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How do we lessen the influence and hold the flippers/scalpers have on the market?

Discussion in 'Marketplace Discussions' started by St. Matthew, May 23, 2021.

  1. St. Matthew

    St. Matthew Forum Resident Thread Starter

    NY, USA
    Looking at the the current market of releases, it seems like new vinyl releases and box sets are made for the flipper market. It’s common for multiple copies to be bought to keep one sealed to sell. Every other release is limited so that adds fuel to the fire. How do we fix it? How do we lessen the influence and hold the flippers/scalpers have in the market?
  2. fried

    fried Forum Resident

    Stop paying the ridiculously over-inflated prices for box sets.
    Humbler, Simon A, eddiel and 17 others like this.
  3. jimod99

    jimod99 Daddy or chips?

    Vienna, Austria
    Simple, dont buy anything from them.
    Adam9, markshan, quicksrt and 8 others like this.
  4. SpinIt

    SpinIt Active Member

    Paris, France
    I think the answer has been given and the thread can be closed :D
  5. c-eling

    c-eling Fruit Juice Everywhere

  6. mark winstanley

    mark winstanley Certified dinosaur, who likes physical product

    It's a hard call really ...
    Sure one can say don't buy anything, but sometimes it may be something that you really want, so not buying is somewhat cutting of the nose to spite the face.

    In many instances it is an industry issue ... Sure streaming is the most popular form of music consumption these days, but there are still a plethora of people buying physical product, and loving it. The figures are completely skewed anyhow, because we are getting more and more limited releases .... the limited releases are essentially to try and force people to buy items immediately, rather than wait for it to be convenient ... the problem with that though is more and more very new items are sold out very quickly, and the whole system works on supply and demand, so we get scalpers, who purchase a few copies knowing full well that in twelve months they will be all that are available, they boost the prices, and we pay through the nose...
    This all really seems to look like an industry push to get everyone streaming because they are sick of playing this rush, or pay system that has fallen into place.
    If items are selling out, and anyone buying music, knows that they are, the logical thing to do would be to press more copies.... the difference in cost between pressing a thousand copies and ten thousand copies are negligible, as it is the set up that costs the most... So I can't really see the rationale of the thinking....

    Anyway. The industry is in a sad state of affairs, and some folks are taking advantage of that... You either rush in and buy stuff on pre-order, or you risk it selling out and decide if you want to pay inflated secondhand market prices.... It's that simple really.
    Shawn and zphage like this.
  7. uncarvedbloke

    uncarvedbloke Forum Resident

    UK - SOT
    Buy multiple copies of stuff and sell it cheaper than you paid for it :)
  8. I’m the biggest 90’s and 2000’s Bowie fan there is — I’d literally take all of Bowie’s POST-“Tin Machine” output (along with Tin Machine) to that proverbial ‘desert island’ — over all his pre-“Tin Machine”’output...

    But I did not buy even one of the recent Brilliant Live Adventures releases, because the thought of paying separate shipping for 6 different CD’s — just because they make the system work that way — and then if I missed out on any of them, I’d have to pay inflated prices on eBay, or from wherever.

    I held the line. If they make them available some other less bats**t insane way in the future, great!! If not, it’s their loss.

    I would have gladly ponied up for a single unified 7 (or was it 8?) CD box set of the whole thing. But I was not gonna pay an extra $50 or more in unnecessary shipping charges, let along more per release via any 3nd-party channels. NOT. GUNNA. DO. IT.
    Simon A and mark winstanley like this.
  9. Rfreeman

    Rfreeman Forum Resident

    Lawrenceville, NJ
    Sell things at their market value the first time.
  10. SpinIt

    SpinIt Active Member

    Paris, France
    Sure, I want a Ferrari but it doesn’t mean I’ll buy one!

