Enzyme Cleaners specifically for LPs...Really?

This is good to know. I was just talking about this cleaning process the other day with friends. Honestly, most people think it's nonsense but it makes me feel comfortable and the 3-step makes a big difference on old dirty records. New viny can be cleaned in a 2-step process with no sleep lost.

I don't think I've ever used the #15. I've been using the Enzymatic as my pre cleaner. I guess this is something else to note.

 

Thank you very much for your input, as well as the others who have contributed to my question. I will have to check out this link to the ultra-pure water in bulk. I have always questioned the prices these companies are charging for small amounts of ultra-pure rinse. I will have to give this a try

 

I was just looking at the Ultrapure reagent grade water at the link recommended. Unfortunately, the product has a government restriction in place and cannot be delivered to a residential address...commercial/business address only.

 

Right. I am having it shipped to my office.

 

I think the emphasis on ultrapure water here is a bit too much. Just go buy a sixpack of Aquafina which has been distilled 4x.

It's not surgery friends.

 

Maybe it is overkill, but it's my precious & irreplaceable vinyl collection. Nothing's too good for it.

 

I will use VinylZyme (recommended by the US distributor of Loricraft) on vinyl that doesn't get quiet with my DiscDoctor Miracle/deionized water. Or on records that are filthy, but more often vinyl I buy is at least VG+ and visually clean.

Adding the VinylZyme has worked in getting noisy vinyl quieter on a number of occasions. It has also failed to work, but I suspect this is due to poor vinyl formulation.

VinylZyme reading with some electron microscope photos: http://www.smartdevicesinc.com/buggtussel.html

 

Nothing goes on my records that stays there. It may seem like a good idea now, but check back in 20 years when the sleeve sticks to the record because that awesome treatment congealed with age.

 

Fair enough. Do what makes you happy, but there is the budget Aquafina path.

 

I'm not sure what you mean? The enzyme will be vacuumed off with the cleaning fluid followed by water rinse/vacuum. It says that in the link.

 

I am always after the "best bang for the buck" so to speak. If Aquifina bottled water works well for you, I am willing to try that before laying down the extra cash for ultrapure water. Don't get me wrong, I love my vinyl collection...but if there is only a minute difference between Aquifina and Ultrapure, I will choose Aquifina. One thing is for sure, the conveniece and savings are impossible to beat. I don't have any cleaning fluid other that AI No.6 one-step at the moment, but I'm gonna go buy some Aquifina and try doing a second "rinsing" step today. Maybe I will be able to tell a difference.

 

Try it. Been using it for about a year or so from when I first learned of it from a Fremer column in Stereophile. Seems to work well for me. I'd rather spend the money on the enzyme cleaners as I have learned they have the biggest impact on sound quality.

 

I have a different perspective on it I guess.

I paid $50 for 5 gals. of purified water that should last for 1000-1500 records or more. That's the price of one Music Matters Blue Note reissue minus the cost of the bargain AquaFina. It's really a very small price to pay for that kind of piece of mind, knowing I'm giving my records the best care, records I expect to provide me enjoyment and entertainment in my retirement.

 

I guess I didn't read carefully enough. I was assuming the spray stayed on the record.

 

There is a substantial difference between something like Aquafina and an ultrapure or reagent grade water. The reasons behind ultrapure being an aggressive solvent essentially make it not fit (in large amounts) for human consumption, unlike Aquafina which is filled with all kinds of impurities that reduce its ability as a solvent. Some people have found that it makes a pretty significant difference.

http://forum.audiogon.com/cgi-bin/fr.pl?eanlg&1200956062&read&keyw&zzlive+audio

Certainly reasonably inexpensive if buying in bulk. My experience is that high purity water is at least as important if not moreso than the first detergent/surfactant/enzyme based stage of cleaning. There's a reason that the best commercial record cleaning products use ultrapure as their final stage. I'm just not enamoured with what they charge for it.

 

I've been using Aquafina rather than distilled water and found the differences to be negligible. Aquafina is more convenient for me than buying a gallon of distilled water and way more convenient than buying 5 gallons of something would be. I don't doubt that the ultra pure/scientific waters would be good...I'm just not willing to pay the price that record care companies charge and really don't have the room to store anything in bulk.

