954

    Talisman954 Forum Resident Thread Starter

    Yeah lately that’s been my experience too.
    Out of curiosity do you send back damaged artwork? Or do you keep it.
    My findings lately is Abbey Road stuff tends to be magnificent.
    Silent, great audio, and the certificate inside.
    I think the Depeche Mode Vinyl and the Queen greatest hits volume 1 and 2 have been my worst.
    Overall though I’m way happier than when I started this thread.
     

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