"Ford v. Ferrari" Film staring Matt Damon and Christian Bale - due out Nov 15 2019

Discussion in 'Visual Arts' started by Juan Matus, Jun 3, 2019.

  1. Juan Matus

    Juan Matus Reformed Audiophile Thread Starter

    This looks decent. Plus it's one of my favorite looking cars of all time.

    Ford v Ferrari (titled Le Mans '66 in the UK) is an upcoming action biographical drama film co-written and directed by James Mangold. It stars Matt Damon and Christian Bale, while Caitriona Balfe, Noah Jupe, Tracy Letts and Jon Bernthal appears in supporting roles.[2] The film follows an eccentric, determined team of American engineers and designers, led by automotive visionary Carroll Shelby and his British driver, Ken Miles, who are dispatched by Henry Ford II and Lee Iacocca with the mission of building from scratch the Ford GT40, a new racing car with the potential to finally defeat the perennially dominant Ferrari at the 1966 24 Hours of Le Mans race in France.

    It is scheduled to be released on November 15, 2019, by Walt Disney Studios Motion Pictures under the 20th Century Fox banner.

  2. longdist01

    longdist01 Forum Resident

    Chicago, IL USA
    Thanks for sharing...looks interesting for upcoming films this Winter
  3. We spoke about this movie tonight at our car club meeting.
    Upper Midwest Shelby American Automobile Club (UMRSAAC)
    The general feel is one of anticipation because...hey we are car guys, and this subject is directly in our cross hairs.

    We also talked about some hearsay concerning what some of the Ford family has said.
    Basically they will not be watching the movie because it deviates too much from what really happened.

    The subject has been pretty well documented.
    There are already movies, books, live video from the era, as well as personal accounts from those directly involved.
    If you want to know the story it has already been told. You just have to know where to look.

    I am looking forward to the movie, but I also understand it may not be historically honest and I don't like that one bit.

    The real story is pretty dang good, when told as it happened.
    Kyhl and showtaper like this.
  4. tommy-thewho

    tommy-thewho Forum Resident

    detroit, mi
    Can't wait!!

    Love a good racing movie.
  5. StuJM84

    StuJM84 Forum Resident

    Kent, UK
    I love motorsport and have a real thing for motorsport of the 60s and 70s. But I don't feel the need to watch this, probably as pointed out, if it deviates too far from the facts then its a real annoyance. Besides, the actual truth is already so dramatic, exciting and tragic that it doesn't need any fantasy added to it. That said, if it does pay fitting tribute to Ken Miles then it cant be a bad thing. The guy was denied his place in the pages of history by Henry Ford II in his **** up trying to stage a dead heat at Le Mans, and his death later denied him a chance to have what he really deserved, a win at The 24 Heure du Mans.

    I'd really recommend the book "Go Like Hell" as the go to written account of Ford/Ferrai battles of the 60s, a amazing page turner.
  6. Bingo Bongo

    Bingo Bongo Music gives me Eargasms

    Haven't seen a good race movie since RUSH! That was exciting!
  7. LeBon Bush

    LeBon Bush Hound of Love

    And before that, you could argue the last good racing movie had been Le Mans (1971). I L-O-V-E Le Mans, have watched that film countless times, so I'm really excited about Ford v. Ferrari. Let's hope it

    a.) focuses on the racing battle without unneccessary relationship/romance sideplots
    b.) uses as little CGI as possible by today's standards. Of course they'll do some, because racing such cars for the sake of a film's authenticity would never be greenlighted today, but here's hoping it'll at least feel credible for the audience. Rush was very good in that regard, in my opinion.

    Edit: now that I've seen the trailer, I'm REALLY hooked! Looks and sounds fantastic :righton:
  8. StuJM84

    StuJM84 Forum Resident

    Kent, UK
    Grand Prix remains the best film for driving, bar none. Leave the plot to one side, the fact that the actors are driving mid 60s Formula 2 cars (mocked up to look like F1 cars, but just as dangerous) and driven on the tracks in the calendar and starring actual drivers too is something that will never happen again. They even got Phil Hill driving in the actual F1 races to get camera footage of races including the infamous Belgian GP of that year.

    Le Mans comes a close 2nd and it does have the best racecar of all-time as the star, the mighty Porsche 917K. Derek Bell says in his book about taking evasive action whilst driving very quickly to miss a nutter lying with a camera in the middle of the Porsche curves, went to report it to Steve McQueen, only to find out it was him on the track!
  9. Hardy Melville

    Hardy Melville Forum Resident

    New York
    Ftr I don't think Matt Damon looks much like Carroll Shelby.[​IMG]

    I guess that's not a big deal.

