Grateful Dead best ever China Cat Sunflower> I Know You Rider tournament

I know, I messed this up. I left out a great version or 3. Your favorite one probably. Or the one you saw at the Cap Center in 93. Try to take it easy on me; the GoGD played China>Rider more than 500 times, and we only have room for 16.

I started with my listening notes and posted that list in the main Grateful Thread. Any versions people mentioned, I added to the list for listening, including going back and searching the entire thread for older discussions, too. There’s actually a pretty incredible consistency to the ones mentioned for 72-74. The early ones and later ones, however, were impossible. I took down every version anyone mentioned as an all-time great and listened to it fresh. Finally, I decided to limit the 1974 versions to spread out the eras a bit.

All eras have great ones, and I thought it would be much more fun to compare 4 pre-Feeling Groovy versions to the 1973-74 era to 4 post post-bust out versions of the 80s/90s (and of course, when they play it just once from Oct 74 to Feb 79, that one has to make the list). From there, the list of 16 and randomly assigned matchups. Sorry again for all the mistakes. Hope you have fun voting anyway.

So, here is the Sweet 16:

1. 9/20/1970, Fillmore East.
2. 12/6/1971, Felt Forum. Also found on the 2017 Dave’s bonus disc with DaP 22
3. 5/3/1972, Olympia Theatre. Also found on Europe 72, and on the full show in the box
4. 8/27/1972, Veneta. Also found on “Sunshine Daydream”
5. 11/11/1973, Winterland. Also found on the Winterland 73 box set
6. 2/24/1974, Winterland. Also found on Dave’s Picks 13
7. 5/17/1974, P.N.E. Coliseum. Also found in the Pacific Northwest box
8. 5/19/1974, Portland Memorial. Also found in the Pac Northwest box and on the Believe It If You Need It sampler disc
9. 6/16/1974, Des Moines Fairgrounds. Also found on Road Trips 2.3
10. 6/26/1974, Providence. Also found on Dick’s Picks 12
11. 8/5/1974, Philadelphia Civic Arena. Also found on Dick’s Picks 31
12. 12/29/1977, Winterland. Also found on Dick’s Picks 10
13. 3/9/1981, Madison Square Garden
14. 8/7/1982, Alpine Valley. Also found on Dick’s Picks 32
15. 7/17/1989, Alpine Valley
16. 9/20/1990, Madison Square Garden. Also found on Road Trips 2.1

We’ll do one matchup for a week – this way, the songs can get full focus. Happy to speed up or slow down as the group wants.

No set criteria - whatever moves you, whichever you prefer, for any reason. Please just indicate somewhere in your post who your winner is so I can keep the tally.

R1, M1: 6/16/1974 Des Moines vs 9/20/1970 Fillmore East

 

My opinion on a recent one that is a glaring omission from that list: 4.1.91. I honestly think that tops most since the 70's. I can't really think of one that is clearly better (and I know that sounds like hyperbole... but its not).

 

as soon as I figure out how to post a bracket, I'll add the full bracket to this post!

 

1: 16 June 1974- State Fair Grandstand, Des Moines, Iowa.

@Archtop will explain from a musical theory perspective why this is a great, I just love the fact that Jerry quotes I've Been Working On The Railroad to great effect during the transition jam.

PS- You left out 20 September and 20 October 1974!!!

@jmadad - Thanks for taking on this project.

 

I’m no Deadhead or Dead expert, but I’ve heard more than a few versions of this medley. I’d rate the version Europe ‘72 as tops. That’s probably because it’s the first one I ever heard and Europe ‘72 brings back fond memories for me

 

please participate in the voting! All of these are available to listen to on archive.org

The Europe 72 version is in here (#3 above), and it will be in matchup 8 of the first round. Maybe your vote will be the one to get it to the top?

 

I’ll be sure to check out the voting. Thanks

 

My folks were at that show, I’m sure of it!

 

I have to go with 1974-06-16 here.

 

The rendering from Providence 6/26/74 was sent by Providence and never ever bettered.

 

I know Dicks 12 is a highly rated one (the longest?) and I always thought it was my fave but a recent listen found me a little bored by it.

On the other hand, there is something weirdly palpable about the Veneta version, like a switch has been turned on, business is open, armageddon is coming etc. I think the fact that it follows some standard 1972 first set, less 'serious' things helps. It really feels like a 'moment' that leads through to the DS in set 3.

So maybe that one, for mood as well as musical reasons.

 

will be in next week's matchup #2 - come back to vote!

 

My bet is that this might as well just be a poll of the best China-Rider from 74. I'm not sure if there is another song(pairing) in the Dead catalogue where the 'peak' year is so obvious.

(Yes, I know, now people will try to say otherwise... but deep down we all know it was 74. Only 72 can take a run at it now and then... and that's being charitable.)

 

this post right after @Spadeygrove is why this will be fun - come vote!

 

Yep - it was posted as I was finishing mine!

 

here are links to the songs on the Archive for those who don't own the CDs, etc:

archive.org/details/gd70-09-20.aud.remaster.sirmick.27583.sbeok.shnf

archive.org/details/gd74-06-16.sbd.fink.17701.sbeok.shnf

 

OP , personal favor for me?

Please add 6 16 91. It will win the tournament.

 

One from 73

 

4.1.91 is better. Just saying.

 

6/16/74...............it's hard to vote against 1974 versions.

I only saw the last one on the list......and front row center at that, so I'll likely non-objectively vote for it when the time comes.

 

My vote goes to 11/11/1973, Winterland.

 

R1, M1: 6/16/1974 Des Moines

 

Have to go with 14. 8/7/1982, Alpine Valley as it's the only one on the list I was there for

 

I voted for 12-1-79.