Icehouse: Album by Album

Discussion in 'Music Corner' started by KangaMom, Feb 20, 2021.

  1. KangaMom

    KangaMom Queen of the Quokkas Thread Starter

    I guess we could extrapolate from the box office for Master and Commander. According to Wikipedia the budget for the film was $150 million. The box office was $211.6 million. And that's before DVD, broadcast, and soundtrack sales....
     
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  2. JeffMo

    JeffMo Format Agnostic

    Location:
    New England
    If Iva was fairly well compensated for that soundtrack, it would also help explain his “retirement” from the music business. Coupled of course with his disenchantment with Chrysalis fiasco and his focus on raising a family.

    Now with collapse of that industry the money is in touring, so we may not see new material from Iva/Icehouse which is a shame.
     
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  3. JeffMo

    JeffMo Format Agnostic

    Location:
    New England
    NGD is their masterpiece to my ears.

    Btw, you are right that I do love “Ghost of Time”!
     
  4. KangaMom

    KangaMom Queen of the Quokkas Thread Starter

    Unless Iva opens the vaults and releases any original music or demos he has lying around....
    But I think Iva is quite happy with Icehouse being a touring band (on a limited basis), which I guess why not? It's like having a really big blowout party about 10 times a year that you also get paid for. And I'm sure there's money to be made on that circuit even within the confines of Australia and NZ.
     
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  5. morgan1098

    morgan1098 Forum Resident

    Ok, thoughts on the music now:
    • As a solo project Ghost of Time really shines. Iva pioneered the use of the Linn drum and the Prophet 5 for Primitive Man way back in 82, but with Ghost of Time he takes keyboards and programming to a whole new level. The drum loop on "Great Southern Land (2000)" is uh-mazing and I love how it fades in during the second part of the first verse. Subtle but very cool. As @KangaMom has noted, the iconic synth tone from the original track has been replaced here by the symphony strings and probably some background synth. But what stands out to me is the complete absence of percussion until that drum loop slowly fades in. It's almost like you're holding your breath in that moment.
    • The drum loop on "Walk Alone" is awesome as well. It's got an excellent groove and then around the 6:20 mark the Rom=Pari drum samples kick in and it just takes flight. So good!
    • The first time I heard GSL2000 I was taken aback by the pauses Iva inserts near the end of the verses, "Standing in the summer... for a million years." But it works. It makes the whole song feel more introspective.
    • It's not just synths and drum programming, though. The cool new descending bass line at the beginning of each verse of GSL 2000--and all the cool new bass guitar parts on this song? Iva. The screaming rock god guitar at the end of GSL2000 and throughout some of the other pieces? Iva. The amazing piano that is sometimes ambient and sometimes jazzy and improvised-sounding? Iva. (I realize there is also a piano player credited with the symphony, Catherine Davis, but I think most of what you hear in the more rhythmic sections of this album are Iva).
    • Iva does all the heavy lifting here but that is not to say the symphony and percussion from other contributors aren't awesome as well. I tend to be a bit suspicious of the "electric violin" much of the time, but it really works here. On the longer "Ghost of Time" piece it sounds like Richard Tognetti and Iva are facilitating a conversation between their respective instruments, the electric violin and the electric guitar.
    • There's a long passage of interplay between guitar and violin leading up to around the 14-minute mark in "Ghost of Time" and then it suddenly builds into this massive introduction of the familiar "Great Southern Land" melody and it sounds like the entire song is just about to launch into orbit. And then suddenly everything goes quiet again and there is a brief and spooky repose before we enter the grand finale, the last 6 minutes of the song that become GSL2000. When those mournful French horns kick in playing the original synth tone, it almost brings a tear to my eye. So gorgeous.
    • This is a great headphones album. There are so many layers. I'm a big fan of film music when it can stand on its own, and I have already declared my love for electronic music and longer-form pieces. So when you add in one of my all time favorite rock songs, "Great Southern Land," yes, the Ghost of Time pretty much checks all the right boxes for me.
     
  6. JeffMo

    JeffMo Format Agnostic

    Location:
    New England
    I was very impressed with the clips that KangaMom posted, so much so that I tracked down and ordered an OOP used cd.

    Interesting that Iva revisits GSL so often (about once a decade with a new remix or arrangement). And named first comp after that great song too.
     
  7. KangaMom

    KangaMom Queen of the Quokkas Thread Starter

    Yes, Great Southern Land is a song that keeps recurring. It's quite interesting considering that the original is fairly lean instrumentally - I mean mostly there is a lot of space in the original arrangement. I've always liked the loping kind of feel of the chugging guitars in the original which I guess is like a rhythm line in a wider sense.

