"Enemies of Classical Music".

I find it rather odd that I don't hear jazz of classical music blasting 3 blocks up the street like I do some other genres of music. (The city council had to pass an ordinance to eliminate this type of behavior due to the massive complaints from residents).
Maybe, in my eyes; it comes down to how you 'use' music. Do you want to get all strung out on it (with the help of substances; do you want everyone else to hear it ( you can't because your hearing is going down the drain), or do you sit in your car or home and listen to it sensibly?
I do think, if not some smarts is an issue, then certainly common sense is an issue

 

Maybe if we let some of the worst remastering engineers near all of those classical recordings, you will be able to hear it (once in a while) from three blocks away because it will no longer have any dynamic range. Of course you still wouldn't hear it as often as rock or rap because far fewer people listen to it.

 

syogusr,

I believe that some who blast their rock or rap music so that others can hear is a mere act of aggression. It is not a common sense issue. It is the same as attempting to force an opinion on others. Playing loud music can be a form of youthful rebellion.

Others just may like it loud! The worse their hearing gets, the louder they will have to play it to gain the same effect. Their loss...

These same people could also argue that the "community" is trying to force their code of behavior on them.

You have to look at both sides of the issue.

 

I have to admit that I sometimes feel that my favorite types of music do not get the exposure or appreciation that other types of music enjoy. I 'll bet that most of you secretly feel that way as well. I can understand why many classical music lovers feel upset because it is not the dominant musical style it once enjoyed. I didn't like when 90s country music was dominant or that hip-hop is now dominant, but I have to accept that the culture changes from time to time. Many of us wish the music styles would return to what they were in the 60s and 70s, and even the 80s, but that won't happen.

 

How about if we put it this way? Intelligent and educated people are more likely to seek out art that inspires and challenges the intellect. In the case of music, that will usually be classical.

It is still true that some smart people can love Little Richard while dumb people can love Strauss.
Some rock lovers are prejudiced against classical, while some classical lovers are prejudiced against rock.
I believe that a larger portion of classical lovers will be of a more intellectual bent than will rock lovers. I don't have empirical evidence.
John

 

There is pleanty of jazz and rock music that will challenge the intellect. Could it be that many classical music lovers are narrowly focused, or biased against other forms of music in favor of classical?

 

And, again, why is it assummed that people who listen to classical are more intelligent, unless it is believed that intelligent people listen to classical music?

 

Agreed.

Yes. Bias comes in all genres.

 

Who is making that assumption? I haven't seen evidence on this thread, though you are right that some people do.

 

Yes, indeed it is a common sense issue, most people see it that way, do you want to be awakened at 2 am, because some ***** deems fit to 'force' his garbage on the sleeping public? If that is common sense, it is at it's lowest level. Could it be that that is some of the reasons that things are screwed up? I, and most; believe so. But, then again, these people believe they can do whatever the hell they feel like doing. Right? Right!

As far as the community force their code of behavior, yes, we must live by rules and regs. like it or not. Believe me, I have been served several citations for loud music, and the neighbor also happened to like P. Floyd, but not when he was sleeping! BTW, I am not blasting rock music, but the music that is more prevalent among the young. And thank God, that rock is still king as far as sales go, it just isn't tops when it comes down to 'Top 40'. But, who listens to top 40 anymore?
Ah, such was the day

 

With all due respect, and don't take this the wrong way, you sound like an old man!

Maybe there IS the issue of respect. Maybe they just never think about the volume of the music when they roll through a neighborhood at night. I will say that many kids and twentysomethings *may* not have a sense of respect that you and I *may* have. I will not try to read all young people's minds or guess their intent. We don't know that all of them feel like doing whatever the hell they wish.

"Garbage" is all a matter of opinion. I may like what the person blasts through his stereo, but I really don't want to hear it at 2AM when i'm trying to sleep, and it is happening more in my area lately.

Many younger people are listening to current top 40. Remember, we aren't the gatekeepers of musical taste. No one is.