After reading here that several people use a second water rinse I gave it a try and found that a second rinse helped some (and I figure it can't hurt) so I've incorporated a second rinse into my routine.

 

Big skeptic here on the enzyme front. They just take too much time to work. A few years ago I did some research on enzymes for cleaners. I got samples of some of the fastest acting ones and the current starch enzymes for ethanol production are state of the art. I think 15-20 minutes was a minimum, I forget, but it certainly wasn't 2 minutes.

That said, it's quite possible the other ingredients in the record cleaners make it a good product that works. I'm just sayin about record cleaners with enzymes, the actually work and benefit directly from the enzymes doesn't really make a lot of sense unless your soaking the records for a long time. And if that's the case, you are also absorbing water into the vinyl. Cleaning records with water should be fast imo.

 

Not to argue but they only take 60-120 seconds to work in my process. I have tried a variety of things excluding enzymes but when I started using the enzyme cleaners from Audio Intelligent and Mofi did my records sound their best. It was noticeable.

 

Audio Intelligent says their enzyme cleaners used to take 5-20 mins, but they recommend you don't need more than 2-5 mins for the latest AIVS formulations. I use 2 min. for each step of my 3/4 step AIVS process. That has worked very well for me.

BTW: I ordered that Reagant 1 water from the link provide yesterday and I got an email from my company to say it arrived at the office today.

 

My experience with AIVS is that their suggestion of 2-5 minutes is off a bit as I find the enzyme will start evaporating at around 3 minutes so I have settled on 2 minutes or a little less. Seems to work in any event.

 

I use a medical grade enzymatic cleaner, Steris. In the hospital setting this is used in an ultrasonic, with a 15-20 minute submersion. I try to keep it on the lp for at least 5 minutes, preferably 10-15. This requires repeated applications due to evaporation. I have tried 2-3 but the improvement is minute. 10-15 big difference. After 4+ years I have yet to have an lp damaged by the process.

My regimen,
1. Put lp on GEM dandy clone and apply steam, then spray with the enzyme/de-ionized water solution. Let set 10-15min.
2. Rinse both sides of lp with filtered slightly warm tap water using the GEM high pressure hose.
3. Spray lp with DIY cleaning fluid.
4. Rinse both sides of lp, going from run-in grooves to run-out, then back to run-in.
5. Take the lp to the Spin-Clean, filled with distilled water and half solution, give it the cursory spins in both directions.
6. Vacuum both sides on DIY vacuum.

For new lp's I only do 3, 4, 5 & 6.

 

I like the AIVS #15 in that it is a combination first stage cleaner utilizing both enzymes and detergents.

With relatively clean records I'll let it soak 3-5 minutes; with really filthy records or records that warrant a 2nd cleaning I'll increase the soak time. Really extreme cases like water damaged records with mold and deteriorated paper liners stuck to the vinyl might get a 15 minute soak time. I clean records in my basement, which has an average humidity level of about 45% year round so evaporation problems don't really exist here. If the record has a thin, but thorough and complete coating of fluid (I use carbon fibre brushes for this-they're very effective and not wasteful in terms of this kind of application) I rarely have to add more fluid.

No question that increased soak time will give improved results.

An interesting article on the AIVS products here:

http://www.theaudiobeat.com/equipment/aivs_products_print.htm

 

What vacuum machine do you use?

 

With the Step 1 Enzyme, I used to leave it on for about 15-20 minutes. If it started to dry up, I would cut the session short. It seemed to work really well on used vinyl. I now leave it on for 5 minutes and the results seem similar. When I do the Enzyme, I hand clean seperately (not on the RCM) and soak up (pat dry) with a 100% cotton tshirt. Once both sides have the Step 1treatment, I then put it on the RCM. Clean both sides with the Super Clean about 30-60 seconds per side and then a double rinse for about 30-60 seconds a each rinse.

Most people think all these step are a little OCD. It's hard for me to disagree but it gives me piece of mind. I do think the Enzyme works. It's harder for me to defend the "Super" water. I'm sure Aquafina is fine. Some people use sink water when cleaning records and seem to be happy.

 

I use a KAB EV-1 with a Filter Queen attached to it.