    I was going to post some thoughts on Master and Commander but have decided that I want to try and re-listen to Ghost of Time and Master and Commander via headphones (inspired a bit by the comments upthread). Unfortunately I've left my good headphones at work...so it's going to have to wait.

    (Also a minor trauma of having accidentally hidden my version of Master and Commander in my iTunes library - it has taken me the best part of the last hour to figure out what actually happened...)
     
  8. KangaMom

    KangaMom Queen of the Quokkas Thread Starter

    OK, this is 100% correct. Listening to this album on headphones is incredible!

    Just on a side note: Aren't there elements of Walk Alone that ended up on Master and Commander. I want to say maybe on the track "The Phasmid"?
     
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  9. KangaMom

    KangaMom Queen of the Quokkas Thread Starter

    Master and Commander Soundtrack
    Disclaimer: I have never seen the movie, nor have I read any of the books by Patrick O’Brien. So essentially all I know about this movie is that it involves a seafaring captain who has adventures on the high sea, and is best mates with the ship’s surgeon.

    I can see why Peter Weir tapped the Davies/Gordon/Tognetti trio to compose the score for his film after hearing Ghost of Time. Loads of elements of Ghost of Time are used within the incidental pieces on this soundtrack (as already outlined upthread by @morgan1098).

    The soundtrack is a combination of interludes to support the visuals of the film, with classical pieces (several excellent violin and cello pieces) that I’ve read were portrayals of the captain and surgeon music playing. The pieces written for the movie are quite evocative, in fact I like the use of the taiko drums (again) as a means of describing the forward progress of the ship and the hollow sounds you might hear below deck. There’s also some nice synth touches in some of the pieces - maybe indicating the adventure at hand. The strings add a little melancholy and drama to the instrumentation. Like Endless Ocean on Ghost of Time, there's an excellent deployment of instruments to evoke the feeling of being on the ocean with long horizons and long days. My understanding is that one of the criticisms of the soundtrack was that it wasn't all seafaring bombast - I say, thank goodness for that. I personally think that the composers have done a great job of evoking the sea and the immense distances and occasional danger confronting these sailors.

    Overall the incidental compositions taps right into the atmosphere of what it may have been like to be a sailor. The long days far away from landfall, having to make your own amusements, and the sounds of being on a ship. So the flapping sails, the noise against the hull. I quite like it - it helps that I like a lot of the orchestral pieces in their own right so I have no trouble listening to the entire soundtrack.
     
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  10. KangaMom

    KangaMom Queen of the Quokkas Thread Starter

    Like @JeffMo I'm probably now on the lookout for a copy of Ghost of Time...
     
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  11. StefanWq

    StefanWq Forum Resident

    Location:
    Vallentuna, Sweden
    Circles in the Sky

    Songs written for big sports events, like the Olympics, are like their own genre. They're not songs with small, subtle gestures and details, they have to sound grand in a big arena and, presumably, also appeal to persons who are not previously fans of the artist. When I hear "Circles in the Sky", it is hard to imagine how it would fit onto a regular Icehouse/Iva album, but as a song written for the Olympics I think it is one of the better tracks. It features all the parts I would expect for such a song - strings and majestic horns, a choir and an anthemic melody coupled with positive, pepping lyrics. Iva sings it really well and I think he also manages to avoid cliches both musically and lyrically. As a song I think it grows with repeated listening. When I first heard it back when it was new, it felt like a so-so track but it keeps getting better. It's a shame it's only been released as a CD single which is now rare and that it doesn't stream on Spotify etc. It would have been nice to have had it included on White Heat even if it was credited as a Iva Davies solo release.

    The alternative mixes are interesting to hear too, but I prefer the original version.
     
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  12. KangaMom

    KangaMom Queen of the Quokkas Thread Starter

    Although it's pretty interesting that Iva didn't set out to write this for the Olympics. Originally it was a song inspired by his children's drawings. It was only after he completed it that he thought it may have been suitable for the Olympics in Sydney.
     
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  13. morgan1098

    morgan1098 Forum Resident

    I find this fascinating! I mean, "Circles in the Sky" just makes me think of those Olympic rings, so it's interesting to think that this track didn't originate with a request from the Olympic Committee.

