I finally burned an LP scammer on Ebay

Discussion in 'Marketplace Discussions' started by Led9, Sep 7, 2019.

  1. Combination

    Combination Forum Resident

    Location:
    New Orleans
    It greatly surprises me that he didn't go through ebay to give him a shipping label, because they would have supplied him with one, and it would have covered at least 2-3 pounds postage.
     
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  2. 12" 45rpm

    12" 45rpm Forum Resident

    Location:
    New York City
    My guess is there is not enough evidence for ebay to be 100% sure he is selling forgeries. Or nobody has spent enough effort to supply ebay with the evidence. I assume ebay operates like our justice system, whereby it's better to have 10 guilty people acquitted than have 1 innocent person wrongfully convicted.. However, an astute buyer should be able to look at past feedback and such to determine a seller's credibility.. In this case, it is interesting how he managed to get the negative feedback deleted..
     
  3. All Down The Line

    All Down The Line Forum Resident

    Location:
    Australia
    Because eBay Lurve profits!
     
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  4. eddiel

    eddiel Forum Resident

    Location:
    Toronto, Canada
    I expect he complained, made some song and dance about it, and eBay gave him the benefit of the doubt since the majority of his buyers are ignorant enough to fall for the scam and hence do not complain, or if they do, they do what 99% of people who complain do; ask for their money back, get it and then don't leave any feedback. :)
     
    12" 45rpm likes this.
  5. Christian Hill

    Christian Hill It's all in the mind

    Location:
    Boston

    Did you email them at any time within the 25 days the seller held onto it before mailing?
     
  6. mrjinks

    mrjinks Optimistically Challenged

    Location:
    Boise, ID.
    Thanks for responding.

    No, I didn't contact the seller, because I believe the item was marked as "shipped" (but without a tracking #), and it said an "estimated arrival date" of something like up to 20 days after my payment. Then, on about the last day of that "arriving" range, I suddenly got a tracking number and it took another week to arrive.
     
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  7. Raunchnroll

    Raunchnroll Forum Resident

    Location:
    Seattle
    Scamming is, luckily, the exception, but it still happens frequently enough - whether one is a buyer or a seller.

    If selling at a brick & mortar you have to accept a certain percentage of theft and damage. If you sell on line, my experience is a near equivalent degree of 'loss' occurs. For example the scam noted here, or simple loss or damge in transit.

    As for higher profits online, that may have some truth but you have to factor in fees and your packing costs and the time - and returns. If you value your time as 'zero' then yes, online sales are usually more profitable. But if you're doing any volume you have to factor the time for writing descriptions, photography, posting, post-sale processing, packaging, and carrier / shipper receipt. Then theres the complaints and returns which are a hassle even if only say 2-3%.

    There is no algorithm that detects honesty. ebay sets policies that favor their desired business practices. Its not a personal thing whatsoever. One can go online to read horror stories by both buyers and sellers using ebay. Having nearly a half century now of sales in various hobbies, I found ebays policies track about the same market conditions & risks as exist otherwise. As a seller there are precautions one can take, but you cannot fully eliminate scams.

    Your statement that you are 'very careful' who you sell to is irrelevant when selling in an auction or mail order. You can set conditions for buyers (such as country etc) -- but you don't get to decide who purchases. Besides, scammers don't necessarily look or act like scammers. There are signals one should be aware of, but even these don't prevent occasional bad transactions. Luckily most people are honest.
     
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  8. Raunchnroll

    Raunchnroll Forum Resident

    Location:
    Seattle
    You are correct. It is difficult to remove skilled scammers from ebay. I know an antique dealer, very trustworthy and noted in the field, who ferrets out fakirs and scammers. Some years ago he started a website dedicated to one notorious scammer selling forgeries and fakes on ebay. Complete with forensic indentification of his ebay sales and commentary from well known experts in the business.

    This fakir actually ingratiated himself to ebay somehow and became one of their resident 'experts.' He used that position to flag authentic valuables being auctioned on ebay and get them removed, then, through an alternate identity, contact the seller to try and effect a private sale, at a greatly reduced price of course. This fakir was so well known in the field that he was shunned from shows and got flagged & banned on other publications so for a while he was having a hey day on ebay - even to the point someone at ebay trusted him (and why wouldnt they? they're not experts in the subject). Anyway, the website along with some correspondance from an attorneys office finally got the dude banned. But it still took over a year as I recall.

    Another thing, having decades of experience here, some people who get duped for large amounts of money don't complain out of sheer embarassment and the unlikely prospect (not to mention expense) of ever recovering their loss. Its a strange thing to see & experience. On the other hand I've known of some pretty brutal ways that fakirs have been dealt with. As one fellow said, the kind of guy that can fork over 100k cash for a collectible is not the kind of fellow you want to rip off 100k from. Like the song says: Dirty deeds, done dirt cheap!
     
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  9. TheSeldomSeenKid

    TheSeldomSeenKid Forum Resident

    [​IMG]
     
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  10. Raunchnroll

    Raunchnroll Forum Resident

    Location:
    Seattle
    Hah! I was thinking of that pawn shop 'basement' scene in Pulp Fiction where Marcellus sez -- total dead pan voice -- that hes about to call a couple of pipe-hittin' (bruthas) to come by with some pliers and a blow torch...... :yikes:
     
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  11. 12" 45rpm

    12" 45rpm Forum Resident

    Location:
    New York City
    One can still cancel a sale after the payment has been made. I've done it on ebay and discogs. Not because the buyer was a scammer though.. I am sure ebay/discogs don't like it if you make it a habit, but once in a blue moon is ok I think..
     
