Full range single driver open baffle fans

Discussion in 'Audio Hardware' started by okc_craft, Nov 25, 2020.

  1. BKphoto

    BKphoto JazzAllDay

    Why can’t you use a passive crossover and a single amp instead of an amp per pair of drivers it seems....?
     
  2. okc_craft

    okc_craft It All Matters Thread Starter

    Location:
    Okc
    I definitely could, and I plan to design one for my single 15” baffles. The beauty of an active system for this is the quick adjustments I can make, and since there aren’t a whole lot of OB kits on the market I am somewhat flying blind with my designs. I do acknowledge that most people don’t need the hassle or expense of 4 amps...
     
    BKphoto likes this.
  3. phred

    phred Forum Resident

    I like OBs - everyone should open their minds and have a listen to a reasonable pair.

    Personally would use a good modern compression driver for the mids/top ( modern compression drivers go surprisingly low) use a 15"/18" low frequency driver
    Offset the drivers and have the low frequency driver close to the floor for a little bass boost.
    Use an electronic cross over with room correction to sort the frequency response.

    Have a browse at the RCF catalogue (there are plenty of other driver suppliers about) they have a lot of information about their various drivers response curves.
     
  4. okc_craft

    okc_craft It All Matters Thread Starter

    Location:
    Okc
    I believe Spatial were using a compression driver a compression driver in their design for a while, I’ll have to look into that. Active is a great way to control these speakers, I have yet to run any room correction yet, but the easy control the dsp gives you over the drivers is fantastic.
     
  5. Kray

    Kray Sleuthing

    Location:
    Sarasota
    Finally got the OB's built by a friend... he's a woodworker and first attempt at it... I'd say he did an amazing job. Solid walnut here. He's interested in doing more if anyone else is interested (PM me)

    They are different sounding than the Omega Super Alnico's, but I've been playing around with positioning, which they sound different everywhere they are at... but this near field setup is pretty sweet.

    [​IMG]
     
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  6. okc_craft

    okc_craft It All Matters Thread Starter

    Location:
    Okc
    They look fantastic!!! Those are the F15s correct... Do they cover the high frequencies well? I’ve been extremely happy with my Lii drivers, and they continue to get better with play.
     
  7. Kray

    Kray Sleuthing

    Location:
    Sarasota
    thanks! Yes the F15’s. They only have about 50hrs on them. Heard they need a lot. Trying not to fully evaluate until I get some time on them but they sound different in every spot a place them. Haha. But so far the further out in the room the better. I may play with tilt too.
     
  8. okc_craft

    okc_craft It All Matters Thread Starter

    Location:
    Okc
    Yes, get them as far into the room as possible, and I would think some tilt would go a long way. I used thread inserts and spikes to tilt mine once I had an idea of how much I needed. I agree that placement is everything.
     
    Kray likes this.
  9. okc_craft

    okc_craft It All Matters Thread Starter

    Location:
    Okc
    I’ve been tweaking a pair of OB speakers since I started this thread last year. I’ve had a couple different configurations and multiple passive and active crossovers. I have finally decided on something I love and am building a permanent set of baffles. The baffles up till now have been built from scraps of material mostly meant to test different ideas, but the new ones will be built with a bit of effort put into isolation of every component as best as I can. I am using MDF for the entire build with some additional joinery to shore up any weak areas. I also plan to use sorbothane washers between all of the baffle and crossover box attachments.
    [​IMG]
    [​IMG]
    [​IMG]
     
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  10. avanti1960

    avanti1960 Forum Resident

    Location:
    Chicago metro, USA
    very nice! Bet they sound wonderful.
    No crossovers needed?
    As a fan of big box BBC monitors like your Rogers, do I want to try the OBs?
     
  11. okc_craft

    okc_craft It All Matters Thread Starter

    Location:
    Okc
    That particular iteration of my open baffles was an active crossover. It’s a fantastic way to do open baffle, lets you put a little bump in the bottom end, but I couldn’t get past having a dsp in my signal path. I now run a simple 1st order crossover but still biamp the speakers.

    The sound of the speakers is really nice, very transparent, and a very large soundstage. The full range driver are crossed over at 240hz, so they have that pinpoint imaging going on. The sound is something that I really enjoy, it has a lot of finesse, but not a lot of muscle. The Rogers are good, but I prefer the presentation of the OB better. One thing I have become very sensitive to after living with the open baffles is exaggerated base, and I occasionally get that from my Rogers, but it has been a while since I listened to them in my listening room they primarily live in my family room now. I was in someone else’s room yesterday that was way beyond my financial situation, he was running Focal Sopra 3s, and while the sound was amazing I felt like the bass was obscuring some of the details that I was used to hearing in my system. I don’t know if it was his room or my sensitivity to bass, the room was well treated though; walls, ceiling, and bass traps.
     
    avanti1960 likes this.
  12. okc_craft

    okc_craft It All Matters Thread Starter

    Location:
    Okc
    Giant strides towards a complete set of speakers
    [​IMG] .
     