    Speaking of which, I didn't really share my thoughts on "Circles in the Sky":
    • It's very much in the same vein as Ghost of Time. It would be great if these two rare releases could be reissued together again like Razorback/Boxes, they would fit together perfectly being Iva solo projects and sharing an Olympics connection.
    • Rather than the Sydney Symphony, which we heard on Ghost of Time, this time the symphonic elements are from the Australian Chamber Orchestra. It's probably just an omission in the liner notes, but the ACO is credited only with "strings," which means the giant burst of brass you hear at the beginning and end of the track is actually a keyboard or a sample.
    • There are 5 backing vocalists credited, which is kind of an interesting change for Iva. In the Icehouse days the band members would typically do backing vocals, but here he has a chorus of singers adding depth and color. I like how some of the female vocals sound almost like soul singers in places. And the harmonies sound good too, a rather different approach than the layered "choir of Iva" vocals from Berlin.
    • Like @StefanWq, I prefer the original version of the track, but the two remixes are good, another showcase for Iva's skills with keyboards and programming. It's cool that he plays oboe here, too. No bass guitar this time, though, that's all handled by the keyboards. Both the "Sphere Mix" and "Trance Mix" sound like someone is playing Indian tablas, but since there isn't a percussionist credited anywhere I'm guessing these are just samples from Iva's keyboard.
    • I'm just revisiting the "Sphere Mix" again... listen to those bass synths!! They are all over the place and occasionally take some deep dives. If those were a bit higher in the mix, this could actually be one of the earliest examples of a dubstep track. Iva blazing the trail!
    I can't really add much to what has already been said about the Master and Commander soundtrack. I saw the movie solely because I knew Iva had done the music. I expected to hear obvious passages from The Ghost of Time throughout, but you don't really get that in the movie. The soundtrack is an interesting listen and a prestigious project for Iva, but I have to admit I listen to Ghost of Time and "Circles in the Sky" far more often.

    Oh, and we aren't discussing it here, but there is apparently a CD release of Iva's soundtrack for The Incredible Journey of Mary Bryant. It isn't even listed on Discogs, but here's a copy on ebay from Australia: The Incredible Journey of Mary Bryant-2005-Original Movie Soundtrack-25 Track-CD | eBay

    I'd be curious to hear someone's thoughts on this one. I probably wouldn't fork out big money for it unless there's a glowing review from someone here, and I'll hope to find a much cheaper used copy someday.
     
    Last edited: May 20, 2021
  14. KangaMom

    KangaMom Queen of the Quokkas Thread Starter

    Now, that seems odd regarding the ACO credit. Because for sure they have horn players - hard to believe that Iva didn't just ask Richard to bring the horn players along to the session!

    Backing vocalists - Christine Anu, Wendy Matthews, Annie Crummer, Ian Moss (ex Cold Chisel), Mark Williams. They all have solo careers so it's top flight BV really. Of those, at least 3 of them I can peg as definitely having R&B influence in their solo work (Wendy Matthews, Ian Moss, Mark Williams). I don't really know how to categorize Christine Anu and Annie Crummer - pacifica style perhaps. They are very good vocalists.

    I noted upthread that I would have done a hybrid of the trance and sphere mixes. Now I'm going to have to circle back with headphones on to listen for those bass synths - maybe that's what I liked about the sphere mix.
     
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  15. JeffMo

    JeffMo Format Agnostic

    Location:
    New England
    This is aggravating. If Iva was releasing Icehouse and solo albums in alternating years like Steve Kilbey does with The Church, I could easily forgive the occasional OOP rarity.

    But with No New Original Icehouse material since 1993, Iva doesn't get a free pass from me. Instead he gets "Come On Man".

    The further we get in this thread the more I'm concluding that Iva did not fully live up to his potential (which in fairness was a high bar given his talent).
     
  16. KangaMom

    KangaMom Queen of the Quokkas Thread Starter

    Yeah, it's aggravating for us as fans but not very surprising given Iva's candid confession that he finds songwriting quite difficult. I'd love it if he would do more music - even if it were ballet or film scores. He clearly does have some good songs left in him (we'll see this with Bipolar Poems) and I read in some interview that just for the heck of it, he and Michael Paynter wrote a song together, Where Iva asked Michael to come up with something he thought young people would want to listen to. Apparently they shopped the song but most artists (rightly) want to record their own music (if for nothing else the royalties). It has not seen the light of day either (to my knowledge). Apparently it wasn't the style that Michael Paynter is normally known for either.

    So, there is stuff in the vaults. We just haven't heard it.

    On a happier note, I ordered the Icehouse box set yesterday (birthday present!). Expecting it to arrive tomorrow...:goodie:
     
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  17. KangaMom

    KangaMom Queen of the Quokkas Thread Starter

    A reminder that we'll be staring on the remixes on Sunday. That would be
    1. Extended Mixes V1
    2. Extended Mixes V2
    3. Meltdown
    4. Endless Ocean (Paul Reef vs. Icehouse)
    I'm hoping that people will highlight their favorite remixes from these 4 albums. It should be noted that V2 contains essentially Full Circle (minus the Melt Steel Pts1-3).

