I'm going to try the Sumiko Moonstone and maybe the Amethyst

As stated above. The sound from the Youtube video just strikes a positive cord with me. I'm going to do it the smart way this time. I am going to start with the Moonstone first and go from there unless .

Anyway here is some information:
Sumiko Moonstone
On line review here

Video


Sumiko Amethyst review here

Now to my point does anyone here have any on hands (ear) experience with either of these?


M~

 

Haven't heard them, but they look like the same design of the Excel ES-70 that's been around for decades. This iteration has more plastic around the body. Any company can order these carts from the OEM and have them spec'd how they like - e.g. more or less turns of coil wire, stronger or weaker magnets, more or less useless plastic around the body, etc.

See: Coral 555, LPGear Vessel series, Sumiko Pearl, old A&R cartridges, Garrott Brothers cart bodies and so on.

$300 for the Moonstone is a big much for an off-the-shelf MM cart with minor tweaks that only has a nude elliptical stylus - compared to what other companies are offering at that price. I know I wouldn't buy one.

My 2 cents.

 

According to Sumiko, the new series has an ”all new” generator. So not the Excel 70 (or Sumiko Pearl) in a new body.

Here’s a test of the new Sumiko’s. Alle 6 neuen Sumiko Tonabnehmer im Vergleich - LowBeats

What we can see is that the Amethyst has the most even frequency response with a little lift in the treble before it rolls off. The Moonstone comes close, and offers both better frequency curve and sound quality than the lower options.

Rainier and Olympia are close to each other, both has a treble fall off that starts a bit early, then a treble lift at around 10 kHz. But Olympia is more even. The basic sound is the same smooth, big, dynamic and sophisticated Sumiko sound - but with more brilliance and details the more you pay. The smaller/lighter magnets higher up, really seems to works and gives benefits to the sound.

Yes, the Olympia has a smaller/lighter magnet than the Rainier and the Moonstone has a smaller/lighter magnet than the Olympia. This helps in reducing mass and it means a more precise sound with better transient response and more clarity at the top end. Also note that the Olympia has lower distorsion and tracks better than Rainier, and Moonstone is a further improvement here. Olympia has better/higher resolution than Rainier and Moonstone is even better.

From previous discussions with Mr Patient_Ot I’ve come to the conclusion that he buys cartridges after stylus profile. And while it is true that stylus are like the tyres of a car, if you don’t have a matching chassi or engine, it may not be a pleasant drive. I wouldn’t put sports tyres on a family MPV, for example.

Real life listening and measurements shows that the new Sumiko range is up with the best! And really competes with cartridges that has more advanced stylus profiles. So maybe mr P_O should be open to change his pre-judgements about the Sumiko’s. It’s more to a cartridge than the stylus profile. Plus a good elliptical is easier to set up.

Also note that the Sumiko Amethyst competes with Ortofon 2M Black, now the Amethyst has a Line contact, but the Moonstone comes close.

Also note that Sumiko HOMCs with a standard elliptical has even broader and more intense sound with more colours, this is because of HOMC still has some virtues from the LOMCs. But the Amethyst is still a brilliant MM and up there with the best MMs that exists today. The Moonstone is just a little bit behind, for half the money.

 

Possibly of interest:

The Vessel cartridge

 

I now have a googlephonic stereo with a moon-rock needle. It's ok for my car but I wouldn't want it in my house....

 

Why in the world would you want to put a $300 cartridge on that table in your system?

 

I have the A3SE, it’s also maded by Excel Sound Corp. and sounds close to the Sumiko Pearl which is one of my favourites. I like it, but the Pearl handles complex music better.

 

Also, please note that it’s not recommended to upgrade the stylus from Moonstone to Amethyst. Amethyst has a different generator (smaller coils) than the Moonstone.

Compared to the Vessel, the Sumiko has lower moving mass and this improves the sonics. The Vessels uses an older generator (but tweaked) and has more stylus options. But Sumiko has some interesting technology.

 

I have the Olympia and the Amethyst. I love them both and tend to prefer both over the orto Blue except with pressings that have a lot of lower end and/or booming midrange. Virtually everything sounds great with both, though--musical, smooth, rich, never fatiguing. The Amethyst has more detail and is more polished; the Olympia rocks out more. I think I actually prefer the Olympia because it's less refined.

 

I went from an Ortofon 2M Red to the Moonstone on my old Mission (1987) phono. The sound of instruments is definitely more real & maybe a bit on the warm side with the Mooner. It's my favorite of all the carts I've used (including the '90's edition of the Sumiko Blue Point).

 

Important to note that Sumiko does not make cartridges. They are just a reseller/relabeled. Excel carts mainly, just like Hana. I really didn't like the Sumiko Pearl at all, despite all of the "let it break in" stuff. Maybe a nude would do better.