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  13. okc_craft

    okc_craft It All Matters Thread Starter

    Location:
    Okc
    For continuities sake I thought I should post a picture of the complete open baffle speaker journey here, though I already shared in the pictures of your rooms thread. I am extremely happy with this design so far, and it definitely is pleasing to my ears in my room. I have now started to play with a pair of dedicated open baffle subs ( for lack of a better description) using 4 15” Acoustic Elegance dipole drivers. I hope to have a working proof of concept in a few days.
    [​IMG]
     
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  14. okc_craft

    okc_craft It All Matters Thread Starter

    Location:
    Okc
    I have fallen further down the rabbit hole. Pulled my 2 SVS SB1000 in favor of H frame cabinets with 4 Acoustic Elegance dipole 15s. Running some corrections with a MiniDSP on the subs only I am pretty flat to 30hz and still playing down to 20hz fairly well.
    [​IMG]
    [​IMG]
     
  15. Michael.g

    Michael.g Member

    Location:
    canada
    Hello, they look amazing. I want to try somwthing similar, where did you find the measurements?
     
  16. mkane

    mkane Strictly Analog

    Location:
    Auburn CA
    Fun thread. I was there once. Enjoy.
     
    okc_craft likes this.
  17. okc_craft

    okc_craft It All Matters Thread Starter

    Location:
    Okc
    For the two ways I based mine off of the Liionidas open baffles. Lii audio has a Facebook group that has the plans there. For the barrel style I can’t remember where I found those dimensions, possibly on the Decware forum where they have a section for the Betsy baffles.
     
  18. Naka9

    Naka9 music first audiophile

    Location:
    Portugal
    Hi,
    this is an excellent thread, much aligned with my latest project: building a pair of Decware Betsy open baffles, with the WildBurro or the Lii Audio Fast 8 drivers.
    I see that you have a much larger room than mine (just 18 sq meters) but I wonder how did find the Betsy performance on the bass department… and if they deliver the much talked expanded soundstage, one of the open baffle type of speaker’s strength.
    Thanks in advance.
     
  19. okc_craft

    okc_craft It All Matters Thread Starter

    Location:
    Okc
    It’s been a while since I played with those. I remember them sounding very thin though. Soundstage was a lot of fun, but the image accuracy wasn’t as good as a full range driver in an enclosed box. I ultimately ended up with Cube drivers in a Voight pipe style cabinet. It’s ultimately a personal preference, but if you want bass I’d suggest a 2 way open baffle as opposed to the Betsy. What I ended up doing with a 2 way OB suited my needs well. I’d suggest the Lii Silver 8 with a pair of the Lii 15” bass drivers. A simple inductor on the woofer, and a single capacitor with an L pad attenuator on the Silver 8.
     
  20. Naka9

    Naka9 music first audiophile

    Location:
    Portugal
    Thanks for your detailed answer.
    Indeed, thin sounding speakers are not my preference at all, but… my room is small and I have a REL sub, if needed.
    I appreciate your suggestion on the Lii Silver 8 and 15’’ bass drivers but after seeing those units prices I concluded that unfortunately I can’t afford it right now.

    Perhaps a model called “The Betsy and Buck” could mitigate some of the issues you refer, with the addition of a bass driver unit:
    Betsy_and_Buck

    This you had the chance to build one of these?

    [​IMG]
     
  21. okc_craft

    okc_craft It All Matters Thread Starter

    Location:
    Okc
    That would probably improve the bass response, though I have no experience with either of those drivers. The Fast 8 drives from Lii are also pretty good for the price.
     
  22. okc_craft

    okc_craft It All Matters Thread Starter

    Location:
    Okc
    Those are most definitely Lii Audio drivers
     
  23. okc_craft

    okc_craft It All Matters Thread Starter

    Location:
    Okc
    I actually dislike this trend of large single drivers. A 15” driver will have more beaming and less frequency extension. It’s just physics. IMO 8” is the absolute sweet spot for frequency extension at both ends and luscious midrange.
     
    WildPhydeaux likes this.
  24. Chris Dollar

    Chris Dollar New Member

    Location:
    Mexico

    Hi Jim. I realize this posted is a bit dated. But I am interested in your assessment of the bass in this design. How would you describe it? Did you EQ to offset the sensitivity of the Lowther?
     

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