My advice to you is this take a week off from audio forums. Spend the time listening and tinkering with your speakers see if you can get them dialed in. If you can't then sell all of the speakers you own, I believe that's 4 pairs. Take the money and your Cary to a good local dealer, there must be one in SoCal, and find speakers that match both your amp and your room. Or keep doing this.
Nah the perfect placement is yet to be found. Toe-in, distance from wall, distance from each other and distance sat from speakers all make huge differences and it takes time to find it. Keep tinkering. It's worth rearranging your entire living space to find the perfect placement and positioning of your $5,000 speakers. I did it with my space for my CW IVs. You're kind of weird in that most people in this hobby aren't so quick to admit they made a mistake lol. Most people lie to themselves until their brain adjusts. I know I lied to myself for a few weeks before I found the sweet spot for my Cornwalls. I wanted MORE bass though and I found it by pushing the speakers up 2" from the front wall. You should also experiment with toe-out.
You may be right on that point, Pete. That or the Forte IIIs. Nonetheless I wish there was an easier way to demo speakers in your own home.
In many ways you went from one extreme to another going from a pair of Triangle standmounts to a pair of big Forte IV's. No experience with either speaker, but they each seem aimed at people with totally different listening rooms. I would try to go back to basics and consider room size, listening habits, and music tastes, plus what exactly you are looking for in terms of sound to help you arrive at another option. There must be a ton of speakers out there with a more relaxed treble than the Triangles and less bass and sheer sound than the Forte. Like, probably 90% of the speakers out there would fit into that group!
too much bass would suggest the speaker isn’t accurately presenting the recorded music. Like a kid that puts a booming subs in a Honda Civic you can hear before you see. your speakers have too much bass like a Corvette goes too fast. It only goes as fast as you choose to drive it. Same thing with any pair of speakers, especially ones that cost $2,000 -$4,000. In part, they are that expensive because of their performance, they can get up and over 100db, stay clean and sound fantastic. Just like you can wind that new corvette up to 150mph and it has plenty of pedal remaining under your right foot. If you can’t trust yourself to drive below a speed that will get you put in jail, a minivan is be the better choice. now, it is fair to say you don’t like the way your speakers sound listening at 60db. If any speaker has “too much bass”, it has that characteristic at every listening level. The EQ doesn’t change or the bass need to be adjusted because you are turning it up. and because I’m widely known as a sensitive and caring man I’m going to give you some tough love and suggest you ask yourself some hard questions. Are you getting a high from buying stereo equipment and then finding a reason to kill it so you can keep chasing a buzz? I get it, I enjoy this hobby. I like reading about it, talking about it, listening to equipment and I love the high you get from bringing awesome stuff home and playing all your favorite records again for the first time but there comes a point where you have to be reasonable. I’m also a bourbon enthusiast but there is only so much you can bring home in a year before it gets weird. after 25 pages of “help me buy speakers” you may not be looking for any kind of long term commitment just the next buzz. and for the record, I would never run a pair of Klipsch in an apartment. In fact, unless it was a pair of audio note o would spend more than a modest amount for any pair of speakers I was running in an apartment. The same reason I drive a full size pickup truck rather than corvette as a daily driver, I would get in trouble. Not everyday, I played my CW’s at 60db all night and never thought about turning it up. But if it was a zero tolerance situation for loud music I would only be setting myself up for failure. perhaps after your first week of listening to these speakers you will get the need to turn them up out of your system. Like having sex on your honeymoon, after living together for awhile once a week is fine.
I can sell them. Time is on my Side in selling. If you make price low enough someone will buy them. If I lose a couple hundred on a pair of speakers I took a chance on I can live with that. I think I can probably sell the Fortes for $3500 ($500 profit). The scratches are minor and I live in the 8th largest city in the country. The Triangles could take a while to sell but I think they will sell eventually. I'm taking a step back from buying new speakers. I enjoy listening to the KLH 5's and will listen to them until I sell the other 2. I think your advice is sound and I need to take a step back. My approach worked in the past. It is not working this time. I can probably make a small profit on selling the 5's too should I decide.
Some interesting thoughts but I'm not chasing a high. I can't blame you for thinking that how this thread has played out. Based on our past interactions I wouldn't be surprised if you think I'm a nut, but if you met me you wouldn't. I'm a pretty level headed guy. I'm not killing the Triangles because I want to buy something else. They literally dulled my ears to the point I was wondering if I was causing myself hearing damage. And I wasn't cranking them. The bass today from my Fortes made my ears have a dull throb much like the way they feel after you get home from a rock concert. And I was not playing them any louder than I used to play my B&W's. Sensitive ears perhaps, but I was enjoying them before the bass became overpowering. Turning the fortes down I still hear bass the most. Not sure the corvette analogy plays here but perhaps I'm not understanding the way you meant it. It would not be the first time I didn't connect with you over the internet. I haven't been blasting the Fortes, just noticed that they sound better at a medium volume than a low volume. I want to like the speakers I'm buying. I liked the B&W 803s sound so much that none of the speakers I've purchased have equaled or surpassed it. To my ears I have a high bar to clear for the speakers I've purchased because of this. My thoughts today are that perhaps B&W is the sound I enjoy the most. The only thing missing was good imaging. But good imaging is a lot of fun to listen to. This whole 3 month journey could end up being my self discovery that B&W's are the speaker for me in the same way Klipsch are the speakers for you. Is it fun to read about and buy gear? Absolutely. Am I doing it just to do it? Nah.