 

Classical and it's fans are ridiculed in society. Watch a sitcom with a classical fan and you'll see them stereotyped as some pansy assed outcast or a blowhard rich snob. I recently saw some brain dead sitcom (the one and ONLY time I watched it) where some hockey fans were forced to attend an opera to impress the boss. Ha ha, funny stuff. Steve made a passing reference to film scores. How many self professed classical haters get all tingly when they hear the Star Wars theme? How many millions bought the Titanic CD? How many children are soaking in every microsecond of the Harry Potter movies? Isn't this music based on "classical" concepts?

Maybe it's the fact that for most classical you HAVE to pay attention. You get lost otherwise. A movie score works with the action on the screen. A rock concert makes you dance (at least it should!). And jazz music makes half the crowd yammer on and on about worthless crap and drink themselves sick while the true fans and musicians somehow manage to ignore their sorry asses .
A classical fan must shut up and listen. It takes "work" I guess.

But that doesn't explain the image problem that classical has. Is classical "old" and "unhip" music made by "dead white guys"? Does that make it irrelevant?
As irrelevant as any fine painting 'cause it's not a state of the art digital photo or multimedia extravaganza?!

Dan C

 

Maybe I do, and I am damn proud of it, and also much wiser.

 

Great post, Dan. I saw that sitcom episode too.

As I recall from my college Ed. Psych. course some 35 years ago, the typical television non-news program was (and probably still is) geared for the 10-year-old intelllect. This, no doubt, partially explains why programs that make the viewer think get cancelled so quickly.

IMO, it is irrelevant that the hoi polloi consider classical music irrelevant to them. As with nearly all aspects of my own life, I tend to choose what music interests me without regard to what others think about it, as I suspect you do.

 

About the only thing I watch anymore is news, the Discovery channel, ER, and sometimes TV Land/Nick at nite.

...as it should be for all. I never allowed peer pressure to influence what music I liked. But then, i've always been at odds with the majority of any group i've been in where music is concerned.

 

Great post, Dan! I never saw the show you mention. I have no idea what the premise of the show is, either.

As far as actually paying attention to music, I don't know anyone anymore who can sit through any music without doing something else. It's sad, too. I can't blame MTV or any television. I blame the dimminishing importance that out society has placed on music, in general. It is nothing more than background music to most. Me, I never do much more than read while listening to music, if anything.

I think classical music's image does have a lot to do with the aggressive snobbishness of it's fans. I'm wondering if it is just a coincidence that the stereotypical image of the average fan is usually the rich older white male. Where did this come from?

 

Has anyone noticed how much easier it is to sit through a live music performance than it is to listen to a record or (especially because they're longer) CD all the way through?

I'd like to propose a cease-fire or moratorium on these silly stereotypical characterizations of fans of any kind of music. Although the inflexible longhair mentality does exist there is no such thing as the typical classical music fan, or for that matter typical classical music. Would you rock fans like to be called dumb young drug-addled males?

 

They often are!

I don't know if you understand my point, and I think I forgot to include a word for clarity, but my point was that stereotypes are ridiculous! I just wonder why stereotypes let people guide their preferences. That's all. I don't think there is anything wrong with disscussing these sterotypes. Through discussion, I believe we can break some of them down.

I can sit through a recording just as easily as through a live performance. But that's just me.

 

There you go again, with 'they often are'. If you want to make the point that stereotypes are ridiculous, say it up front and stop using them. I have no idea what you mean by breaking them down through discussion, (do you mean using satire?) and I don't know what you mean by saying you 'wonder why stereotypes let people guide their preferences'. Are you saying that your preferences in music are affected by what you see as the steretypical image of an audience for that music? In other words 'Hey, snobbish intellectual rich white guy, that's not me. Better avoid that Beethoven string quartet'. I certainly don't get that sense from the rest of your posts, but nonetheless you're either saying it about other people, which is again a gross and incorrect generalization, or about yourself.

Finally, this thread started out as a discussion of what's happening to the audience for classical music and who might be behind it. Certainly cutting government subsidies of the arts will have a negative effect on the ability of classical artists to perform and record. But are the 'enemies of classical music' identified on Mr. Tepper's site really responsible for preventing classical music from being heard and appreciated? I think they're only part of the problem. But if there is no audience for the music why are we grieving its demise? As I said before, if you care about classical music get out to some concerts and buy some recordings. The last time I looked there were plenty of both available.