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I’m a convert after years of digital cable improvement denial

Discussion in 'Audio Hardware' started by HelpfulDad, Feb 17, 2021.

  1. Just Walking

    Just Walking Forum Resident

    Location:
    Abingdon UK
    In fairness all this USB/SPDIF dick-waving discussion we have derailed the core question - which was HDMI cables, which is a different kettle of fish. The structure of the signalling is based on individually screened differential pairs, and there is also a differential clock - so data transmission is synchronous.

    The HDMI 2.0 standard calls for an 18G-bits per second bandwidth, although 2.1 ups that to 48G-bits per second.

    So does cable construction matter? Well yes, but only that it has to conform to at least HDMI 2.0 and preferably to HDMI 2.1. Belkin make 2.1 cables for around $30.
     
    Kyhl and Sevoflurane like this.
  2. Just Walking

    Just Walking Forum Resident

    Location:
    Abingdon UK
    I'm out of this thread, and any other that you crop on on.
     
    MGW likes this.
  3. Peter_IT_Guru

    Peter_IT_Guru Forum Resident

    Location:
    uk
    Wrong yet again

    From the very first post

    "For years I found it hard to believe that cables carrying digital information could make a damned bit of difference. I didn’t argue the point too strongly, because I didn’t have the money to audition a very expensive HDMI or USB cable"
     
  4. Peter_IT_Guru

    Peter_IT_Guru Forum Resident

    Location:
    uk
    Thank goodness for that
     
  5. Uglyversal

    Uglyversal Forum Resident

    Location:
    Sydney
    I am amazed to read this from you, good post!
     
    K Knight likes this.
  6. K Knight

    K Knight Well-Known Member

    Location:
    Geneva
    It's not about who's decided that it's better than your own preference. And I'm not trying to convince you otherwise.

    You can own what you like and do what you want with it. You like more bass? Turn up the bass or buy bass heavy speakers.

    Whatever rocks yours boat.

    I'm not saying one is right and the other one is wrong. I'm merely explaining the process of how it works.

    Cimematographers chose film and colour grading in their artistic direction with the director (an amazing movie for this level of detail is the movie "2046" or "In the mood for love"). Where the type of film used and colour grading is representative of the emotions and dynamics in a scene.

    Callibrating a screen makes its truer to the artistic direction. That's its.

    But like I said, I don't calibrate my screen (but maybe that's cos I barely watch movies having a kid).

    But this all off topic now. :shrug:
     
  7. Uglyversal

    Uglyversal Forum Resident

    Location:
    Sydney
    Beyond that it allows you to have more consistent levels and colors over and over. A must for people working either in the photographic or film industry. I must say I am too lazy to bother unless doing a large amount of printing or other imaging work.
     
    Billy Infinity and K Knight like this.
  8. samurai

    samurai Step right up! See the glory, of the royal scam.

    Location:
    MINNESOTA
    Please mommy, please daddy, make it stop!

    The same old arguments, over and over and over.
    Just agree to disagree and go to your neutral corners.
     
  9. Peter_IT_Guru

    Peter_IT_Guru Forum Resident

    Location:
    uk
    OK I can buy into that. But would you have a problem with somebody coming into your music room and adjusting your audio equipment to make it truer to the recording studio ? I know I would

    Very possibly, but I am only talking about the 99.99% of TVs that are not used for that. In my experience that would e monitors

    But as you so rightly pointed out we have been led off topic. Interesting all the same
     
  10. K Knight

    K Knight Well-Known Member

    Location:
    Geneva
    Well if you want to hear it more like recording studios, I guess you'd sound treat the room and buy studio monitors.

    I'm trying to do the prior because the to acoustics are horrid at the moment. But this is what it's all about, getting it closer to the sound (and vision) that you like or want to hear.

    It's not about someone coming in and telling what you should like this. Or this sounds better than your current setup because it's setup wrong. Whether that's physical or here on a forum.

    You like what it is you like. If you don't or want to change, you swap out, upgrade or make slight adjustments to what pleases you more. Be that speakers, amps, cables or whatever.

    No one can tell you that the art you have on your walls are ****. It's personal preference and that's all.

    And you're right, most screens sold are not calibrated to be true. They are calibrated to what sells more. But most people here are probably interested in hifi and not buying Bose for a reason. It would make sense that, calibrating screens is an extension (or visa versa) of their hifi passion.

    But we are all hear to share knowledge and learn more about our passion.
     
  11. Tullman

    Tullman Senior Member

    Location:
    Boston MA
    You are being very naive to believe tv's come from the factory calibrated. In fact my tv was calibrated for the room as well. Here some samples of the calibration in action.
    The calibration works best if the tv is new. I get it, that people don't want to spend the money on calibration, but it was worth every penny to me.

    [​IMG]
    [​IMG]Click For Full-Size Image.

    [​IMG]
    [​IMG]Click For Full-Size Image.
     
  12. Tullman

    Tullman Senior Member

    Location:
    Boston MA
  13. Tullman

    Tullman Senior Member

    Location:
    Boston MA
  14. MattHooper

    MattHooper Forum Resident

    Location:
    Canada
    Wow, nice set up!

    Is that yours Tullman?
     