I have been hard on the speakers I've bought. As I'm married I only have so much practical re-arranging I can do. I also live in a 1,050 sq ft apartment and have a space gobbling vinyl collection. I definitely have not found the perfect placement. I'll tinker and try them in different spots. So far I've tried really close to the wall and about as far into the room as I can practically place them and both spots were too much bass. But I can try in the middle. The main thing I could move is my records into the bedroom to give the speakers more room to breath, but I really hate having to go to another room to pick out a record. Feel like I was stubborn about giving up on the Triangles. But some components have deal breakers and ear bleeding treble or bass are deal breakers for me. Having ringing ears is not the kind of psychological adjustment you are discussing. Hopefully I can find the sweet spot with the Fortes. I haven't given up on them, but I guess I haven't considered really rearranging my living space to accommodate them. My wife has been very supportive and just kind of laughs when I buy and sell speakers, but moving things around in my living room, that's next level. You have given me something to think about though.
You make some great points and I agree with everything you've said. I am realizing I did not understand how my room plays in it's current configuration. I thought it was a pretty neutral good sounding room that I could put most medium sized speakers into. I was lucky in the past with synergy and building my systems. I had a run of probably 6 or 7 upgrades that gelled and sounded better. I did go through a phase where I owned 4 preamps but I settled on the Sonic Frontiers, sold the other 3, and have used it for close to 3 years.
Aren't Forte(s) sold as matched pairs? I was wondering if some of the problems that @Bananas&blow has with too much bass are due to a mismatched pair. I have heard the Forte IV often in a friends system and in my dealer's room and I never felt that the bass was overwhelming. Of course, different rooms, different systems, and all that. But I am still wondering.
They were purchased from different sources but they are both Walnut Forte IV's. They probably have different levels of break in currently but I would think the bass is only going to grow. I'm as surprised as you are about the bass as the reviews rave about it. How far does your friend and dealer have them from the back and side wall?
I’ve not been to their showroom but am quite familiar of who and what they do. Not really sure what their return policy is.
I think everyone here can relate to this at one point or another. I currently have some Polk LSiM 705' I don't really care for. That's even after adding a super tweeter (which did help).
I do not know the exact distance, I guess I can find out, but my estimate is something between 3 to 4 feet maximum from the back wall. They are also far away from the side walls. My friend uses a McIntosh solid state and gets nice solid bass out of them. In my dealer's, last time I checked he used a Primaluna Evo and the bass was lacking some definition by comparison. I am very interested in the Forte as I am looking for a pair of speakers to match with my low powered Cary300sei that I am using in a second system. That is the reason that I have spent some serious time listening to them in both my friend's place and in my dealer. I am still not persuaded that they are the right speakers for me. But, going back to you, I would give them some time to break in. They are known for needing a long break in, some people claim more than 400 hours. But they are also very sensitive speakers and they are meant to be played loud. They sound very undefined in low volume but they really develop a bolder character in higher volumes. Good luck and I hope you find a solution. I will be following this thread with interest.
I'd say lets calm down and let the speakers break in. Only had them 3 days. As much as I'd like to blame Rusty, and it is usually his fault, this whole thread started because I heard some $200/pair NHT superones in my main system that imaged like a mother. Once I heard that I wanted that from my main speakers. I don't think buying a used pair of speakers is a major event. If you get a good deal you can sell them for the same or possibly more money. That's one reason I'm so quick to pull the trigger lately.
Hope you find what you are looking for. Welcome aboard the crazy train. Once the woofers opened up the bass is aplenty with my Cary amp. I would think the only thing you will miss is a little bit in bass department with that pairing but on paper sounds like a heavenly match. In my case less bass would be an improvement. I wonder if the dealer's Fortes were broken in because your description of the bass matches mine when I first took them out of the box.
I listen to my Hersey speakers mostly on the quiet side. They sound great and full at lower volumes. 60db or less most of the time. Best speakers I have had listening at low levels. I also have the option to piss people off if I wanted to.
The dealer had them only for two weeks and they had gotten very few hours in these two weeks. He is the one who told me about the long break in period. He said that the big woofer and the radiator require it.
