HBO' s "Succession" Any Thoughts?

Discussion in 'Visual Arts' started by audiomixer, Jun 14, 2018.

  1. seacliffe301

    seacliffe301 Forum Resident

    That was strange. Just what was Kendall trying to do there? Whatever it was clearly went right over my head.
     
  2. Veltri

    Veltri ♪♫♫♪♪♫♫♪

    Location:
    Canada
    Don't need to, he already told us what should have been assumed.

    And with all the extra explanation and confirmation bias, I've come around to thinking this was the only way it could have ended, so success!
     
  3. Big Blue

    Big Blue Forum Resident

    Location:
    Wisconsin
    He was breaking the cut back open. Roman was looking at his reflection and saying how he thought he looked pretty good, enough to be a CEO. Kendall was disabusing him of that notion. Super messed up, right?
     
    Lars Medley and seacliffe301 like this.
  4. seacliffe301

    seacliffe301 Forum Resident

    Wow. Yes it is.
     
    George P likes this.
  5. Chazro

    Chazro Forum Resident

    Location:
    West Palm Bch, Fl.
    So who's left? Greg is Madsen's Judas, Tom says the old guard is out, kids are out. Forgetting the names, but Shiv's assistant saying the other assistant should go, So is it just Tom & Jerry(!)?
     
    fleaboy likes this.
  6. George P

    George P Notable Member

    Location:
    NYC
    Even more messed up, considering that he did so while hugging Roman.
     
    Big Blue likes this.
  7. Big Blue

    Big Blue Forum Resident

    Location:
    Wisconsin
    The hug makes it deniable as an act of aggression (although Roman knows what he is doing the whole time). It’s really twisted.
     
    7solqs4iago and NettleBed like this.
  8. Big Blue

    Big Blue Forum Resident

    Location:
    Wisconsin
    Tom is keeping Greg. He used one of his stickers on him. :laugh:

    And those aren’t assistants. Karolina and Hugo are communications/PR people, and Karolina doesn’t like Hugo. Based on Hugo’s brief talk with Tom, and Tom’s asking him where Karolina is, I’m guessing Hugo is out, but Karolina stays, if I interpreted that correctly.
     
  9. NettleBed

    NettleBed Forum Transient

    Location:
    new york city
    I don't think it's impossible that Jesse Armstrong chooses to revisit this world after some years pass and our own changes a bit, with some new things to comment on. Obviously a number of things would need to be aligned, but his statements have been fairly consistent as loving the show and loving working on it, but that the plotlines of these particular characters in this particular situation had an expiry date and this was pretty much it. 'Better Call Saul' was able to be a successful show in the same world as Breaking Bad; maybe something similar could happen here in the future.
     
    trumpet sounds, OldSoul and Big Blue like this.
  10. NettleBed

    NettleBed Forum Transient

    Location:
    new york city
    Yes, she did know that it was Tom when she casts her vote. He was the reason she flipped.
     
    Lars Medley likes this.
  11. Big Blue

    Big Blue Forum Resident

    Location:
    Wisconsin
    I think that meant the first flip, when she agreed to side with her brothers at their mom’s house.
     
    Lars Medley, '05Train and NettleBed like this.
  12. NettleBed

    NettleBed Forum Transient

    Location:
    new york city
    Oh, you mean flip on Matsson? Got it.
     
    '05Train likes this.
  13. Big Blue

    Big Blue Forum Resident

    Location:
    Wisconsin
    I could be wrong about the other poster’s intention, I just assumed that was what he meant when I read it.
     
    '05Train likes this.
  14. '05Train

    '05Train Crashin' & Flyin' & Livin' & Dyin'

    Location:
    Roanoke, Virginia
    Call me a cynic, but I think she was angling at that point too.

    I think at some level Shiv has enough self-awareness to understand that she's an imposter and could never lead the company. Which leads to that devastating scene when Tom offers his hand and she takes it. She has become her mother.
     
  15. '05Train

    '05Train Crashin' & Flyin' & Livin' & Dyin'

    Location:
    Roanoke, Virginia
    As noted, I was referring to her flip to support Ken. She had no idea at that point that it'd be Tom.
     
  16. BEAThoven

    BEAThoven Forum Resident

    Location:
    New Jersey
    Quick side note -- it's interesting to read (and hear) folks discussing this show and actually expressing a bit of sympathy for the characters, but... man, it's the genius of this show that these f-ed up kids can walk away with some of the largest "golden parachutes" in corporate history, and we are contemplating and are maybe a little bit worried about their future... too much!
     
