Discussion on Phillips is sparse already as it is. Let's not pulverize it, poor Ant. New Anthony Phillips double album - Strings of Light Anybody dig Anthony Phillips?
In the light of this year's reunion, I've just listened to Live Over Europe again. It's much better than I remember. While they might be older, the performances are still pretty good, including Phil's vocals, and the set list about as good as you could have expected from the three of them. For me, the fade out is the one flaw with Supper's Ready. That's why I prefer Steve's recent live versions with the extended guitar solo.
Nah, Supper's Ready is preferably with Peter Gabriel singing. Or Phil. I can't stand somebody else singing it who wasn't part of the composition.
Regarding Supper's Ready composition: Interesting that Hackett gets a songwriting credit, but did he actually contribute?
Fair enough, I too generally much performances by the original artists. However, I'm not a great fan of Peter's vocals, though I do recognise the brilliance of some of his lyrics. All versions of Supper's Ready are awesome but I'd really like to hear an instruments-only version.
All the Genesis songs until Peter left were collectively credited -- even "Horizons" which the others obviously had nothing to do with.
There are good ones. You probably mean the unofficial ones that flooded the DVD market for years where usually British music journalists are only stating the obvious. Some of them are on Youtube.
I have this info ( no source, think I found it on this boatd years ago) Supper's Ready: a. Lover's Leap (Banks, Gabriel) b. The Guaranteed Eternal Sanctuary Man (Banks, Gabriel) c. Ikhnaton and Itsacon and Their Band of Merry Men (Rutherford, Banks, Gabriel) d. How Dare I Be So Beautiful? (Gabriel, Banks) e. Willow Farm (Gabriel) f. Apocalypse in 9/8 (featuring the delicious talents of Gabble Ratchet) (Banks, Collins, Rutherford, Gabriel) g. As Sure as Eggs is Eggs (Aching Men's Feet) (Banks, Gabriel)
Actually if you're talking the EARLY years there were two equally dominant writing partnerships: Banks/Gabriel Phillips/Rutherford Over time there was more and more crossover between the two teams (at least in part due to the band jamming that they over time increasingly utilized for composing) until Phillips left. Interestingly prior to Phillips (and Mayhew) leaving all songs were credited equally four ways: Banks/Gabriel/Phillips/Rutherford None of the first three drummers were ever included in any writing credits, while Phil was - immediately. Of course we do know he did *some* writing straight away (co-writing the lyrics for 'For Absent Friends') but by his own admission, he didn't write much in the early days, but was crucial to the band arrangements, often derived from jamming. As far as who the "main" writing partnership was in the 71-75 era, I'd say there wasn't one. They all worked in different combinations. A few songs were written completely solo, and then brought in. Many were derived from band jams, sometimes from scratch and sometimes with people bringing in unfinished "bits" they had written alone that then got strung together with other people's solo-written "bits" along with band jammed bits (which were most often the connecting bits created to join the other self-written bits together). The lyrics were usually then written by different pairs in collaboration, after the band had collectively written/assembled/arranged the music. Tony almost always had the most "bits" - he was still including his "university bits" (he attended for a year between FGTR and Trespass) for several years after - at least as recently as the ATOTT album (that we know of/that he's specifically mentioned). So as it happened a lot of his stray "bits" ended up in Supper's Ready, and Peter wrote the majority (if not all) of the lyrics for Supper's Ready (as well as Willow Farm completely - words and music) so those two *appeared* to dominate on that particular track. There's several other tracks one could mention on which other members dominate. Plus I have a hard time believing Steve had no input on 'Supper's Ready' - like he was just told what to play. Tony said he wrote the music for Lover's Leap on guitar while in university. There's three guitars on it, and I somehow doubt Tony had all three parts exactly mapped out in his head (or that he recorded/overdubbed a home demo with all three guitar parts and then told Mike and Steve to copy it exactly). In fact I'd bet big money that he just showed them the basis of what he wrote and then all three of them embellished/expanded upon it into a collaborative three guitar arrangement. Plus judging from live video performances of the song, Tony was definitely playing the least demanding guitar part of the three.
Wow, Banks and Rutherford throwing serious shade on Hackett! Banks - so we mixed him out of the live album(Seconds Out) Rutherford - I always thought of him more as a guitarist than songwriter Phil - umm guys...