    More to the point I am sure the film will show the Ford guys as heroes. But it's a bit more complicated than that.

    The story is the whole battle started when Ford along with other American manufacturers swore off racing in the late fifties. But GM, in particular Chevy, went in the direction of developing the Corvette as a serious road racer that others could race privately. At some point Henry Ford II decided he wanted to get back into racing. Ferrari dominated especially GT racing in the early sixties, and so Ford came up with the idea of buying Ferrari. While Ferrari's ultimate refusal is portrayed as leading Ford to take Ferrari on in frustration, I think Enzo Ferrari's decision was right since Ford wanted him to give up control of Ferrari's racing program as part of the deal. (For a side story on this, read about the involvement of Bizzarini in Ferrari Racing.)

    Ford's initial program was poised to go after the Le Mans race in 64, but they obviously were not ready and all Ford entrants suffered mechanical failures. This led them to hire Shelby to run the program. While I personally think Shelby was a great car guy who got it done in 66 (not to mention his involvement in great cars like the Cobra and the Mustang GT350), his strategy was basically to bludgeon Ferrari into losing. At the 66 race Ferrari entered 2 cars, neither of which finished. Ford entered 8, with 7 engines in reserve.

    It will also be interesting to see if the film adds the PS, that being that in less than year, specifically the 1967 Daytona 24 hour, the result was this:


    Ferrari's 1-2-3 finish in that American GT race.
  10. Hardy Melville

    Hardy Melville Forum Resident

    New York
    I also prefer Grand Prix to Le Mans as a car film as much as I like the latter film. The sound and photography are superior. I find the first 20-25 minutes or so of that film as intense as any I can think of. And it's really a great cast even if the love affair between Yves Montand and Eva Marie Saint gets a bit too much emphasis.
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  11. StuJM84

    StuJM84 Forum Resident

    Kent, UK
    @Hardy Melville Enzo Ferrari allegedly used Ford (and Henry Ford II) into believing he'd sell Ferrari to them as leverage to get more money from the Fiat group, whom he always intended to sell to. The intent to sell to Ford was never genuine. Henry didn't enjoy being a pawn in that move.

    And those 330s are a thing of beauty!
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  12. Hardy Melville

    Hardy Melville Forum Resident

    New York
    Yeah, I've heard that story, too. But I never heard it refuted that Henry Ford II wanted Ford to have overall control of Ferrari Racing.

    And yes, the Ferrari P3/4 was perhaps the most beautiful race car ever. It was the model for the first Ferrari Dino (imo).
    DavidD likes this.
  13. Dave Garrett

    Dave Garrett Forum Resident

    Houston, TX
    Apparently Fox originally bought the rights to "Go Like Hell" with the intent of basing this movie on it, but wound up selling the rights to another production company who is adapting it as a TV series.

    I have the same reservations that have previously been expressed here about the film after having watched the trailer, namely, that it will take liberties with the facts in the service of "enhancing" the drama. Not necessary, but I doubt most people who aren't historically-minded gearheads will know the difference.

    Also, the use of "Gimme Shelter" in the trailer grates - I don't see Scorsese's name on the movie, and as the song wasn't released until 1969, it's not contemporaneous with the years the film is presumably focused on.
    Last edited: Jun 4, 2019
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  14. Ghostworld

    Ghostworld Forum Resident

    Sounds like a winner to me except for the title which sounds Like a cheesy Hong -Kong action thriller.
    SandAndGlass likes this.
  15. soundboy

    soundboy Senior Member

    "Go Like Hell"....any relationship to the Dodge Omni GLH (Goes Like Hell)? It was a very fast 80s "hot hatch" tuned by Shelby.
  16. While your story is right, the way you tell it makes it sound as though Henry II knowingly did it TO Ken, and that is not the case.
    They did not know about Ken's "loss" until after the FIA stated the case.

    Never the less, had Henry II not staged the 1, 2, 3, side by side finish Ken Miles would have won the 24 Hours of Daytona, 12 Hours of Sebring and 24 Hours of LeMans...A lofty feat in a career, let alone one racing season like Ken was set to do.

    As it was, the three wide finish was a middle finger to Enzo Ferrari, and the FIA, who had done so many things in an attempt to keep Ford from beating the coveted Ferrari's...As well as proof the Americans can race, and win, at LeMans.
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  17. StuJM84

    StuJM84 Forum Resident

    Kent, UK
    yes, sorry i didnt intend it to be that HF II intended to screw over his drivers which i know was never the case. But it was a misunderstanding on his part (and i guess those around him) about how Le Mans worked back then in distance covered and not 1st across the line. I understand that the idea was only dreamed up near the finale when it was apparent a 1-2-3 was possible and so was never planned. Still, it "robbed" Ken Miles & Denny Hulme of that victory. And Ferrari have never won there since*

    *overall victory.
    Kyhl likes this.
  18. Great and thanks for the clarification.
    The whole 1,2,3, 1966 LeMans finish mess was the culmination of many events happening at just the right time with emotions and elation piled on for good measure.