  17. Armjim

    Armjim Music is indeed a gift from Heaven

    Location:
    San Antonio, TX
    We watched the final episode last night. After it was over I was genuinely upset. I had to remind myself these are not real people-it is a fictional show! But we so enjoyed this series so much that part of it was the disappointment of it ending. I always want a happy ending though, and this was far from it for me. My partner had to point out to me that real life is generally far from happy. Each one of the kids remain billionaires so financially they have all that life can offer materialistically. But I wanted to see them go out united. That is the shmaltzy factor that appeals to me I suppose. The pain and loneliness on Kendal's face was quite haunting, and that added to my own sadness at the conclusion.
     
  18. '05Train

    '05Train Crashin' & Flyin' & Livin' & Dyin'

    Location:
    Roanoke, Virginia
    I think a lot of people missed that the writers of the show spent an inordinate amount of time over the course of four seasons demonstrating how terrible and pathetic the three kids are. I heard women favorably compare themselves to Shiv, and I'd think, "have you watched this show?????"
     
  19. NettleBed

    NettleBed Forum Transient

    Location:
    new york city
    I think the nature of the show was that it was always going to end up with none of the 3 "winning," and the art of it would be how the losing happened and was depicted. I thought these aspects were were done really well. The only slightly squeaky hinge in the way that they did it was setting it up to be Shiv who flipped on her brothers. They had to build something into the narrative that would make this result make sense, and so we get Matsson's selection of Tom as the yes-man and "pain sponge" of US CEO, and Shiv cutting off her nose to spite her face.

    I had a feeling that this was going to come down to a "board vote" episode, and I was trying to figure out who the swing vote/s might be. If Shiv stayed with Matsson I had the writers making the swing vote/s as either being Frank, Stewy or Ewan (actually, I thought it would be Ewan and was mildly surprised when he was portrayed as an automatic "no" to the deal).
     
    Armjim and Big Blue like this.
  20. BEAThoven

    BEAThoven Forum Resident

    Location:
    New Jersey
    Quick question for the room here -- Was there any resolution with the whole "President Mencken" subplot that took up a whole ep?

    Are we supposed to assume that he will eventually lose the election when all the votes are actually counted? Or was there a chance that the proto-fascist was elected and that there is still a possibility -- in theory -- that he could and would quash the deal?
     
    Gus Tomato likes this.
  21. Big Blue

    Big Blue Forum Resident

    Location:
    Wisconsin
    I think the primary purpose of that whole thing was to create the need for a US CEO, which was to keep him from quashing the deal. Without that, Matsson would just be the CEO, so there would have been no Shiv flipping at the last minute for Tom to take the position. I don’t think it’s supposed to really matter for the outcome of this show whether he actually does become President.
     
    BEAThoven likes this.
  22. '05Train

    '05Train Crashin' & Flyin' & Livin' & Dyin'

    Location:
    Roanoke, Virginia
    The hint was dropped regarding the Wisconsin case. I'd suspect that the election gets overturned....which means that all four Roy children end up not getting what they want.
     
    OldSoul and Big Blue like this.
  23. BEAThoven

    BEAThoven Forum Resident

    Location:
    New Jersey
    Yeah, that's what I figured... The final ep was so intense, I just wasn't sure I missed anything.

    That whole ep focused on the election, to me, just showed that billionaires like this will just fight to elect anybody -- no matter how horrible, how destructive, how pathological -- as long as they get what benefits their small, petty, cynical, and gold-encrusted world the most.
     
    Lars Medley, OldSoul and Big Blue like this.
  24. Big Blue

    Big Blue Forum Resident

    Location:
    Wisconsin
    Yes, even though that episode did not spend a lot of its screen time actually affecting the end result in terms of the succession and fate of the company, it did serve as a good satire of the subjects it took on.
     
    Lars Medley and BEAThoven like this.
  25. NettleBed

    NettleBed Forum Transient

    Location:
    new york city
    I think it's supposed to be uncertain - but nevertheless likely - that Mencken will be president. I think it matters for the tragedy that, by trying to have something for themselves, they directly changed the course of their own country for the worse. I don't think that Mencken actually has to be shown becoming president for what they did to have the necessary dramatic impact. The Wisconsin thing that was alluded to does indicate something less than certainty (the reference was *really* unspecific about what the issue was). Maybe Jesse Armstrong didn't want to create a world in which Mencken definitely becomes president, in the event that he wishes to revisit it (heck, maybe the outcome of our own next election would have an effect on whether or not Mencken wins in the Succession world, if that world was to be revisited). Or, maybe he thought that having Mencken definitely get elected would needlessly upset fans of the show (it would not surprise me if the majority of the audience for Succession would not be very interested in a real-world version of the kind of "purity" the character pledged to bring to the country).
     
    Last edited: May 30, 2023
    BEAThoven and Big Blue like this.

Share This Page

molar-endocrine