Genesis - Selling England by the Pound on CD: Blind Listening Test

Discussion in 'Music Corner' started by Diablo Griffin, Jun 24, 2019.

  1. Duan

    Duan Well-Known Member

    Location:
    Italy
    I like the clarity of B and the body of D

    At the end B for me (through cheap Creative T20 SII speakers)
     
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  2. The_Windmill

    The_Windmill Forum Resident

    Location:
    Italy
    I don't think I can choose on this one...
    Still tryin'
     
    Last edited: Jul 12, 2019
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  3. Diablo Griffin

    Diablo Griffin Synthpop, City Pop, and Rock Enthusiast Thread Starter

    Location:
    United States
    3 and a half hours to go!
     
  4. The_Windmill

    The_Windmill Forum Resident

    Location:
    Italy
    I tentatively voted D.
    B sounds smiled, and has the same problem discussed before: you gain clarity at the expense of losing body.
    More Fool Me's guitar sounds a little artificial, too.

    All the others have a nice vintage quality to them but their differences don't really matter to me.
    Some sounded off in some passages, none was preferable from start to finish.
    D seems to be the one that has a better balance overall, but I'd take C and maybe even A on another day.
     
  5. Diablo Griffin

    Diablo Griffin Synthpop, City Pop, and Rock Enthusiast Thread Starter

    Location:
    United States
    The more I've listened to these samples, I've gotten the impression that the original UK vinyl would probably slay all of them. Every one of the samples has flaws IMO (A and B are sometimes too bright or thin, C and D have a better balance at the slight expense of clarity). I really wish Barry Diament's remasters could somehow see the light of day. I wonder what happened to them. Perhaps the tapes are still at The Farm and thus they could technically be released?
     
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  6. dubious title

    dubious title Forum Resident

    Location:
    Ontario
    The first UK is one of the better sounding early Genesis LPs. I think with persistence they can be found quite inexpensively. Genesis collectors have benefited from Genesis not being the Beatles, Pink Floyd or Led Zeppelin. Some good variants close to the first pressing as well.
     
  7. Diablo Griffin

    Diablo Griffin Synthpop, City Pop, and Rock Enthusiast Thread Starter

    Location:
    United States
    It's over. :) The results might not seem surprising for this one if you're familiar with Genesis on CD. Here are the sources:

    Sample C = US Atlantic - 10 votes (WINNER)
    Sample D = Virgin/Charisma (Nimbus) - 9 votes
    Sample B = Definitive Edition Remaster - 6 votes
    Sample A = Japanese Black Triangle - 4 votes

    For the third time in a row, the Black Triangle came in last place. Yes, I know the losers were tied for Trespass and ATTWT, but I'll consider the BTs to be in last place since many here don't like them. And for the first time in my Genesis polls, the Definitive Edition did not come in first or second place. I was actually expecting the DE to win TBH. Let's get to the US Atlantic and the Nimbus. The V/C Picture Disc and Sonopress use the Atlantic mastering (though I think they're level-shifted). The Virgin Megastore and Nimbus V/Cs use a different mastering. Both are good, but if you want Sample D's mastering, please try to pay attention to the matrix info so you know what you're getting.

    We reached 29 voters (just 1 off from my predicted 30), so I'll continue making these polls. However, I don't know when to start the next one or what album to do yet. All I know right now is that if I make another Genesis test, it'll be a Phil release. I might even try to do a Yes or Rush album instead to change things up. For Yes, it's definitely going to be one of 'the big three' as those would be relatively easy to do. Not sure about what I'll do with Rush because I think these threads should only have 4 samples at most. Anything more than that is overkill IMO. Hemispheres and Permanent Waves have 5 masterings, while 2112 and Moving Pictures each have 6 unique ones! I would have to lop off at least 2 masterings from them to make the polls stomach-able. Maybe what could work for MP is if I only used the common and easily available CDs, so no Japanese versions or MFSL. Plus I think the MFSL is far too similar to the Anthem/US CD, ditto with the AMCY. I dunno. I'll have to think about what to do for those 4 albums. A Farewell to Kings, Grace Under Pressure thru Presto would be simpler as they have 3 or 4 different versions at most.

    I've gotta give huge thanks to everyone who took the time to participate! I truly appreciate it! If you have any ideas on how I should go about with the Rush albums, or if you have any other suggestions, let me know!
     
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  8. eatandoph

    eatandoph Forum Resident

    Location:
    Minneapolis, MN
    This was fun, Diablo, thanks. I'd be interested in a Duke test. But it might also be interesting to participate with an album I've never heard (e.g., I've never really ventured into Rush territory).
     
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  9. Thievius

    Thievius Forum Resident

    Location:
    Moreno Valley, CA
    Virtual tie between the original Atlantic and V/C. Ya had to know thst was coming. Both fairly good (and un-futzed with) representations of the original recordings. I've actually always preferred the vc to my old lp, just because I never had a top of the line turntable and I'd often get too much distortion and that was eliminated with the cd.