  12. 12" 45rpm

    12" 45rpm Forum Resident

    Location:
    New York City
    The photography/posting/description one has to do anyways if you sell locally via craigslist or facebook marketplace. Packaging and shipping is easy for me since I keep a large supply of boxes and such in the attic from stuff that gets shipped to me. I enjoy packaging them up because I am "reusing" instead of "recycling" my boxes.

    In my area USPS does free pickups so I don't have to make any trip to PO. I suppose this can be a hassle if they don't and PO is out of the way..

    In the end I find it much easier to ship something off and forget about it. When I sell locally I have to deal with so many annoying non-serious people asking dumb questions like "Is it available? Where are you located?" . Then when you find a buyer you waste time trying to coordinate schedules for a pickup. Then they never show up...
     
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  13. kwadguy

    kwadguy Senior Member

    Location:
    Cambridge, MA
    If the item is as described and just shipped late I wouldn't leave feedback on this case unless it will be positive.

    That is, unless you had to push the seller to ship at all.
     
  14. mrjinks

    mrjinks Optimistically Challenged

    Location:
    Boise, ID.
    Thanks for your input.
     
  15. Strat-Mangler

    Strat-Mangler Forum Resident

    Location:
    Toronto
    It's much simpler than that. Nobody knows enough about this stuff on eBay's side to easily say they're forgeries.

    If someone were selling a Sony which was branded as a Sany, eBay would easily accept it as a forgery. But pressing details like this might be obvious or common knowledge to us but eBay just doesn't know what we're talking about. In the end, they give the benefit of the doubt to whoever makes them money ; the seller.

    Manipulating the system and having the platform owners allow you to do so is nothing new. Discogs does the same thing. There's a seller (can't remember his alias right now) I saw a couple of days ago whose feedback was so low that I just had to check it out. At least 2 dozen complaints about the seller giving out false tracking numbers to shut up inquiring buyers, them waiting forever, and then needing to open a dispute to get their money back. Sometimes, the seller would even admit to not having the album in stock. Meanwhile, these buyers had to go through all this hassle.

    How Discogs allows him to continue to operate is beyond me. Nevertheless, the members who continue to buy from him are equally puzzling to me.
     
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  16. Christian Hill

    Christian Hill It's all in the mind

    Location:
    Boston

    Was a movie poster seller?
     
  17. Led9

    Led9 Forum Resident Thread Starter

    Location:
    Allentown, PA
    Update from the original posted situation:
    The return package finally arrived. I suspected because it's an Ebay generated label the weight (9 ounces) might not be on the label (which it wasn't). But I had a backup plan. I waited for the mail carrier to come and had him witness me opening the box and he signed a paper stating it was empty with his name. So now it's back to the Ebay call center to add the final evidence. Stay tuned.....
     
  18. 12" 45rpm

    12" 45rpm Forum Resident

    Location:
    New York City
    Why did you start this thread without having received the return package? This whole 9oz thing is irrelevant since USPS almost never audits weights. There is something fishy about this whole story. I doubt ebay is going to vote in your favor..
     
  19. Led9

    Led9 Forum Resident Thread Starter

    Location:
    Allentown, PA
    Hey I've been restraining myself pretty well through two weeks of this BS.o_OJust got off the phone with Ebay. Case has been decided in my favor and he will be investigated further for fraud. Even got an official Ebay message confirming my win and the buyer will not be refunded. The sweet smell of victory!
     
    Last edited: Sep 10, 2019
  20. Led9

    Led9 Forum Resident Thread Starter

    Location:
    Allentown, PA
    I called the PO because the package was late and asked what it weighed when it was shipped (9 ounces). That's how I knew it was definitely the empty box scam coming even before it arrived and why i was waiting to get a witness. That along with much more shadyness from messages with this guy previously. Smarter than the rat!
     
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  21. Guitarded

    Guitarded Forum Resident

    Location:
    Montana
    If you sell on eBay, you have to sell with 'No Returns, No Exchanges, No Refunds'.

    Doesn't mean you can't choose to return, exchange, or refund. Just that yuor policy is NONE.

    Paypal and eBay will try and get you to change your listings for promotions and fee discounts.
    But they can't make you accept returns.
     
  22. Led9

    Led9 Forum Resident Thread Starter

    Location:
    Allentown, PA
    That doesn't change anything. All the buyer has to do is say it is not as described and it will come back to you at your cost. No way around it.
     
  23. Guitarded

    Guitarded Forum Resident

    Location:
    Montana
    I have not encountered this issue. But, I also document everything I sell at each step of the sale. I also make sure I have contact with the Buyer, post sale, to reiterate the terms and confirm the condition / description.

    Not once have I had eBay/PayPal force a return on me. They can be a pain about it, but they will always give in if you have your bases covered.
     
  24. Christian Hill

    Christian Hill It's all in the mind

    Location:
    Boston
    lol, I guess threats wasn't the smart route after all
     
  25. Aftermath

    Aftermath Senior Member

    Nice work!! Seriously, this is great. :edthumbs:
     
    Strat-Mangler likes this.

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