I’m a convert after years of digital cable improvement denial

Right, that's the sort of friendly and non-controversial analogy I was looking for.

 

Now that there is some of the finest pseudo science ever made up on here

 

I feel people fall into 3 categories with analog cables:

a)they have proven their cable beliefs to themselves
b)they have not
c)they do not care

Lots of people in category b want to be in category a, but that just is not going to happen by reading peoples opinions of how cables sound on the internet, nor do I think it is possible with most (97-99% if you want me to make up numbers) people.

All bets are off with digicables.

 

Sorry Rolltide, just a different belief system was the point I was trying to make

I TAKE IT BACK EVERYBODY

 

Where do see me saying that cables are magical or that digital isn't just digital? The only aspect I've ever postulated was that it's possible for EMI noise to ride on any line (totally outside the digital signal) and therefore possibly create noise on analog (non-digital) components. It's impossible for a digital signal to get altered. You can call me whatever names you like but at least hold me to what I say instead of what you'd like to believe that I believe....ha.

 

Too late...you've already revealed the essence of your soul. That toothpaste will never find its way back into the tube.

 

I am confused. Now you are saying all USB cables must sound the same

 

My cover is blown. I do not believe in the impossible

 

And you like to swing your dick around on the internet for the sake of doing so.

 

Nope . leave that to your kind

 

Yep, all USB cables must sound the same! But it's possible that some are a better conduit for some noise to ride along outside the signal and affect analog components. The cable though will most definitely sound the same. We've been through this discussion many times and yet you pretend you don't understand my perspective. With this said, any cable is literally the last place I look for improvement in my system. Any effect I'm postulating is very likely negligible and inaudible...yet theoretically possible and that's why I make the point.

 

Then buy a DAC for more than $10

 

I don't dispute that a properly designed DAC deals with this issue. But in the universe of absolutes that you serve up, you have now conceded that it's possible that more than just a digital signal (i.e. noise) might be transferred on a USB cable and therefore needs to be mitigated by a properly designed DAC. At this point we agree - but don't act like science says cables can't introduce noise into our audio systems because that is total BS. No one is arguing about a digital signal but you.

 

Well, that's surely a cynical view. Not sure how it contributes to a better atmosphere either.

Audiophiles discuss their viewpoints. It's what we are often here for, right? I listened to X speaker and thought it was good or bad for whatever reasons, someone else opined otherwise.
Most of us here enjoy contributing our experience and opinions whether it's necessarily of the goal of "helping" or "saving" others or not.

As to "helping" with information, what is wrong with that?

If someone makes a claim about the real world, e.g. bout the nature of how HDMI cables work, that contradicts how those cables work and someone can point out why that's the case, why SHOULDN'T they convey that information?

The problem is that often people making claims about things like cables utterly rely on their own subjective experience as rock solid. The problem is when a claim is made on such a basis, ANY evidence you have against that claim, from an engineering, measuring, theoretical, experimental standpoint, is interpreted as a Personal Offense. "How dare you challenge MY experience when YOU WEREN'T THERE!"

That is actually the attitude from which much of the heat arises in cable and tweak threads. We've seen it in this very thread as usual.

That's the problem: objective or rigorous evidence can show our subjective inferences are wrong. And many people can't seem to handle that idea on a personal level.

Is the way forward, then, to only let claims about equipment be made from a purely subjective basis, no matter how much it may clash with objective reality? And all the people
who think or know otherwise are not allowed to participate?

Or is perhaps a better way forward that some people accept we can all be in error, and that someone pointing out "the perception may have been due to a bias error" shouldn't be seen
as a personal attack, and shouldn't be grounds for attacking the other person's "ears or gear." ?

 

? There are plenty of people who claim that different cables produce a different "sound" as output from the DAC

To do that they must be delivering different data to the DAC.
Forget "noise" forget "interference". Which of these expensive cables is delivering the original data?

 

Rolling eyes and shaking head!

 

I have a real world example of how a USB cable changed the sound of my system - yet it had nothing to do with the data it was delivering. When I switched from an AES cable to a USB from my Lumin streamer to my Lampizator DAC I ended up with a high pitched (almost ultrasonic sounding) whine through the speakers only while music was playing. This didn't happen with the AES cable. The Lampi DAC uses a separate USB module and I later determined I created a ground loop using the USB cable. I lifted the ground on my Lumin using a HumX and the whine went away. So yes, all cables - even digital cables can cause your system to sound different and it doesn't have anything to do with the 1's or 0's.

 

Window shopping stage?

 

But can't you see that it was the use of the USB connection, not the specific cable ? The same would have happened no matter which USB cable you used

 

Look at what this thread has done.

If you DON”T believe in nice speaker wire or interconnects please don't come into this thread

 

Or no interest in music.

 

Agreed...although I am using a non-powered USB cable and I'm not sure whether a powered USB cable would have produced the same ground loop issue. I never tried it.

 

Lmao!

 

I'm not going to argue with you about this. But I recommend that you read up on transmission line theory.

But what do I know about high frequency engineering? Well I guess among other things, I have an instrument inbound towards Mercury on this ESA Science & Technology - BepiColombo , which has got a shed load of fast digital links in it. And just for giggles I've done extensive testing on digital cables for audio using a raft of instrumentation including Time Domain Reflectometry, and breaking into digital lines using a three way splitter and instrumentation with a 2GHz bandwidth (so a 175ps effective rise time).

I'm actually supremely uninterested in your belief that digits are digits, and not high speed low pulse distortion RF engineering. You hang onto what you believe in - but I'm done feeding the troll.

 

Which makes it even more surprising that you believe that a USB cable can consistently alter the bits in precisely the same position in every sample in digital audio to make a consistent change to the "sound"