Experience with today's hi-end integrated amplifiers?

My claim was no more and no less than the observation, in hindsight, that amplification wasn't doing justice to a speakers potential. That's been my experience. The change in sound has not been subtle by any definition. Time and again over several upgrades, including power conditioning, which is truly something special.

 

You can't know what your speakers will sound like with far better pre and power amplification. You can accept that and yet still have a blast. No one is in a rush to do anything.

 

Nice! Had you framed it that way I could have easily agreed. I do however think there are products (within any price category) that punch above their weight. Some do this significantly more than others and I can appreciate not wanting to invest further in amplification given that circumstance. My opinion is that I have such an integrated, but I would never rule out something else. Unfortunately, financials don't allow me that possible consideration.

 

SoundstageUltra-PA3100HV

Curious about the list price today in Germany(in EUR). Tend to think US is too high even taking shipping and import fees into account. Anyone?

 

“She who must be obeyed.” It picked up notoriety with Rumpole of the Bailey.

 

There is a clone of a darTZeel NHB-108 amp that someone really likes. if i was in the market i would think about it....

Recieved my darTZeel NHB-108 copy from China

 

Which shouldn't be needed with a $10K integrated IMO.

 

But that’s what I did when I auditioned them, and the shop (in Taipei) was powering them with some unapproachably expensive gear!
Still, there’s little question that an ugrade using one of the aforementioned integrateds will be an improvement over what I have now. How much of an improvement is the real question!

 

Consider Solution Audio.

High end, stunning finish. Price tag to match. Series 7 for the niche enthusiast. Series 5 for the keen player.

Either way, fabulous equipment. Depends how much skin you want to put in the game if you're serious...

 

Soulution has been mentioned in first post. Contenders for anyone seeking an all out assault on integrated amplification. I'm serious about learning from those who've chosen to pass on separates. Such an interesting market these days. Never thought a one time afterthought or stepping stone would rise to such preeminence.

 

Not sure I agree with that. Too many variables come into play.

 

I strongly disagree as well. Those seeking to listen to something other than the sound of mains will need a Shunyata Denali, Audience aR, Audioquest, or similar. Steve has some pricey electronics, not to "appeal to authority", and he's got a thread on his favorite power line treatment. I sure am looking forward to a power cord upgrade as soon as I can pull the trigger!

 

It's called a floating ground design. Simple, cheap, and more effective than any power conditioning device.

 

Spending a lot or not so much, it seems to make sense that the quality build of an integrated by a quality audio amp and preamp maker would sound as good, or more likely better than the same amp and preamp by the builder sold as separates due to that short path hard wiring.
There really are a ton of choices out there lately, The Rogue Audio Pharoah is a tube pre and class D amp combined that gets very good reviews. I went for a Belles Aria integrated made by Dave Belles at Power Modules mainly because although I know I really like what tubes do, I wanted to try something really well done in solid state that sounds really good and avoid the whole hobbyist aspect that go with the tube equipment. More to the point I went ss because of the low maintenance aspect and the Stereophile review got me started when the reviewer said the Aria basically had the sound of a good tube amp with the muscle of ss (or something to that effect). They make Aria pre and amp separates as well as phono stage and mono amps, they also make a powerhouse integrated called the Virtuoso.
Dave Belles has a long history making this stuff and the people who gave feedback on the Aria really had a lot of positives to say, so that was good enough for me. The phono stage on this thing only has a few spins on it and it already sounds extremely good, overall I only have maybe 30 hrs on it and everyone says it takes about 250hrs to get to where you can judge -but it sounds fine and I am extremely pleased. I got it built and shipped for 1800 which is really a good deal.
I should add that I have had some nice separates in the past, I used to have this amazing sounding preamp that was I think an old Audionics of Oregon design with a separate power box that really sounded nice (phono stage went so it got tossed -really stupid) with their 70 watt amp (early eighties stuff), I still have two of their amps that work fine and a later preamp (I think this one has that floating ground...) that has had the balance circuit cut out of it and no tone controls. I also used to have and like a Yamaha integrated in the late eighties that I liked. More recently I have actually enjoyed listening to a Pioneer SX780 receiver from the seventies that I got for twenty dollars at a garage sale.

 

At the extremes, though, separates will be less compromised. Practically speaking, from what is possible at cost no object, it makes sense. There will be a hefty price to pay. If something along the lines of the Gryphon or T+A integrated deliver 80% of their very best separates effort (state of the art world class) at half the price, then some of us might start to dream.

If I was confident that the PA 3100 HV would deliver only a small upgrade over my separates, then I'd arrange for it and end this curiosity. I'm not taking that chance.

Speaking of chances, who among the Shunyata Denali deniers will arrange to demo one? Off topic, so let's kill this here. The brave can hit the existing Denali thread.

 

I also have faith that the makers of these integrateds have chosen the correct combination of components that provide the right symmetry, eliminating the very real possibility of mismatched separates.
How many audiophiles have mucked up the potential of an amp/pre by pairing it with the “wrong partner”?

 

I was reading in that thread not long ago about Steve's fave power treatment stuff. I know someone personally who really is an audio and general electronics master who was teaching the stuff at Columbia college awhile back and I recently re-connected with him, so I want to grill him about this stuff (he'll start making charts with strange engineering symbols on dry erase board...) because I really don't know anything about it other than it is a good idea to get clean and constant power to your equipment and hopefully safeguard from lightening strikes or whatnot.
In this very building when I first moved here back in the nineties I remember a brown out of some kind ruining someones fancy TV, but the building went condo and the old wiring service from the outside going in and through and through was all gutted and redone so it all seems hunky dory since.
Not a denier, and I have heard of Shunyata. I don't know what the Denali is, but I wouldn't mind demoing a cord to see if there's a difference, I hear these mostly help source equipment, but amps may suffer SQ...I don't know.

 

Probably true in general, but I would think that would be determined on a case by case basis, say the amp and pre are the exact same circuit topography as a integrated or standalone but since they will do separates then they might add to the separates whatever they can and for whatever reason to possibly offer extra. Who knows -the short signal path beats the heck out of $600 cables in my book.
In general audio is a funny business and it awes me that hi end makers can basically just be doing what's right to the best of their abilities with regards to building a piece of equipment and either spit out Lamborghini-esque priced stuff, or figure out how to get it into a saner price bracket by sending away for cheap labor. Yet some achieve almost the same result all hand built but maybe not as furniture pretty boxes and sensible pricing.
It would be interesting to see which companies in this field of manufacturing have high levels of customer satisfaction and profit.

 

Perreaux D255i would be another on the shortlist. £7k but it should be good if anything like its predecessor.

 

I have heard this one... fantastic amp with great dynamics and lots of power at the bottom. The finish could be better compared to other brands.

 

Thanks!

It's my impression that the Gryphon is an upgrade from this Pass and that the PA 3100 HV will be favored over that by those who appreciate the qualities of sound that "high voltage" deliver.

Do please report back if you have additional thoughts or experiences.

 

Anyone have any experience with the VAC Sigma 160i /160i SE? What is the MSRP on this?

 

Gryphon Diablo 300 review

"If you still think yourself smarter at navigating the hifi mine field of poor choices for all manner of sub-optimal combinations, you plainly haven't suffered enough from what our intro called temtation: too much waste of endless trials, errors, money and time."

 

Base price is $14,000 (from Absolute Sound 2015)

I'm definitely planning to move away from valves, but it will be interesting to get some comparisons. Is there better value in tube designs? Can we even use the word "value" at $12,000 to $25,000!?

 

I couldn't, but then...it's all relative.