Hollow sound from pro-ject debut carbon esprit, is it normal? uploaded clip

Discussion in 'Audio Hardware' started by Robert Godridge, Jul 31, 2019.

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  1. Robert Godridge

    Robert Godridge Forum Resident Thread Starter

    Is this sound normal for a pro-ject debut carbon esprit with ortofon 2m stylus? I mean the sort of hollow creaking noise.
    It seems to be from the motor and happens on all my records. Yeah, I mostly hear it through headphones and between tracks, but it's still annoying and I'd like to fix it!
    Tracking is not too heavy, the store set it up (I'm totally blind and didn't want to risk it) and I have tried with pretty much no tracking and the noise is still present.
    I have made sure there is oil in the bearing, not to mention this happened from new.
    Someone please either tell me this is normal or what to do!
    here it is
    annoyin pro-ject debut carbon noise - Clyp
     
  2. JohnO

    JohnO Senior Member

    Location:
    Washington, DC
    That sounds about normal to me.
    That's turntable rumble, a little from your turntable, which is normal, and some rumble from the turntable and lathe that was used when cutting the record.
    But wait for a few more opinions here.
     
  3. Robert Godridge

    Robert Godridge Forum Resident Thread Starter

    Thanks for your input!
    Record noise I can live with it's that sort of hollow creaking sound that doesn't happen on my lenco gl75 that makes me wonder.
     
  4. Slick Willie

    Slick Willie Decisively Indecisive

    Location:
    sweet VA.
    IMHO, 'too much arm' for the chassis makes those noises more noticeable.
    Those Project Carbon arms are fairly resonant.
     
    G B Kuipers likes this.
  5. Robert Godridge

    Robert Godridge Forum Resident Thread Starter

    so you think that's annoyingly normal for a pro-ject?
     
  6. Slick Willie

    Slick Willie Decisively Indecisive

    Location:
    sweet VA.

    I only listened through my laptop speakers, but yeah, prob so.
    is that table just a Debut with platter and speed control upgrade?
     
  7. Andrea_Bellucci

    Andrea_Bellucci Forum Resident

    Location:
    Italy
    Hi Robert!

    I had a Project Debut - one of the first models in the late 90s - for about 4 years and this is not normal.

    First of I would check the alignment

    Second I would check the VTF - I think it is an Ortofon 2M Red so it should be 1,8g

    Third I would wet clean your vinyl

    If all this is not gonna help, I think something is wrong with your cartridge.

    Good luck!

    Bye Andrea :wave:
     
    Lucca90 and Fishoutofwater like this.
  8. bever70

    bever70 Let No-one Live Rent Free in Your Head!

    Location:
    Belgium
    I listened on headphones, but I have no idea what you mean by a hollow creaking noise?! It sounds pretty normal to me, apart from a sound which seems to be returning with every revolution of the record/platter. Is it that what you mean ? This could be bearing noise if you get it with every album played.
     
    Fdee likes this.
  9. Robert Godridge

    Robert Godridge Forum Resident Thread Starter

    Yes that sound is indeed what I mean. What do you think I should do about it?
     
  10. Robert Godridge

    Robert Godridge Forum Resident Thread Starter

    Hi,
    I do wet clean my records with a vc-s cleaning machine.
    the tracking was set up by the store, as was the cartrage, it's done this from new.
     
  11. Robert Godridge

    Robert Godridge Forum Resident Thread Starter

    yeah and power supply upgrade as well I think. There isn't the hum issue others talk about which I'm grateful for.
    This sounds great with classical music other than that noise, which, since I just took on some 2000 lps of mostly piano related stuff, is becoming an irritant!
     
  12. bever70

    bever70 Let No-one Live Rent Free in Your Head!

    Location:
    Belgium
    If it is the bearing/motor, I have no idea what you could do about it. Maybe try to experiment with different kinds of platforms/isolation (just try some diy stuff) under your TT and see if that makes any difference. I would consult the shop and see what they say. I understand this table is new ?! Imo I would not accept this kind of noise with any table.
     
    Fdee likes this.
  13. Robert Godridge

    Robert Godridge Forum Resident Thread Starter

    A load of records and a few things later I've found that
    Manually spinning a disc with the needle on it the sound isn't there
    a finger on the stylus while the motor is going and the sound isn't there
    some records (older ones particularly) it doesn't happen every revolution, it's a quiet hollow sound that is only noticeable either with headphones or my ear literally touching the speaker
    Is there anything I can do? it seems to be from the motor rezonating through the arm or something, I'm not sure what it is or what to do about it. I was a bit stumped that the hollow sound isn't there with my finger on the stylus, just a general motor sound...
     
  14. Robert Godridge

    Robert Godridge Forum Resident Thread Starter

    I really can't be spending more money on having this looked at or afford a new turntable so I guess I'll have to experiment with stuff, see my post below yours for latest experiments
     
  15. Gabe Walters

    Gabe Walters Forum Resident

    That's pretty normal record whoosh. Could be an off-center pressing, could be a warped record, could be noisy vinyl, and could be that your table/arm is accentuating any or all of those.
     
  16. Robert Godridge

    Robert Godridge Forum Resident Thread Starter

    It's not the woosh I'm bothered about it's the hollow rezonant sound i fyou know what I mean.
     
  17. Gabe Walters

    Gabe Walters Forum Resident

    Sounds like pretty typical lead-in groove noise to me. Yes, a nicer table and arm won't emphasize it as much.
     
  18. Manimal

    Manimal Forum Resident

    Location:
    Southern US
    Man, with headphones I couldn’t really hear anything.. at all.
     
  19. bever70

    bever70 Let No-one Live Rent Free in Your Head!

    Location:
    Belgium
    After the typical lead in groove there is a returning (with every revolution of the platter) noise!
     
  20. Gabe Walters

    Gabe Walters Forum Resident

    Which is what I called the whoosh.
     
  21. Fdee

    Fdee Well-Known Member

    Location:
    California
    I can hear the bearing noise beneath the whoosh, I think this is what you may be calling the 'creaking' sound. There was a bearing upgrade available from a shop in the UK, haven't tried it so can't speak to how well it worked.

    Certainly, a table with a better bearing design will not have this.
     
    bever70 likes this.
  22. bever70

    bever70 Let No-one Live Rent Free in Your Head!

    Location:
    Belgium
    Well, if that is what is called whoosh, none of my tables have it.
     
  23. Gabe Walters

    Gabe Walters Forum Resident

    Nor mine. I think you may have missed my posts above? I said a better table will not emphasize it to this degree. It’s pretty common for records to have such noise in the lead-in groove from being press off center, or warped, for example. Better tables handle such things better.
     
  24. Gabe Walters

    Gabe Walters Forum Resident

    It’s also possible that the motor pulley needs to be lowered if it is scraping the acrylic platter, though if it is, that typically sounds worse. I had to lower my pulley when I put the acrylic platter on my Debut III. (I’ve since upgraded to the SL-1200GR, which operates silently, though is obviously in a different price class.)
     
  25. Robert Godridge

    Robert Godridge Forum Resident Thread Starter

    Argh, just tried ordering the bearing upgrade from acoustand and they're out of stock! I'm really thinking this is resonance from the tone arm at this point. I got a sealed lp last week, unsealed it and the noise is a present hollow resonance rather than a once every turn sound, and after a day or so of faffing about listening to between track breaks of maybe 30 lps this is often the case. I still want to have this tt sounding the best it possibly can!
    btw I vacume clean all my records with a vc-s so dirt isn't the issue.
     
    CraigC and Slick Willie like this.
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