    On a more serious note, I think a lot is purchased at much inflated prices because some buyers think they must have it, instead of really wanting it because the release is a valuable addition to their record collection. It’s because of fear of missing out, or in other words: hype.
    TimB likes this.
  11. Ray Blend

    Ray Blend • vinyls •

    The Midwest
    • purchase mirror
    • look into mirror
    Vinyl Addict and JoeRockhead like this.
  12. onlyconnect

    onlyconnect The prose and the passion

    Winchester, UK
    Sure, but that wasn't the flippers, it was the record company.

  13. Jamsterdammer

    Jamsterdammer Forum Resident

    It's all about $$$. The record companies have every interest in catering to what the OP refers to as "flippers/scalpers" as these help to artificially increase scarcity and inflate resell prices. The limited release is sold out quickly and people who manage to lay their on such a release pay a ridiculous price to begin with as they are afraid to miss out and know that prices will quickly increase on the resell market where people who missed out will pay even more ridiculous prices. The "flippers/scalpers" meanwhile, by selling their extra copies, quickly recoup their investment with a profit and the original release practically for free. Meanwhile, the record companies start thinking about the next release to fleece collectors. It's a (perfectly legal) racket and a bit like the diamond market, really.
    showtaper likes this.
  14. mark winstanley

    mark winstanley Certified dinosaur, who likes physical product

    I can't speak for anyone else, but I buy music i want, and couldn't give a crap about collectability
    Dave, tyinkc, Duncan Day and 2 others like this.
  15. cmcintyre

    cmcintyre Forum Resident

    Surely, in free market societies, people are allowed, and encouraged, to make a buck any which way they can.

    Surely, you're not suggesting that there are better, or fairer, ways to organise and let our economies run?
    scotto likes this.
  16. JoeRockhead

    JoeRockhead Forum Resident

    New Jersey
    wow, breaking news. Business tries to make money.
  17. Jamsterdammer

    Jamsterdammer Forum Resident

    Indeed. Yet it always surprises me to see threads like this one, as if music is some kind of public good to which we are all entitled. It's a product that will sell at whatever the market will bear and the "flippers/scalpers" are simply part of the business model.
    Dave and Vinyl Addict like this.
  18. bRETT

    bRETT Forum Resident

    Boston MA
    Modest proposal: Make sure people are aware that when they search online for concert tickets, the first click they make will probably be a secondary seller with inflated prices. (I was recently offered the chance to pay $200 for a $70 Wilco ticket, which aren't close to selling out at face value).

    Of course Google could crack down on this, but they won't.
  19. markreed

    markreed Forum Resident

    Don't buy off them. They'll be holding lots of dead stock. A record is only ever worth what someone else is prepared to pay.
    Sprague Dawley likes this.
  20. Discogs and eBay have at the same time both inflated and leveled the marketplace. Knowledge, information is a doubled edged sword.

    ( If theOP is referring to the weird Amazon practice of space/price grifters who list crazy prices that no one would/should pay, the best practice is patience, wait them out).

    I have found many of these flipper threads seem to be really about frustration at not being able to get it at a price when one wants it, patience, grasshopper, patience.
  21. SongAndDanceMan

    SongAndDanceMan Forum Resident

    Waiting for the inevitable "BUT MUH FREE MARKET!!!" guy to come in as if they are if no one knows what that is.
    RudolphS and Colocally like this.
  22. fried

    fried Forum Resident

    Oh my! Imagine how much money record companies could make if they pre-ordered their own limited edition vinyl and resold it all on Eday. Where's the tinfoil hat emoji?
    Dave and Mang like this.
  23. St. Matthew

    St. Matthew Forum Resident Thread Starter

    NY, USA
    Flippers/Scalpers manipulate market value.
  24. rcsrich

    rcsrich Forum Resident

    Limiting the number of copies sold to each buyer to two might help some, but the record companies are in the business to make money, and really it’s not their responsibility…a buyer is a buyer.

    About the only thing you can do as an individual is not buy from scalpers and flippers if they’re asking ridiculous prices. Problem is, now that the world is the market, somebody somewhere is always willing to pay the crazy price.
    Jamsterdammer likes this.
  25. Cool Chemist

    Cool Chemist Forum Resident

    Bath, England
    If you can't beat them, join them.
    quicksrt likes this.

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