  15. Peter_IT_Guru

    Peter_IT_Guru Forum Resident

    Location:
    uk
    I get it. If you want to have your A/V set up like that, that's fine
    All I am saying is that I prefer my TVs, projector and sound system set up to my preferences
     
  16. Uglyversal

    Uglyversal Forum Resident

    Location:
    Sydney
    There's nothing wrong with that, most of the time is what I do myself but calibration, like many other specialized tweaks, are far from being a scam, some people just take their interest to a level others fail to appreciate or notice differences.
     
    Billy Infinity and Tullman like this.
  17. toddrhodes

    toddrhodes Forum Resident

    Location:
    South Bend, IN
    I still remember watching the Zenith CRT Projector rep calibrate the big 3-gun unit we had in the store I worked at way back in 2000-ish, around when HDTV was just taking off.

    It made my head spin, but I will never forget seeing the DVD (lowly 480p) of The Fifth Element after he calibrated it, and we were blown away.

    I didn't realize this was a debated subject - it takes a lot of skill, patience, and special tools to do it.

    I cheat and just find what others have set on their sets after calibration and go with that - close enough for me, visually.
     
  18. Uglyversal

    Uglyversal Forum Resident

    Location:
    Sydney
    Those CRT projectors were a nightmare and yet they were heaven for many starting from the late 70's when they started trickling down to households.
     
    MattHooper and toddrhodes like this.
  19. toddrhodes

    toddrhodes Forum Resident

    Location:
    South Bend, IN
    It was such a beast - big, heavy, and I still remember mounting that thing. We had their 10k 60" RPTV setup as well. I think it used slightly smaller guns than the ceiling projector, but that TV looked so good. We hosted a little viewing party for the first HDTV airing of Tonight Show with Jay Leno - it was a trip to see just how badly they did makeup at that point.
     
    Uglyversal likes this.
  20. Uglyversal

    Uglyversal Forum Resident

    Location:
    Sydney
    I know, I am sure many people are still paying with their back the consequences of working with those in any of their shapes. I haven't seen Zenith's but I used to see a lot of Sony's floorstanders and Barco of the ceiling type. I always wanted one but the prices in those days for projectors seemed unobtainable. Still, now I can't believe how bad the picture was by today's standards.
     
    toddrhodes likes this.
  21. elvisizer

    elvisizer Forum Resident

    Location:
    San Jose
    even the flat non-projection CRT tv's were a problem- I had a 32" flat wega that must have weighed over 400 lbs.
    kinda wish I still had it despite the weight- I miss the old playstation 1 and 2 era light gun games, and who knows if my sinden light gun will ever ship :realmad:
     
    toddrhodes likes this.
  22. manxman

    manxman Forum Resident

    Location:
    Isle of Man
    My system is pretty much set up to do that – I have $85,000 active speakers with DSP and 18 drivers each to cancel out unwanted reflections and create a flat frequency response from 18 Hz to 35 kHz. Alternatively, I could have spent nearly twice as much for a pair of two-way standmount Audio Note AN-E Sogons, filled with silver wire and with a far-from-flat frequency response from 18 Hz to 23 kHz. As their own publicity puts it: "The majority of the high-end audio marketplace is occupied by ill-conceived low efficiency loudspeaker systems. These designs usually consist of several less-than ideally-matched drivers and a very complex crossover, crammed into a cabinet that exhibits the tonal and textural qualities of reinforced concrete. Their designers are blinded by the dogmatic quest for high sound pressure levels and flat response. But what of the other factors which are essential for emotionally involving music reproduction? What about coherence, full natural micro - as well as macro - dynamics, inner detail? What about LIFE? What about EMOTION?"

    It all comes down to where you stand on the subjectivity/objectivity debate, and that's at the heart of this increasingly ill-tempered thread. It's a fundamental philosophical difference, and those at either end of the spectrum are not likely to find any common ground with those at the polar opposite.

    As for calibrating TVs, my television self-calibrates every 120 hours by photographing its own screen and adjusting its colours to the correct balance.
     
    Brother_Rael and toddrhodes like this.
  23. toddrhodes

    toddrhodes Forum Resident

    Location:
    South Bend, IN
    Your speakers are amazing, what a treat to be able to listen with those regularly.

    And I agree, and for my part of creating more tension and vitriol in the thread yesterday, I apologize.

    The truth is, like in many areas - I'm a "moderate" and try to situate myself in the center of most philosophical slugfests. Think I dipped my toe in an extreme position yesterday and rather regret it. I guess I'm glad it was just over an HDMI cable and not something truly earth-shattering, I suppose.
     
    manxman likes this.
  24. manxman

    manxman Forum Resident

    Location:
    Isle of Man
    Nobody, yourself included, has behaved outrageously in this thread. It just got a little heated because we're all passionate about our shared hobby – and many of us have strong viewpoints about the best way to explore it.
     
    Brother_Rael, toddrhodes and Tone? like this.
  25. Uglyversal

    Uglyversal Forum Resident

    Location:
    Sydney
    I haven't looked for a while but every now and then you can get them on ebay in working condition for little, don't buy any in need of repair as replacement tubes are a problem. They are so big that I'd rather look at photos on the Internet instead.
     

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