Kinks, Something Else & Arthur

Discussion in 'Music Corner' started by Lukather, Jun 7, 2009.

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  1. Lukather

    Lukather Forum Resident Thread Starter

    Location:
    Los Angeles
    I need to upgrade these for my collection. What do you guys think are THE Best sounding CD's out there of these 2 great titles?

    Thank you very much,
     
  2. fortherecord

    fortherecord Senior Member

    Location:
    Rochester, NY
    If you want the mono mix of Something Else, which is a more focused and punchier mix, then the Castle CD is the way to go. The Reprise CD has the stereo mix and is not bad. I don't have Arthur on CD so I can't make a recommendation on that one.
     
  3. alexpop

    alexpop Power pop + other bad habits....

    PRT ?
     
  4. Andreas

    Andreas Senior Member

    Location:
    Frankfurt, Germany
    The PRT CD is the best source for the stereo mixes except Tin Soldier Man and Situation Vacant which are remixed and shortened. Second best choice is the Sanctuary Mini LP CD with the Japanese cover. For Tin Soldier Man and Situation Vacant, the Reprise CD is the best choice.
     
  5. alexpop

    alexpop Power pop + other bad habits....


    Thanks Andreas. :righton:
     
  6. Laservampire

    Laservampire Down with this sort of thing

    I'll expand on what Andreas said:

    Something Else (Stereo): PRT or 1989 'Castle Classics' CD for most of the album, US Reprise CD for the original 1967 mixes "Tin Soldier Man" and "Situation Vacant".

    Something Else (Mono): 1998 Castle Essentials Remaster

    Arthur (Stereo): PRT or 1989 'Castle Classics' CDs

    Arthur (Mono): 2001 UK Sanctuary Mini-LP or the Sanctuary "Pye Albums Collection" box set (same as the 2001 Mini-LP)
     
  7. vinyl diehard

    vinyl diehard Two-Channel Forever

    I recently bought The KINKS:Arthur Or The Decline And Fall Of The British Empire(1969) on a Japanese CD pressing (Victor VICP-2095). Released in 1993 in Japan. This is the only copy I've heard of this title and I'm very very happy with the sound dynamics.
     
  8. Laservampire

    Laservampire Down with this sort of thing

    The 1993 Victors sound great, they're mostly the same as the PRTs, but with a slight level change.
     
  9. reechie

    reechie Senior Member

    Location:
    Baltimore
    Remember that the Reprise Something Else CD has some tape damage at the beginning of "David Watts".
     
  10. tspit74

    tspit74 Senior Member

    Location:
    Woodridge, IL, USA
    Who's David Watts and what is he doing on a Kinks album? If I want to listen to David Watts, I'll buy a David Watts cd!!!!!
    :D
     
  11. 5-String

    5-String μηδὲν ἄγαν

    Location:
    Sunshine State
    Are you referring to the K2 Victor?

    I don't have them in front of me right now, so I can't check, but I remember that I have some of the K2 Victors and I though they sounded kind of bright.
     
  12. lou

    lou Fast 'n Bulbous

    Location:
    Louisiana
    Another source for the Something Else original stereo mixes Tin soldier Man and Situation Vacant is the Japan K2 - I prefer it to the US Reprise for these two cuts.
     
  13. Matthew B.

    Matthew B. Scream Quietly

    Location:
    Tokyo, Japan
    Arthur (mono): The Sanctuary/Castle disc mentioned by Laservampire, with alternate Dutch cover art on a mini-LP sleeve, is the only CD source. The mono mix is more distorted than the stereo mix, and missing overdubs on some tracks.

    Arthur (stereo): The original PRT and the 1989 Castle CLACD are not digitally identical, but they sound near-identical, and either's a fine choice. Note that the CLACD mistakenly swaps left and right channels. The first issue from Victor Japan (VICP-2095) is the PRT version with a level change. The issue from Elite Canada is a clone of the CLACD (and I expect that this holds for their other Kinks titles as well).

    The Victor Japan K2 (VICP-61000) is slightly bright to my ears but otherwise good.

    Both the Teichiku/PRT disc and the 1998 Castle Essential disc (later reissued by Sanctuary) have annoying noise reduction. The Reprise CD is from a compressed, high-gen tape source.

    Something Else (mono): The 1998 Castle Essential is the only choice. I don't notice any noise reduction on the album tracks, but the EQ is much too tinny and bright. Still, the mix itself is preferable to the more slapdash stereo version.

    Something Else (stereo): Here's where things get complicated. There are three different stereo versions out there of "Tin Soldier Man," as follows:

    Stereo Mix 1: Drums start out left. Backing vocals at 1:20 mixed centre. Panning effect on brass at end of song. First two notes of the song (corresponding to "he's a" in "he's a tin soldier man") are included.

    Stereo Mix 2a: Drums are centre throughout. Backing vocals at 1:20 mixed right. No panning on brass. First note and a half are shaved off, maybe in a botched attempt to emulate the mono mix.

    Stereo Mix 2b: As with 2a, except that the opening two notes are intact.

    And three versions of "Situation Vacant":

    Stereo Mix 1: Organ is initially mixed right. Wailing vocal overdubs near end of song. False ending leading into coda with louder wailing voices at 2:45. Total length about 3:10.

    Stereo Mix 2a: Organ sometimes mixed left and right simultaneously, e.g., at 0:27. No wailing overdubs. No coda; song ends at about 2:45.