    Somehow I think this is actually better for the legacy of Ken Miles.
    Had he won 1st place at LeMans in 1966, he would be in the record books and having won the triple crown...and subsequently forgotten by all except those who are really into this history.
    Instead, due directly to the odd finish that caused Ken to lose the triple crown distinction, Ken is often talked about and remembered specifically because of this foul up in a minuscule rule.

    The FIA instituted the distance rule (including exact position at the start due to the "LeMans start" of the time) as a means to help break any ties that could arise.
    Because an actual tie is so unbelievably rare during a 24 hour race such as LeMans the exact distance portion, up until the 1966 finish anyway, was pretty much ignored.
    Last edited: Jun 5, 2019
  19. Dave Garrett

    Dave Garrett Forum Resident

    Houston, TX
    Tim Considine has just published a massive three-volume book on the topic of Americans racing at Le Mans. It’s quite expensive, but early reviews have been very positive, and it may well wind up being the last word on the subject.

    Twice Around the Clock: The Yanks at Le Mans
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  20. Burt

    Burt Forum Resident

    Kirkwood, MO
    The truth is Enzo would have probably sold to Ford because Ford was much more world wide in its resources and had a lot more engineering and manufacturing capacity than Fiat. Henry the Deuce had married an Italian woman and wanted to impress her and his bureaucrats did a crummy job of dealing with the fickle Ferrari. Ford would have given him manufacturing resources he otherwise didn't have-such as ferrous metal forgings, access to better electricals than Marelli Magneti, and computer time on systems better than anything then in Europe which was just emerging as a decisive factor in winning race car design.

    America was, then, the big time and no European magnate could resist the idea of going over there and here as opposed to just in Europe. It's no secret Enzo wanted to add Indianapolis to his trophy room and to do it with a car completely of his own design rather than putting a Ferrari engine into a Kurtis or Watson chassis. But he wasn't going to give up F1 or sports cars to do it and he didn't have the money for all three.

    Still, although I plan to see the movie, it's clear Mangold had no interest in telling the story quite accurately. He's not a car guy and the speech he gave with the actors I saw on YouTube made that clear.

    The movie makes it seem as though Ford's beating Ferrari one time was a triumph of the human spirit and all that balderdash when in fact Ford was the overdog who threw cubic money and man-hours and outside bought technology (the Ford GT is really not a Ford at all, but a Lola) into beating up on a tough but vastly smaller competitor.
  21. The Panda

    The Panda Forum Mutant

    Marple, PA, USA
    We both read the book and loved it, very well written. But if this bastardizes the book, we will pass.
    I thought the thrust of the book was all these disparate people being thrown together somehow made the whole thing happen. Yea, it was a great achievement in such a short time, but it was a classic meshing of tech (Ford Engineers) and the guts of the drivers (the paper on the car).
  22. Chazro

    Chazro Forum Resident

    West Palm Bch, Fl.
    Ive seen a lot of racing/driving movies but none of them impacted me as much as Grand Prix! Haven't seen it in decades, so now I'm wondering whether nostalgia's coming into play. Not a movie that's seen
    on television very often (more like never!). Looking forward to seeing Bale & Damon work together!
  23. StuJM84

    StuJM84 Forum Resident

    Kent, UK
    The opening 20minutes of Grand Prix is pure cinematic joy, the cars, the noise, those Saul Bass edits. Amazing. I can take it or leave it with the plot, but seeing those 60s f1 stars along side James Garner and Co makes it worthwhile, as does all the race footage.

    On Ford Vs Ferrari (or the lame Le Mans 66 here in the UK), if they start taking creative liberties with the facts, then I'll pass. The story of what happened is exciting enough, just stick to the facts.
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  24. Ben Sinise

    Ben Sinise Forum Reticent

    That's my take on it too, the GT40 and the Cobra were reworked British cars from Lola and AC.
    To me the real American hero car is the Daytona Coupe, that's the one that took the fight to Ferrari and slayed them in the GT class.
    It should have been the series winner in 1964 but old Enzo, loveable cheat that he was, orchestrated the cancellation of the last race in Italy to stitch up the title by the barest of margins.

  25. Humbuster

    Humbuster Big hat, no cattle

    Le Mans is one of my top 5 movies.
    Really looking forward to this new one.
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