 

Some prefer a high-quality MM to an MC, believe it or not. Sometimes I get a hankering to try a new MM cart. There is just something about the sound of a good MM that seems to be missing from any of the affordable MCs I've tried in my system. $300 in an MM cart gets one better sound quality than $600 in an MC cart IME.

 

Not sure that's the case with this new range? ie being reseller/relabled, as it was for the "Pearl" etc obviously they are the manufacturer, but I thought from what I read (a while ago now & memory not that great) that they "Sumiko" had input on this cartridge range design? Also if they are rebadged I'm yet to see the other carts? Can you point me in their direction if they exist, could be cheaper for a stylus in the future or an upgrade one, could be handy!

 

+1
I was just about to pick up a Moonstone, if there's an OEM version with identical specs I'd be very interested to know what it is.

 

I don't have a definitive answer, but I'm unaware of any identical cartridges. Here's Mike's review on his AnalogPlanet site: Is This Oyster Worth $300 Clams?

 

Sumiko has never made carts. But they are an exclusive brand that does have custom products made for them. Hana carts are also made by Excel. The Excel ES70 is the basis for a number of carts- Sumiko Pearl, Shelter 201, LP Gear Vessel. That's not to diss their carts though. Was hoping for more from the Pearl.

 

I think this line is pretty exclusive to Sumiko. The Hana El and EH are pretty close on price to the Moonstone relatively speaking and probably a big step up.

 

After a receiving multiple defective AT carts through Amazon recently, I decided to try an Amethyst. I’ve only put a couple hours on it, but so far I’m very pleased. It sounds surprisingly similar to my Hana SL but a little warmer.

Hopefully the suspension will hold up better than that of the Hana, which became a low-rider after very few hours. It sounds fine but rides so low that I avoid using it for warped records.

 

Do you think the Amethyst is worth $150 more than the 2m Bronze? How much of an upgrade is the Amethyst (or Bronze) over a VM95ML? PS - In what way were your carts defective?

 

I don’t have personal experience with the 2M Bronze, though my local turntable guru holds it in high esteem. That’s what I would have tried but its specs are not as compatible with my setup. I bet the Amethyst merely has a different house sound. It doesn’t sound like Ortofons I’ve owned in the past. Instead it sounds similar to the Hana — lush and warm but still detailed. To my ears, Ortofons tend to sound a but clinical, a “matter-of-fact” sort of presentation.

I don’t have experience with the 95ML either. The two AT carts I bought and returned were the 740ML and OC9XML. Both had defective cantilevers that were severely deflecting to one side when lowered onto the platter. The only reason I was willing to purchase an Amethyst through Amazon, despite the defective ATs they sold me, is that it shipped from a third-party seller (Music Direct). I’m now suspicious of buying carts direct from Amazon, and wonder if they are selling the factory rejects of these brands, or selling carts as “new” when they’re actually customer returns.

The Amethyst arrived in perfect condition luckily.

 

Thanks. I agree, Amazon has gone to complete **** and I will no longer order shipped by Amazon if I can help it. I mostly use Amazon's website to find 3rd party listings and buy directly from them (e.g. Music Direct). Amazon pools all its stock so if something is shipped by Amazon, the seller doesn't matter, you could still be getting ripped off. It's common with SD cards and proprietary batteries for Amazon to have a mixed stock of authentic and counterfeit. Really incredible how just a few years ago the refrain was "only buy if shipped and sold by Amazon." I've sent Amazon countless emails about my numerous problems and always get back canned responses. Half the time I buy something shipped from Amazon I have to return it a few times before I get one in good condition. Seems like the people packing and shipping orders couldn't do a better job making sure stuff arrives in shabby condition if they tried. I wouldn't be surprised if what you received were returns. I bought a camera once, shipped and sold by Amazon, and the box looked like someone left it out in a hurricane and it had 3,000+ shutter actuations.

 

I just bought a NEW espresso machine from Amazon and received a clearly USED one. Go figure.

 

Hana EL and Oysters are very different beasts. I wouldn't say the Hana is a step up. Just different. Hana is more top end heavy, more detailed, more transparent. Oysters are warmer, richer, fuller. Hana has a bit of a gap in the midrange for me, whereas the I think the Oysters really fill that space beautifully. They're both musical, but I think the Hana is a touch more analytical. If I had to pick, I'd actually go with the Sumiko, even though I do love the Hana.

 

I can highly recommend the Sumiko Blue Point #2 (old new stock for $400 or less). I have one mounted on a Rega P3 and this high output MC should work with most any phono stage. Yes, it's has an elliptical stylus but I don't find that as a negative. You can get the newer model but its not worth the extra $200. Read the reviews.

 

Going to correct myself here--I don't think the Hana is actually clinical in any way. I think that the transparency and detail just make it more possible to listen to music analytically. But the cart itself is beautifully musical.