    I'm excited to read some recommendations from those who are more familiar with the remixes!

    Bipolar Poems on May 30.
     
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  18. morgan1098

    morgan1098 Forum Resident

    Wow, thanks for the info on the background singers! I didn’t recognize any of those names but it sounds like they have some serious cred.
     
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  19. KangaMom

    KangaMom Queen of the Quokkas Thread Starter

    I should have mentioned that Wendy Matthews did some of the backing vocals on Code Blue. Also she was a member of Australian Band The Models as well as being a solo artist.
    Ian Moss did the guitar on "Skin" on the debut album, Icehouse. But in Australia he's known for being in the band Cold Chisel (Guitar and vocals) as well as a highly successful solo career. Just personally, some of the best Cold Chisel songs have been sung by Ian Moss (e.g. Bow River, When the War is Over) and he wasn't the lead singer (that would be Jimmy Barnes).
    Christine Anu is well known as a solo artist within Australia particularly the cover of the Warumpi Band song "My Island Home". She is also in demand for musical theatre.
    Mark Williams is a New Zealand singer best known for the song "Show No Mercy" produced (I think) with Vanda and Young.
    Annie Crummer is a New Zealand solo artist who has worked with the NZ bands The Herbs and Split Enz. She has been in the Australian productions of Rent and We will Rock You.

    So yeah, Iva pulled some pretty serious quality for a single song. You combine it with Richard Tognetti's violin playing (the ACO is really the premier chamber orchestra in Australia) and there's a lot of quality being brought to bear on this 4 minute song!
     
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  20. morgan1098

    morgan1098 Forum Resident

    With no offense to the "indie" feel of Big Wheel and Full Circle, but Ghost of Time and "Circles in the Sky" are proof that you can sometimes accomplish good things with a bigger budget and the backing of a major record company (Warner).
     
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  21. JeffMo

    JeffMo Format Agnostic

    Location:
    New England
    Happy birthday! :pineapple:

    Great present too. Which albums are included in that box?
     
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  22. HitAndRun

    HitAndRun Forum Resident

    I'll give a New Zealand perspective on both. I first became aware of Mark Williams as an interpreter of classic songs. E.g. here he is singing Paul Anka's 'It Doesn't Matter Anymore'.



    After going to Australia, he carved out a quite different niche, and it was surprising to some of us in NZ how his career changed. He'd perhaps gone 'upmarket'.

    Annie Crummer has released a few albums and there are, IMHO, some very nice songs on them. She has also acted, and probably other things as well. I feel she was very talented and I'm not sure what happened to her career. Though, doing musicals sounds like a good use of her very nice singing voice. Here is 'U Soul Me'.

    Four albums is going to be quite a bit to get through this week :o

    Happy Birthday @KangaMom.
     
    Last edited: May 21, 2021
  23. KangaMom

    KangaMom Queen of the Quokkas Thread Starter

    Although perhaps not Code Blue? Although apparently by the time we all finished discussing that album we concluded that we liked the album and that it was under-rated. (except for @JeffMo who will have nothing to do with Icehouse post 1990 ;))
     
  24. KangaMom

    KangaMom Queen of the Quokkas Thread Starter

    10 CDs
    Icehouse
    Primitive Man
    Sidewalk
    Measure for Measure
    Man of Colours
    Code Blue
    Big Wheel
    Berlin Tapes
    DubHouse
    In Concert

    This is the 40th anniversary set. Who knows, Iva may change record labels next year and release a deluxe set with vault material and then I'll have to buy it all over again, but I got sick of waiting to have it on physical media.
    I don't recall if this is the box set that still has the DVD in it as well. It's kind of irrelevant because I would just watch the videos on some other media anyway.

    Many thanks for the Birthday wishes @JeffMo and @HitAndRun - hey, it's another year and I didn't die from COVID and have much to be thankful for!
     
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  25. KangaMom

    KangaMom Queen of the Quokkas Thread Starter

    Many thanks @HitAndRun for bringing the NZ perspective. I don't know very much about either of them except that they would reappear periodically on the radio and in different projects.

    Yes, 4 albums is a lot. I'm working on the premise that you should just do a shallow listen (so to speak) and see if anything leaps out at you. No doubt others on this thread have a perspective on some of these remixes and can help the rest of us circle back (or not) on potential highlights. I've put all the remix like stuff together simply because if we went through them each individually there is only so much you can say about the same song... The one true new song among the 4 albums is "Lay your Hands on Me" on Meltdown.

    (My own strategy is currently to find all the songs I really like e.g. Hey Little Girl, and then listen to the remixes across all the albums and see if there are any I like or think are an improvement).
     
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