    At any rate, once again - great job on the test, Diablo.
     
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  10. patel kismet

    patel kismet Forum Resident

    Location:
    reunion france
    I'd be interested in a Moving Pictures' test. Duke would be a great test too.
     
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  11. Eleventh Earl of Mar

    Eleventh Earl of Mar Somehow got them all this far.

    Location:
    New York
    I had the Charisma CD.

    Sample D was the only one to really make me think hard, so I guess it's why I assumed it was B, I don't know... but yeah, I'd go for a different artist for the next one. Good job as always.
     
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  12. The_Windmill

    The_Windmill Forum Resident

    Location:
    Italy
    I'm on mobile now and I would read later your posts but... Isn't the DADC mastering missing? Is different from the regular Virgin charisma
     
  13. Diablo Griffin

    Diablo Griffin Synthpop, City Pop, and Rock Enthusiast Thread Starter

    Location:
    United States
  14. krimson

    krimson Forum Resident

    I have a copy of the original UK vinyl and it sounds awful.
     
  15. Front 242 Addict

    Front 242 Addict "I'll drink the moonlight from your hands"

    Location:
    Tel Aviv ,Israel
    Diablo Griffin --Thank you for very interesting test:cool:

    C and D -very close results ,They were most appreciated.

    I voted for C The Atlantic cd but I also said that I also like D ,It turns out that D is Virgin/Charisma (Nimbus) This is a cd that I have and I love(Nimbus) . I also have The Definitive edition cd 1994 which is turns out - B .
     
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  16. Andreas

    Andreas Senior Member

    Location:
    Frankfurt, Germany
    Has it been confirmed that the Austrian picture disc (CASDP 1074 DADC Austria) contains the Atlantic mastering, except different levels? That one is my favorite, it makes sense that I preferred C in this test.
     
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  17. onlyconnect

    onlyconnect The prose and the passion

    Location:
    Winchester, UK
    I’d like to suggest a different format. My problem is that after hearing 4 samples from 4 different songs, I’ve forgotten what song 1 sounded like by the time I am listening to the next set.

    An alternate approach would be to group the samples by song rather than by mastering. So the first FLAC would be Dancing with the moonlight knight A, then B, then C, then D. And so on. Obviously keeping the same order throughout.

    I could have chopped up and reassembled the samples myself I guess, but I’d find that a better format for making the comparison.

    Tim
     
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  18. onlyconnect

    onlyconnect The prose and the passion

    Location:
    Winchester, UK
    My UK vinyl sounds good. It is somewhat low in level because of the length of the sides.

    Tim
     
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  19. The_Windmill

    The_Windmill Forum Resident

    Location:
    Italy
    So the Virgin
    Ok I read your post in full now.
    I was under the impression the DADC was a unique mastering but years ago comparing them I ended up preferring the Nimbus, which Is the same I did here.
    It would seem it was the original sonopress mastering that got used both in USA and in Austria.


    So the megastore CD was not represented in the test?
    Personally, I would prefer any mastering to be presente, even of they are more than four.
    I generally discard progressively the ones I don't like so that wouldn't be a problem to me.
     
  20. Diablo Griffin

    Diablo Griffin Synthpop, City Pop, and Rock Enthusiast Thread Starter

    Location:
    United States
    According to the EAC peaks, the Megastore pressing is identical to the Nimbus. :)
    Version 1
    [Dr. M] - V/C Nimbus : 96.2% - 93.0% - 98.9% - 61.3% - 91.6% - 58.2% - 90.4% - 64.6%
    [And] - V/C Virgin Megastore : 96.2% - 93.0% - 98.9% - 61.3% - 91.6% - 58.2% - 90.4% - 64.6%

    For anyone else who reads the big Genesis CD thread, please don't get the impression that the Black Triangle is the same as the Nimbus. They're different, as this poll showed. I've always thought about making a part 3 with updated info and peaks that were discovered after part 2 began, but I don't know when I'll start.
     
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  21. The_Windmill

    The_Windmill Forum Resident

    Location:
    Italy
    Oh, I see. I misread your post about the megastore CD.
    I generally check that thread but I've been lazy this time.
     
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  22. patel kismet

    patel kismet Forum Resident

    Location:
    reunion france
    Good idea ! In this format, it will be easier to compare the different masterings of the same track . :righton:
     
  23. Diablo Griffin

    Diablo Griffin Synthpop, City Pop, and Rock Enthusiast Thread Starter

    Location:
    United States
    After doing some listening, I've decided that the next blind test will be Rush - Permanent Waves. I'll try out the new method you've suggested and see how it goes.
     
    Last edited: Aug 19, 2019
  24. Mike McMann

    Mike McMann Forum Resident

    Sounds cool Diablo, I'm in.
    Can I also request attaching our names to your thread as this one was.
    Thanks man.
     
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