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Hendrix- Cry of Love 2014 vs First Rays 1997*

Discussion in 'Music Corner' started by fooboo, Oct 12, 2016.

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  1. Purple Jim

    Purple Jim Forum Resident

    Location:
    Bretagne
    Yes, that intro is all garbled as if the tracks aren't aligned properly (or too much echo). It sounds muddled. Also, Jimi's first "Yeah..ay…yeah" is missing - it's there the earlier mix which is less cluttered, funkier with a cow-bell accompaniment. It just has more bite, more funk. I'll try and figure out which bootleg it is on for you.
     
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  2. slane

    slane Forum Resident

    Location:
    England
    I think that echo is actually a copy of the whole track, running slightly behind. Not sure if that was put on tape originally or if it was something done by Kramer.
     
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  3. crozcat

    crozcat Forum Resident

    Location:
    Sweden
    There´s also an earlier Jimi/Bob Hughes-mix on the vinyl 7" b-side to Somewhere.
    https://www.discogs.com/Jimi-Hendrix-Somewhere/release/4262327
     
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  4. MHP

    MHP Lover of Rock ‘n Roll

    Location:
    DK
    Bad choices, then.
     
  5. John Buchanan

    John Buchanan I'm just a headphone kind of fellow. Mysphere 3.2.

    Possibly Michael Jeffrey trying to eke out another release.
     
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  6. John Fell

    John Fell Forum Survivor

    Location:
    Undisclosed
    It was. He wanted to hold a few good songs back each time for future releases. Izabella and Stepping Stone were held back from Rainbow Bridge and later appeared on War Heroes. The Stars The Play With Laughing Sam's Dice was held back from War Heroes to use on Loose Ends.
     
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  7. DTK

    DTK Forum Resident

    Location:
    Europe
    I love Straight Ahead. Great, driving riff, great performance, great feeling. The lyrics come off like a self-conscious Sly Stone homage though, maybe he would have reworked them a bit and made a new vocal overdub.
     
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  8. Purple Jim

    Purple Jim Forum Resident

    Location:
    Bretagne
    I know I'm in the minority feeling that My Friend was a great choice as a timeless blues which perfectly balances the two sides of the album. Kramer said that My Friend was included because Jimi had in fact brought it to the table for consideration when they were constructing the final album. Another straight rock number on COL would have been too much. Thank God Dolly Dagger was kept to be the opener of the fabulous Rainbow Bridge album.
     
  9. PacificOceanBlue

    PacificOceanBlue Senior Member

    Location:
    The Southwest
    This is a 1970 studio playlist I like:

    HENDRIX 1970
    Outtakes (with Posthumous mixes):
    Burning Desire [1/16/70, Record Plant NYC] (WCSB)
    Astro Man [alternate take, 1/21/70, Record Plant NYC] (Purple Box)
    All God’s Children [6/16/70, Electric Lady Studios] (WCSB)
    Cherokee Mist [6/24/70, Electric Lady Studios] (Purple Box)
    Bolero/Hey Baby (New Rising Sun) [7/1/70, Electric Lady Studios] (WCSB)
    Lover Man [7/20/70, Electric Lady Studios] (purple box) (Purple Box)
    Slow Blues [incomplete jam, 8/20/70, Electric Lady Studios] (Purple Box)

    Hendrix Mixes:
    Ezy Ryder [alternate mix, 6/15/70, Electric Lady Studios] (Purple box)
    In From The Storm [alternate mix, 8/20/70, Electric Lady Studios] (WCSB)
    Room Full of Mirrors [8/20/70, Electric Lady Studios] (Rainbow Bridge)
    Dolly Dagger [8/20/70, Electric Lady Studios] (Rainbow Bridge)
    Straight Ahead [8/20/70, Electric Lady Studios – Eddie Kramer only] (Cry of Love)
    Come Down Hard On Me [8/22/70, Electric Lady] (Purple Box)
    Astro Man [8/22/70, Electric Lady Studios] (Cry of Love)
    Drifter’s Escape [8/22/70, Electric Lady Studios] (South Saturn Delta)
    Earth Blues [alternate mix 8/22/70] (Purple Box)
    Message To Love [alternate mix, 8/22/70] (WCSB)
    Night Bird Flying [alternate mix, 8/22/70] (Purple Box)
    Ezy Ryder [8/22/70, Electric Lady Studios] (Cry of Love)
    Belly Button Window [8/24/70, Electric Lady Studios] (Cry of Love)
    Freedom [8/24/70, Electric Lady Studios] (Cry of Love)
    Night Bird Flying [8/24/70, Electric Lady Studios] (Cry of Love)

