Iron Maiden Remasters

Discussion in 'Music Corner' started by old school, Mar 11, 2012.

  1. regarding riff bashing, is that meant to be that good riffs are being bashed and not practiced as they used to be, or that modern heavy bands just bash out riffs without any semblance of structure, melody, or placement in the overall song ("bash them out" so to speak)?
     
  2. Son of Ziggy

    Son of Ziggy Forum Resident

    Location:
    England
    Nicko said he can’t play double bass pedals naturally, if he does it too much he loses the plot.
     
  3. john morris

    john morris Everybody's Favorite Quadron

    Location:
    Toronto, Ontario
    The new Maiden has grown on me. But not everyone likes the new 21st century Iron Maiden. I think "suck" is too overused by the under 30 crowd today. Everything to them sucks. It is either good or it sucks. It had lost it's meaning.

    Honestly if you want a band that sounds the same with every album just stick to AC/DC. Bands need to grow.

    We are audiophiles. Let's not get into band criticism. My point was really about
    the band trying not to sound like they used to unpropose. As if old Iron Maiden was bad or something. They avoid the "Maiden Gallops" for example which they are so known for.
     
  4. john morris

    john morris Everybody's Favorite Quadron

    Location:
    Toronto, Ontario
    There is song on Dance Of Death where he does this slow BOOM BOOM BOOM BOOM on the double bass pedal through 80% of the song. It is real cool and suits the song.

    Double bass pedals were invented so that drummers could do double bass rolls without losing the beat (or the plot) or screwing up the rhythm. Many drummers found that one foot would always lead when they would do double bass rolls. With a double bass pedal that can't happen.

    Riff bashing is something that confuses me. They are Metal critics that dislike any band from writing songs around riffs. Doesn't matter if the riff is good or bad. And yet Metal drummers abuse and overplay the double bass pedal and critics say nothing. Hypocrisy!
     
  5. JediJoker

    JediJoker Audio Engineer/Enthusiast

    Location:
    Portland, OR, USA
    Huh? A double bass pedal on one kick drum is mechanically no different from having two kick drums with separate single pedals. The reason it was invented was to remove the need for an extra kick drum.
     
  6. john morris

    john morris Everybody's Favorite Quadron

    Location:
    Toronto, Ontario
    Never said they were mechanically different. That is a straw man. Never even mentioned this.

    You only need ONE foot to play double rolls when you have a double pedal. This is obvious. And can play the high hat at the same time. It is NOT the same. You need two feet to play double rolls when you have two single bass pedals ON TWO KICKS. which means you need to take your foot off the high hat when you do the rolls. As a 18 year studio veteran (now ex-engineer) I have miked up and tuned quite a few drum kits. I know drummers who refuse to use a single double beater because they don't like the sound.

    I have heard kicks being soloed in the studio and they sound very different. Two single pedals on two kicks produce a low thunder sound. Whereas one double bass pedal on one kick I find makes a Ticking noise. It shouldn't sound different but it does. You can only play so fast on two single pedals. But on a double pedal you can go like crazy. Unfortunately it never sounds right when played super fast.
    It is more of a ticking notice (tiiiiiiiiicccccc) than an actual low bass thud. I constantly have to roll off all the lower mid frequencies off the double pedals to get rid of that annoying ticking noise. I have to EQ the crap out of the things just to get them to sound like a real bass pedal. It is only a problem when Metal drummers play to fast. You and other members here get to hear the nice EQ and compressed mixed finished product. The actual tracks (especially those super fast played double pedals) sound very different.

    Listen to the studio recording of Rush's .ANALOG KID. There is a part where Neil does a quick double roll. When he moved to a single double bass pedal all the live versions of ANALOG KID suffered. Listen to the double roll in ANALOG KID in all the live versions after 1990. They double bass part sounds weak and wimpy.. On Stages you can at least hear it. But on the recent live version of ANALOG KID you wouldn't know the double roll part was event there.
     
  7. john morris

    john morris Everybody's Favorite Quadron

    Location:
    Toronto, Ontario

    Yea,what I said was incorrect. That was an issue for some drummers though. But drummers weren't complaining over lack of space due to two kicks. A double pedal allowed the freedom to:

    1. To do double bass rolls without taking ones foot off the high hat pedal.

    2. Now only one kick to tune.

    3. In a double bass roll one foot would always lead. This wouldn't happen with a single double beater.

    Was a drummer from 1987 - 1994. My growing arthritis made that impossible. I got my double bass pedal back in 1988. I paid a lot of money for it. I didn't get it to get rid of one kick. Many Metal drummers use two double pedals. One on each KICK.
    That double doubles.
     
  8. JediJoker

    JediJoker Audio Engineer/Enthusiast

    Location:
    Portland, OR, USA
    Respectfully, I don't think you have the proper grasp of this. This is a double pass pedal:

    [​IMG]

    The left beater is activated only by the left pedal. Both feet are needed for double rolls.
     
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  9. Instant Dharma

    Instant Dharma Hendon!!!!

    Location:
    East Bay, Ca

    I am not an audiophile. So I will criticize away.

    But I wont cuz I freaking love Maiden.
     
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  10. john morris

    john morris Everybody's Favorite Quadron

    Location:
    Toronto, Ontario

    Let it me put it this way. A bad Iron Maiden album is light years above all the other Metal bands. When some of us say "bad" we are comparing it to other Iron Maiden albums.
     
