Is it just me or Led Zeppelin (or rather half of the band) were simply bad too many times LIVE? *

Yes, I misspoke. Aeolian is Natural Minor. Harmonic Minor and Melodic Minor stem from it. Though many argue about the logic of this.

 

Do you just mean historically, when each first appeared?

 

Yeah, great track, that one. Definitely would dig hearing more live versions.


I've also been mightily perplexed by "Living Loving Maid (She's Just a Woman)" not being brought to the stage...ever.


Page's freakish distaste for the number be darned, this song positively cooks! The sound of his 12-string is so crushingly monstrous. LOVE it.

 

Frankfurt probably is the best show from the 1980 tour.

 

Yeah historically when and why melodic and harmonic were added, mostly for the sake of tonal harmony and having the leading tone

 

It's annoying that they would sometimes have a small part in a medley, instead of playing the whole thing - as the lead track on their debut album you'd think they thought highly of the tune

 

Led Zeppelin were great in the studio, probably one of the best studio bands ever. But live, their sound often didn't feel "full". I don't know how else to describe it.

 

It becomes even more apparent later in their career, when Page started getting into the massive guitar overdubs in the studio- his "guitar army" approach. IMO they couldn't really do justice to songs like "Ten Years Gone" or "Achilles Last Stand" on stage with just one guitar.

 

Achilles Last Stand was one of the highlights of the set from '77 onwards.

 

It was, but it's missing...something IMO. Some nights they played it way too fast as well, but that might have been a side effect of all the coke I actually prefer the 1980 "Achilles" 'cos they're closer to the studio version tempo.

 

I can see why people would think that especially if people arent hearing guitar parts that are on the studio versions that just one guitarist cant replicate by himself live and whatnot. However I think that Zeppelin live had a different sound and one I would totally describe as full! For example the live version of Immigrant Song from How The West Was One is like a full box of bricks hitting you in the face - in the best way possible

 

I always marveled at the way Page could combine various elements of his studio guitar parts into a single one for live performance. They were both different kinds of experiences, and both thrilling. There was more open space in the live arrangements, but that's fine with me.

 

When I listen to their live recordings now, the clams are everywhere. It is almost comical.

But had I been there at the time, I wouldn't have known or cared about the gaffes onstage.

 

Not on this night even though they never played here...

 

There's no link between the Truth album and Led Zeppelin I. Page has mentioned that he hadn't even heard Truth before the recording sessions for I were already over. Most importantly, Jimmy had already released the Think About It single a few months before the Truth album, and that's easily the most Zep-sounding record before the Zep debut. So if anything it was Jeff who was cribbing from Jimmy, not the other way around.

 

I feel the same way. Saw Zep back in '73, was not impressed. Saw the Who that same year and they blew the roof off the joint. My opinion on both bands has always been, Zeppelin's recordings were better than their live performances while the Who's live performances were better than their studio recordings.

 

Utter nonsense. Their playing styles have NEVER been the same... Jimmy, while brilliant, is a sloppy player. Its part of his charm. NOTHING sloppy at all in Jeff's playing...he's a perfectionist.

 

I think he was referring to the architecture of the JB Group and the Truth album vs. LZ and the LZ1 album, not a comparison of their playing. Both groups and albums are heavy blues-rock, both of which I hear as directly derived from The Yardbirds. Both similar in some ways due to their heritage, but not copies of each other.

 

Making awesome records.

 

That's got a million guitar overdubs on it.

 

Making Sgt. Pepper's, Magical Mystery Tour, the White Album, Let It Be and Abbey Road.

 

That is definitely the way I took it.

 

It's also worth keeping in mind that the live version of Dazed and Confused that the Yardbirds started doing in early 1968 was already very similar to the version that appeared on the Zeppelin debut. Again, this was a few months before the Truth album was even recorded.

There are actually only two brief overdubs, at 1:53 and 3:21, and the only purpose is to double what was already played by Jimmy, in order to make it sound fuller. There's also a brief vocal overdub somwhere, as well as a delay effect added at 7:38. So hardly "a million guitar overdubs". It's mighty impressive just how good that live performance is.

 

Black Mountain Side has got nothing to do with Davy Graham, it was likely inspired by Bert Jansch's Blackwaterside, released on the Jack Orion album in 1966. That Graham tune, though, does appear to have inspired White Summer, which was released on the Yardbirds' Little Games LP. Jimmy would later play the two back to back with Zeppelin starting in 1969. He did add a lot of his own stuff in the respective studio versions, and don't forget the improvised passages in live concerts that go well beyond what's on the originals by Graham and Jansch.

 

Listen to the 79 shows from Copenhagen or the shows from Germany in 73.