    Posthumous Mixes:
    Stepping Stone [single, 4/8/70]* (Voodoo Child Collection)
    Izabella [b-side, 4/8/70]* (Voodoo Child Collection)
    Power of Soul [mix 7/16/97, final Hendrix overdubs 8/22/70] (South Saturn Delta)
    Beginnings [mix, 1/24/72] (War Heroes/First Rays)
    Bleeding Heart [mix 3/11/71] (War Heroes/South Saturn Delta)
    Pali Gap (“Slow Part”) [mix 5/12/71] (Rainbow Bridge/South Saturn Delta)
    In From The Storm [mix 11/29/70] (Cry of Love)
    Angel [mix 11/12/70, drum overdubs 10/19/70] (Cry of Love)
    Midnight Lightning [7/10/97, 3/23/70 solo acoustic recording, Record Plant] (South Saturn Delta)
    Drifting [mix 12/2/70, vibes 11/20/70] (Cry of Love)
     
  10. Astaroth

    Astaroth Active Member

    what would the most hostorically accurate first rays 2lp be, song list wise?
     
  11. PacificOceanBlue

    PacificOceanBlue Senior Member

    Location:
    The Southwest
    It will always be surrounded by speculation. Hendrix clearly had more recording and mixing ahead of him for the fall of 1970, but the list of Hendrix mixes two posts above shows a group of core songs he was focusing on during the summer of 1970, so it can safely be assumed a lot of those tracks were under serious consideration for inclusion in his untitled, forthcoming fourth studio album (First Rays.... as a title was only one of a number of possibilities, but appears to have been the front runner).
     
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  12. Fred68

    Fred68 Loves Music

    Location:
    USA
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  13. cublowell

    cublowell Forum Resident

    Location:
    Pittsburgh, PA
    The 2014 COL does sound better than the 1997 FROTNRS, but I think First Rays was a great idea by Experience Hendrix. Let's be honest: short of putting out a huge box set of all the 69-70 Hendrix material mastered by Grundman, EH couldn't possibly please everyone with a single CD track list for this era. EH took a stab at it, and I think the track list works well overall. It definitely gives us a better idea of late period Hendrix than Voodoo Soup, which I hated as a teenager when it was released.
     
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  14. 99thfloor

    99thfloor Forum Resident

    Location:
    Sweden
    The tracks on First Rays Of The New Rising Sun are some of my favourite Hendrix tracks, and consequently some of my favourite music period. But it is just too much of a good thing all at once, too many similar songs, listening to it is the aural equivalent of stuffing yourself at Christmas. I don't think Jimi had released all of this material together in this way. I prefer the old LPs.

    I like "My Friend" on Cry Of Love, but I think it was a mistake to include it on First Rays just because it had been on Cry.
     
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  15. cublowell

    cublowell Forum Resident

    Location:
    Pittsburgh, PA
    Have you listened to the vinyl though? The way it's broken up over four sides really makes sense, where the CD does sound like a long listen all at once.
     
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  16. 99thfloor

    99thfloor Forum Resident

    Location:
    Sweden
    I have the original vinyl release of it, but haven't listened to it much that way, maybe I should try it again.
     
  17. Purple Jim

    Purple Jim Forum Resident

    Location:
    Bretagne
    Yes, the advantage of vinyl - to pull out individual sides when one feels like it, then move on to something else.
     
  18. PacificOceanBlue

    PacificOceanBlue Senior Member

    Location:
    The Southwest
    Experience Hendrix's "First Rays..." release was simply an expanded version of Cry Of Love adopting the "First Rays" title. EH clearly had no intention of piecing together a historically accurate attempt at compiling a release of music the represented the material Hendrix was actively recording and mixing during the summer of 1970. My Friend is a great track, but was a questionable inclusion on Cry Of Love (although Hendrix did allegedly ask Kramer to find it for review during the summer of 1970), but was even more so on "First Rays." If EH truly wanted its version of "First Rays" to be representative of Hendrix's work towards its completion, it would have at the very least included "Drifter's Escape," "Come Down Hard On Me," and maybe "Message To Love," in addition to ensuring that all Hendrix/Kramer mixes were used when possible in place of any 1970-1972 posthumous mixes made by Kramer.
     