  11. john morris

    john morris Everybody's Favorite Quadron

    Location:
    Toronto, Ontario
    Black Swan Fallacy. Yes, I know about those but they are other models. There is a well known model that only needs one foot to activate and play. There is a song on Brave New World where you can clearly hear Nicko playing double rolls and high hat at the same time. Is that a early 90's model?
     
  12. john morris

    john morris Everybody's Favorite Quadron

    Location:
    Toronto, Ontario

    Let me elobrate. Most double beaters require both feet as you say. Some models were made that only needed one foot. They look the same but are mechanically different. I am not surprised you don't know they exist. They can be a bitch to play as every wack on the pedal results in a double roll. Careful speed and control are required or your speed and timing will be all over the place. HAVENS DECOTA, a well known Jazz drummer from Peru has one. But they are not too popular. I know of long time 30 + year audio engineers that have never heard of a Scully 1 inch 12 track (284-12). But they exist. And many engineers who actually work with analog machines don't know about the Stephen's 2 inch 40 track but they exist. Check out the link below. On the video is the very popular DUALIST, ONE FOOT DOUBLE BEATER.



    Unfortunately they required skill to play well.
     
    Last edited: Oct 28, 2019
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  13. Anthrax

    Anthrax Forum Resident

    Location:
    Europe
    I believe Nicko has actually never played a double pedal/beater. He's mentioned that in interviews over the years, how he uses only one pedal/beater on principle.

    I'd be happy to be corrected if any newer info/proof has surfaced about his technique changing in recent years.
     
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  14. Yam Graham

    Yam Graham Forum Resident

    Location:
    West Midlands,UK.
    That's fanboy talk.
    I have followed Maiden from the very start....I bought their debut because I saw them open for Judas Priest on their British Steel tour in 1980.
    Maiden have not grown at all...they have become predictable, self indulgent and downright boring.
    The last two studio albums are so boring and dull I can understand why so many fans yearn for their 80's pomp.
    They remain...a great live spectacle...but for me, life is too short to try and 'get' their latest albums.
    Songs are overly long....same predictable song writing....and to top it off....they sound awful.
    If the band enjoy their so called 'progressive' phase.....great. after all...you have to enjoy what you do. Me...I don't, and I'm not on my own.
     
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  15. sunking101

    sunking101 Forum Resident

    Location:
    Yorkshire, England
    I never took to Dance Of Death, and A Matter Of Life And Death was rubbish IMO but I've quite liked the rest of 'new Maiden'.
     
  16. dockofthebay

    dockofthebay Forum Resident

    Location:
    UK
    How likely are the remasters to be bundled into a box set, maybe next summer when they play Download in the UK?
     
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  17. Son of Ziggy

    Son of Ziggy Forum Resident

    Location:
    England
    you mean cd?
     
  18. dockofthebay

    dockofthebay Forum Resident

    Location:
    UK
    Yes, sorry. They did the vinyl boxset(s) quite recently didn't they?
     
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  19. john morris

    john morris Everybody's Favorite Quadron

    Location:
    Toronto, Ontario
    Not a fan boy. I don't like every Iron Maiden album. Those are fan boys. But yes, their 80 - 88 stuff was the best. Just like Rubber Soul kicks but over Let It Be which is really a let down.
     
  20. john morris

    john morris Everybody's Favorite Quadron

    Location:
    Toronto, Ontario
    Ahh yes. Now we are down to the meat and gravy.... You are very correct. But he did relent and got a double beater for the 1999 Best Of The Beast Tour. And take a listen to the album BRAVE NEW WORLD. There is a song where he is clearly playing the high hat and doing double rolls at the same time. Buy my memory could be crappy. When I can find my way home tonight I will give the album a listen and report back to you guys and let you know what iz hear.
     
  21. Galley

    Galley Forum Resident

    The latest batch of four are available at Target.com, as part of their “Buy Two, Get One Free” sale. Street date is Nov. 22.
     
  22. Son of Ziggy

    Son of Ziggy Forum Resident

    Location:
    England
    Yes. 1980-1988 (vinyls don’t fit)

    But 1990-2014 is pretty good
     
  23. Anthrax

    Anthrax Forum Resident

    Location:
    Europe
    Cool. Yes, do share the song and point where you're hearing the double beater, I'd love to check for myself.

    Ahhh, the '99 tour. That was a wonderful show. :love:
    I have no concrete info/evidence of Nicko changing his setup around that time, though. Any info (by anyone!) is appreciated.
     
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  24. john morris

    john morris Everybody's Favorite Quadron

    Location:
    Toronto, Ontario

    I am freezing out here.....

    Check out the Brave New World album. All of if sudden Nicko goes double bass roll crazy. Coincidence? ...Maybe. Please excuse me. I have been really busy trying to get a job at local Toronto studios. One studio owner took one look at me and said, "Oh it's you. Bye John. Next..." This is my rep of being a maverick. A while back a client really wanted his song demo smashed. I said, "Go **** yourself." I guess words gets around.

    Anyway sorry for taking so long. I will go home and listen to Brave New World.
     
  25. john morris

    john morris Everybody's Favorite Quadron

    Location:
    Toronto, Ontario
    In all honesty A MATTER OF LIFE AND DEATH took a while to grow on me. Maybe too long.
     

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