    Stereo Mix 2b: As with 2a, except that a coda extends the song to about 3:18. Unlike Mix 1, the coda here is simply an unaltered reprise of the song's ending.

    I've read, but cannot personally confirm, that the original mixes of the two songs are the ones I've labelled "Stereo Mix 1." And if anyone out there with an original stereo Pye LP can shed some light on this, I'd love to hear from you.

    There's only one CD source for those mixes, and that's the Reprise issue. Unfortunately, the source tape for that disc was mangled, and this is very audible on "David Watts" and "Death of a Clown." Other tracks sound better, but we're obviously a long way from the master tape.

    The PRT and Castle CLACD use Stereo Mix 2a for both songs. (The CLACD, again, swaps left and right channels.) The 2001 Sanctuary/Castle mini-LP uses Stereo Mix 2b for "Tin Soldier Man" and Stereo Mix 2a for "Situation Vacant." The Victor Japan K2 uses Stereo Mix 2b for both songs, so its mixes are not the same as those on the Reprise, and (if my information is correct) not the original mixes.

    Once again, the PRT and the Castle CLACD sound almost identical, and the sound seems a bit warmer than on the 2001 mini-LP or the K2. But the truncated songs are undeniably a problem. The K2 is a tad bright, but it does provide full-length versions of all the tracks.

    Teichiku and Victor Japan both put out early two-fers of Something Else with Live at Kelvin Hall. The Teichiku, if memory serves, has some noise reduction here and there. The Victor (VICP-5330) is almost the same as the original German PRT Something Else, but for some reason "Love Me Till the Sun Shines" has some of its intro sliced off.
     
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  14. live evil

    live evil Senior Member

    Location:
    ohio

    Matthew - thanks for the great analysis of these various releases, but it begs the question - if I just want to pop "Something Else" into the cd player and listen to it - which one should I buy?
     
  15. hutlock

    hutlock Forever Breathing

    Location:
    Cleveland, OH, USA
    My vote is for the Castle Mono in that case.
     
  16. live evil

    live evil Senior Member

    Location:
    ohio
    Thanks.
    I will look for that one.
     
  17. hutlock

    hutlock Forever Breathing

    Location:
    Cleveland, OH, USA
    Should be cheap and easily found!
     
  18. Matthew B.

    Matthew B. Scream Quietly

    Location:
    Tokyo, Japan
    Hell if I know. The one I'd pop into the player is the Castle Essentials mastering (the one with the eight bonus tracks), since that has the mono mix. But keep in mind that even after taming the EQ, that disc's still going to sound a little artificial.

    Its catalogue number is ESM CD 480, or SMRCD029 for the Sanctuary Midline reissue.

    For stereo enthusiasts, I'll echo everyone else and say to get the Reprise for "Tin Soldier Man" and "Situation Vacant" and the PRT for all the other tracks. But if you insist on restricting yourself to only one CD, the Victor Japan K2 might be a better choice.
     
  19. ottoman79

    ottoman79 Forum Resident

    + 1 :righton:
     
  20. Andreas

    Andreas Senior Member

    Location:
    Frankfurt, Germany
    The worst sounding of them all. :thumbsdn:
     
  21. Andreas

    Andreas Senior Member

    Location:
    Frankfurt, Germany

    So what is it?
     
  22. hutlock

    hutlock Forever Breathing

    Location:
    Cleveland, OH, USA
    Which would you pick?
     
  23. Guy E

    Guy E Senior Member

    Location:
    Antalya, Turkey
    Yes. But the Kinks Kronikles version is okay, so a CDR with that track substituted will do the trick.

    The stereo Reprise CD has some odd mixes and the output level is very low on a couple of tracks such as Situation Vacant.

    I just have the Castle and Reprise versions myself
     
  24. Matthew B.

    Matthew B. Scream Quietly

    Location:
    Tokyo, Japan
    Good question. Obviously the version of "Tin Soldier Man" on the PRT and Castle CLACD — the one I've called "Stereo Mix 2a" — is just edited down from the full-intro "Stereo Mix 2b." I think the same holds true for "Situation Vacant"; at the very least, the "2b" mix with the coda was edited from a mix with a longer fade-out than the one on "2a."

    I don't know why those mixes were made, or when they first showed up. It's even possible that they're the original stereo mixes; I've often heard that they aren't, and the stuff on the Reprise disc sounds more like 1967-style mixing, but the coda'd and coda-less versions of "Situation Vacant" have created so much confusion that I'm not sure what to think. Here are the earliest appearances I know of:

    "Tin Soldier Man" Stereo Mix 2a (shortened intro): PRT Something Else CD, 1988.

    "Tin Soldier Man" Stereo Mix 2b (full intro): Castle The Kinks Collection CD, 1987. (Is the same mix on Castle's 1985 The Kinks Collection LP?)

    "Situation Vacant" Stereo Mix 2a (no coda): PRT Something Else CD, 1988.

    "Situation Vacant" Stereo Mix 2b (with coda): See for Miles The EP Collection CD, 1990.
     
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  25. owsley

    owsley Senior Member

    Location:
    Boston
    My friend has an original Pye stereo Something Else, I'll have to double check but I'm almost certain the stereo mix of 'Situation Vacant' is the same as the Reprise stereo lp. Also note the mono mix of Vacant is very different than the stereo. I know we're sticking to CD's here but it's too bad the alternate mix of 'Afternoon Tea' (only issued in Canada and Germany) has yet to be reissued.
     
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