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SH Spotlight If you have a turntable you need to play your mono records in true MONO. How to do it cheaply..

Discussion in 'Music Corner' started by Steve Hoffman, May 14, 2006.

  1. Rich C

    Rich C Forum Resident

    Location:
    Northbrook, IL
    This looks like much better quality than I'm currently using. Could you please let me know the manufacturer?
     
  2. Holerbot6000

    Holerbot6000 Forum Resident

    Location:
    California
    Just made my first double-Y chord - $10 for 2 adapters at Radio Shack. Can't wait to try it. Thanks for the tip!
    [​IMG]
     
  3. veejaycollector

    veejaycollector Forum Resident

    Location:
    Durham, NC
    Radio Shack brand units. Not sure all of their stores stocks them.
     
    Rich C likes this.
  4. Rich C

    Rich C Forum Resident

    Location:
    Northbrook, IL
    Thanks, veejay!
     
  5. Tyler Chastain

    Tyler Chastain Forum Resident

    Location:
    New Orleans
    Just got some cables from radio shack, the only male-to-male connector was 6ft long though.
    Tried it on The Cowsills "Rain, The Park and Other Things". Still surface noise as the 45 is pretty worn, but lowered the noise floor to make it completely listenable, unlike before!

    Love the y-cable through tape monitor method, it's like having an actual mono button!
     
  6. Tyler Chastain

    Tyler Chastain Forum Resident

    Location:
    New Orleans
    And i'm sure this has already been answered in the course of this thread but I couldn't find a page specifically mentioning it, but does this article (http://www.rane.com/note109.html) have any relevance to what I'm doing?

    I'm still learning all the ins and outs of "audiophile-dom" and I don't quite understand it.
     
  7. slstokes2216

    slstokes2216 Forum Resident

    Location:
    USA
    I haven't seen this question asked- should the cable coming from the switch to the phono pre be a mic level phono cable or a line level standard interconnect?
     
  8. bigal00769

    bigal00769 Forum Resident

    Location:
    Bedford, TX
    I agree wholeheartedly. Got some Audioquest y cables and what a difference it made. Thanks Steve!
     
  9. Jasonb

    Jasonb Forum Resident

    Well I never knew!! Sorry if this has been answered elsewhere but does the mono switch on older amps do the same thing? Should I use it when playing mono records or is that just some weird button they always put on amps if you wanted a mono sound from a stereo recording.
     
  10. Gregory Earl

    Gregory Earl Senior Member

    Location:
    Kantucki
    Yes, you want to use it while playing mono records. You'll get an extra high end hiss that is very noticeable if you don't.

    Try it both ways and see.....hear for yourself.
     
  11. Kubricker

    Kubricker Senior Member

    Location:
    Atlanta
    Yeah should work.
     
  12. Jasonb

    Jasonb Forum Resident

    Thanks guys. Funny, I have Stan Getz on Verve mono playing as I read these.
     
  13. Gregory Earl

    Gregory Earl Senior Member

    Location:
    Kantucki
    Love the Getz on Verve in mono. Verrrrrve.:goodie:
     
    Jasonb likes this.
  14. Jasonb

    Jasonb Forum Resident

    I think you were right about the high end. Close, but a little nicer sound with the button in. Always wondered about that button but never had mono records before and have had high end equipment over the years. Have a nice 90's Rotel amp with phono out and that mono button. Not sure if modern amps have that anymore.
     
  15. Gregory Earl

    Gregory Earl Senior Member

    Location:
    Kantucki
    It's on some nicer equipment but not on most. Also on a lot of vintage stuff. I wouldn't buy a pre-amp or integrated amp without the convenience. It was a must have for me while shopping for a preamp as I was just getting in to Bebop Jazz.

    As this threads OP (God) posted, there is a nice work-around. Most folks are not mono fans....but Jazz or Beatles fans.....they are another breed. There are other bands and or genres to appreciate in straight up mono too.
     
    Last edited: May 9, 2015
    Jasonb likes this.
  16. AppleCorp3

    AppleCorp3 Forum Resident

    I know this is likely a dumb question but - why?
     
  17. Gregory Earl

    Gregory Earl Senior Member

    Location:
    Kantucki
    AppleCorp3 likes this.
  18. AppleCorp3

    AppleCorp3 Forum Resident

    Thank you!!
     
  19. Mal

    Mal Phorum Physicist

    For stereo records (Westrex 45-45 system), the two channels, L and R, are inverted polarity-wise with respect to one another before cutting in order to maintain compatibility with playback using a mono cartridge (reads lateral movement only - so, will retrieve L+R from a Westrex 45-45 cut stereo program).

    A stereo cartridge restores the original relative polarity relationship of the channels but since the channels aren't summed (as they are in playback with the mono cartridge) you have a situation where any noise picked up in both channels during playback is now 180º out of phase in one channel with respect to the other.

    So, when you play stereo records, the L and R signals are in-phase but playback noise shared between the channels is 180º out of phase.

    If you play mono LPs with a stereo cartridge without summing the channels, again you have the L and R signals output from the stereo cartridge in-phase (one routed to each speaker, in this case L and R are ostensibly the same signal) but any noise picked up in both channels in playback is now 180º out of phase in one channel with respect to the other.

    This means that simply summing the L and R channels will have the effect of cancelling any playback noise shared between the channels and splitting the resulting signal back out to both speakers gives you the desired L+R in both.

    In summary, the Westrex 45-45 stereo system allows for mono compatibility (L+R retrieved by mono stylus) but means that playback of mono LPs with a stereo cartridge needs the channels to be summed to get L+R.

    If you don't sum the channels when playing a mono LP in stereo, you don't get L+R in each speaker, you get L in one channel, R in the other, both with playback noise, some of which is shared and 180º out of phase in one channel with respect to the other. Of course, L and R are ostensibly the same signal on a mono LP, but until you effect the vector sum that produces L+R, you have vertical noise that isn't required since there is no vertical signal (L-R is zero for mono). For stereo you have no choice but to keep the 180º out of phase noise.
     
    Last edited: May 10, 2015
  20. Gregory Earl

    Gregory Earl Senior Member

    Location:
    Kantucki
    And that answer AppleCorp3 is the whole shebang.

    Thank you Mal for your invaluable knowledge and expertize. Detailed to the T.

    Thank you sir.
     
    Mal likes this.
  21. AppleCorp3

    AppleCorp3 Forum Resident

    Wow!! Very thorough and informative!! Thank you very much. This is why I'm glad I found this forum!
     
    Mal likes this.
  22. Gregory Earl

    Gregory Earl Senior Member

    Location:
    Kantucki
    And we are glad you joined.

    Pretty cool place it is.
     
    Mal likes this.
  23. DavidFell

    DavidFell Forum Resident

    Location:
    Chicago
    That's the most clearly I've ever seen this explained. Thank you!
     
    Mal likes this.
  24. AppleCorp3

    AppleCorp3 Forum Resident

    I just had my HK 825 fixed and now have a fully functional mono button at my disposal (reverse the polarity of the neutron flow, I guess!). Having this button is one of the major reasons I had it repaired.

    Wow - it sure was worth it. I thought Mono Masters sounded great before, but it's even better now.
     
  25. Steve Hoffman

    Steve Hoffman Your host Your Host Thread Starter

    That's the LP version, right?
     

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