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  19. hoggydoggy

    hoggydoggy Forum Resident

    He also asked Kramer to fish out the tape of Highway Chile though, since this was an already-released B-side, I'd be astonished if he had any plans re THAT track.

    You're spot on about First Rays: there's a fabulous release to be had of Hendrix's 1970 sessions, using (mostly) contemporary 1970 mixes, and it wouldn't be hard to do either. Simply by starting with Jimi's tracklisting draft (yes, it may well have changed, but it is at least representing a momentary Hendrix vision), and building on that with the remainder of the tracks already well under way, you'd have a great double album/single CD.

    Of course, it really deserves a 2 or 3 CD box, but we'll never get either anyway, so until then it's down to us fans to make our own...
     
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  20. 99thfloor

    99thfloor Forum Resident

    Location:
    Sweden
    Yes, but the "problem" is they expanded it with all the similar (great) funky rockers from Rainbow Bridge and War Heroes, making it too much of a good thing. Cry Of Love is very well put together, with dreamy impressionistic ballads in "Angel" and "Drifting" and intimate low-key blues in "Belly Button Window" and "My Friend" to balance the rockers. I actually think it was a good thing that "Dolly Dagger" and "Room Full Of Mirrors" were held back, for this same reason.

    He did include "Burning Of The Midnight Lamp" on Electric Ladyland, so why not?
     
  21. Great song, but nobody will ever convince me, including Eddie Kramer, that "Straight Ahead," was a completed track, despite it being mixed for the Electric Lady studio's opening party.

    I always leave this one off of any comps I've created, because it just sounds so linear to me, as if more work was needed.

    I also believe that Jimi would have been forced to put out a single LP release by Christmas of 1970. The album was right around the corner before he died in September '70.
     
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  22. DTK

    DTK Forum Resident

    Location:
    Europe
    For me it was always the vocal and possibly lyric that sounds unfinished. Some backing vocals by Jimi and Emmaretta Marks or Ghetto Fighters would have been nice, like on In From The Storm.
    That's probably true, the single album. There was a lot of work left on many tunes in the can. For all the theories on Jimi's planned double LP, perhaps we would have had something similar to The Cry of Love had he lived.
     
  23. PacificOceanBlue

    PacificOceanBlue Senior Member

    Location:
    The Southwest
    Hendrix continued to tinker with tracks with additional overdubs and remixes, so it certainly is within the realm of possibility that Hendrix would have revisited Straight Ahead, particularly because it does sound a bit unfinished compared to other more elaborate productions from the same summer.

    I have also started to take that possibility into strong consideration. Some of it depends on whether Jeffery was going to book shows during the October-December time period, which is certainly a possibility because Hendrix and Jeffery needed the touring revenues at the time. That said, had Hendrix had 2 solid months to finish recording and mixing, he may have been able to achieve a double album. Some might argue that 2 months would not have been enough time for an artist prone to procrastination, but if anything, his time at Electric Lady during the summer of 1970 showed that he was once again engaged and focused which lead to a lot of work being completed (particularly considering he was juggling a touring schedule during that time as well). Still, I think the pressure from Reprise would have been difficult to overcome, and he may very well have had to compromise and release a single album for a fourth quarter release. However, if one looks closely at what Hendrix and Kramer had mixed towards completion during the summer of 1970, there is almost a double album ready to go (sans Hey Baby, which apparently was a key track).
     
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  24. PacificOceanBlue

    PacificOceanBlue Senior Member

    Location:
    The Southwest
    Yeah, I am not convinced that My Friend and Highway Chile were going to be part of the fourth studio album due in 1970. Clearly My Friend had a better chance of seeing a release because it was unreleased, but with all the tantalizing new songs under development during the summer of 1970, it seems unlikely that Hendrix would have given priority to that two year old track over newer material. Of course, who knows, it is all speculation.
     
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  25. johnny q

    johnny q Forum Resident

    Location:
    Bergen County, NJ
    Ya know....between copying your playlists from the Elvis Presley threads and now the Hendrix threads - my parties have officially become the place to be! :)
     
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