think I posted this before, but seems appropiate to post it again Trespass: Looking For Someone (Banks, Gabriel, Phillips, Rutherford) White Mountain (Phillips, Rutherford) Visions Of Angels (Phillips) Stagnation (Phillips, Banks, Rutherford, Gabriel) Dusk (Phillips, Rutherford) The Knife (Banks, Gabriel, Rutherford, Phillips) Nursery Cryme: The Musical Box (Phillips, Rutherford, Banks, Gabriel) For Absent Friends (Hackett, Collins) The Return Of The Giant Hogweed (Banks, Gabriel, Hackett, Rutherford, Collins) Seven Stones (Banks) Harold The Barrel (Gabriel, Banks) Harlequin (Rutherford, Banks) The Fountain Of Salmacis (Banks, Gabriel, Collins, Hackett, Rutherford) Foxtrot: Watcher Of The Skie (Banks, Rutherford) Time Table (Banks) Get 'Em Out By Friday (Banks, Gabriel, Rutherford, Hackett, Collins) Can-Utility And The Coastliners (Hackett, Banks) Horizons (Hackett) Supper's Ready: a. Lover's Leap (Banks, Gabriel) b. The Guaranteed Eternal Sanctuary Man (Banks, Gabriel) c. Ikhnaton and Itsacon and Their Band of Merry Men (Rutherford, Banks, Gabriel) d. How Dare I Be So Beautiful? (Gabriel, Banks) e. Willow Farm (Gabriel) f. Apocalypse in 9/8 (featuring the delicious talents of Gabble Ratchet) (Banks, Collins, Rutherford, Gabriel) g. As Sure as Eggs is Eggs (Aching Men's Feet) (Banks, Gabriel) Selling England By The Pound: Dancing With The Moonlit Knight (Hackett, Banks, Gabriel, Rutherford, Collins) I Know What I Like (In Your Wardrobe) (Hackett, Banks, Gabriel) Firth Of Fifth (Banks) More Fool Me (Rutherford, Collins) The Battle Of Epping Forest (Banks, Gabriel, Rutherford, Collins) After The Ordeal (Hackett, Rutherford) The Cinema Show (Banks, Rutherford, Collins, Hackett, Gabriel) Aisle Of Plenty (Gabriel, Hackett) The Lamb Lies Down On Broadway: The Lamb Lies Down on Broadway (Banks, Gabriel) Fly on a Windshield (Hackett, Banks, Collins, Gabriel) Broadway Melody of 1974 (Gabriel, Banks, Rutherford) Cuckoo Cocoon (Hackett, Gabriel) In the Cage (Banks, Gabriel, Rutherford, Collins, Hackett) The Grand Parade of Lifeless Packaging (Gabriel, Banks, Rutherford) Back in N.Y.C. (Rutherford, Banks, Gabriel) Hairless Heart (Hackett) Counting Out Time (Gabriel) The Carpet Crawlers (Banks, Rutherford, Gabriel) The Chamber of 32 Doors (Gabriel, Banks) Lillywhite Lilith (Collins, Banks, Rutherford, Gabriel) The Waiting Room (Hackett, Collins, Banks, Rutherford, Gabriel) Anyway (Banks, Gabriel) The Supernatural Anaesthetist (Hackett, Gabriel) The Lamia (Banks, Gabriel) Silent Sorrow in Empty Boats (Rutherford, Banks, Collins, Hackett, Gabriel) Colony of Slippermen (Banks, Gabriel, Rutherford, Collins, Hackett) Ravine (Rutherford, Banks) The Light Dies Down on Broadway (Banks, Rutherford) Riding the Scree (Banks, Collins, Gabriel) In the Rapids (Rutherford, Banks, Gabriel) It. (Banks, Gabriel, Hackett, Rutherford, Collins)
That touches on the age old composition debate: where is the division between songwriting and playing a part that becomes integral to the song? That is why I always thought it healthy for a collective to assign joint authorship when there is a lot of give and take, especially when arrangements play such an important role, as we see with Genesis. U2 is another example.
Since the 1960s in rock bands it seems the way it works in terms of songwriting credits - whoever creates the main melody/riff gets credit. Adding a guitar solo, no matter how great usually didn't land you a credit. Thus on Queen in the 1970s, all those great Brian May guitar solos in Mercury-penned songs went unaccredited. No way Freddie wrote all of them.
Because, generally, they are. My favourite is The Genesis Songbook, and it's not a masterpiece either.
Its okay, but when you watched the A History, Songbook doesnt bring anything new to the table. The Gabriel years are fastforwarded and done in the first 15 mins (In A History they devote 30 mins to it), Hackett/Philips have almost nothing to say, after that they give the floor to some fans and musicpress, wich give zero new insight into *anything* really (something they did again in Sum of The parts), and oh yeah lets do unplugged versions of some of their songs. The only intresting things of Songbook are they interviewed Tony Smith, and they cover WCD/CAS.
Also, a big difference is that the previous drummers were just "following up" what the others did (at least it's what they said). Phil put creative input on the tables in jams. He didn't "write" full songs maybe, but great part of "writing" was collective trial and error in studio by those days. I highly doubt those very idiomatic solos wrote themselves. That's the thing. Genesis are different from your average rock band. A rock song is basically lyrics+chords, everything else is (was, maybe) considered studio work. Session musicians could come in, drop a very peculiar solo or part, and that was it; paid by the hour, no credits whatsoever. Genesis "wrote" their music like classical composers. Once the notes were figured out, they were carved in stone, and reproduced live (unless logistics made that unattainable of course). In this mindset, if the guitarist adds a part that wasn't there before, he co-writes the piece. They considered themselves a collective, hence they shared credits on the album. Later reconstructions of a song's paternity as the ones posted above are merely referring to the ones who came with the original ideas/bits that made up the final section; but there always was a great deal of band work tho bring them to the final version. On the other hand, sometimes the full band was not present at a jam session, and a whole piece was completely worked out by the ones in the room (see Cinema Show pt. 2). But those are rarer cases.
Revisited this and enjoy the 18 track single disc version. Tonight Tonight Tonight is a new edit? Played the single edit and can’t hear any different editing. They appear to run close in track times. What is the new edit on Turn It On Again?
