Klipsch Cornwall 4

Anyone else got some of these beasts? I’m thinking they would be a great match for my SET amp

 

Demoed Cornwall IVs today. I was ambivalent frankly. Demod the LaScala AL5s about a month ago and was knocked out by them but the cabinets are too deep for my space. Two weeks later did one with new Fortes and was unimpressed. The Corn 4s checked more boxes for me. There was a lot to like but still found them to have more horn coloration than I’d prefer. I don’t know if I could live with them long term.

They were pretty forward sounding with little width or depth beyond those cabinets. Cranking them wasn’t fatiguing and the micro/macro dynamics were good. I’m considering a home demo because without hearing them with my front end and electronics in my room it’s not a complete assessment. I’m intrigued enough to do it though.

 

Interesting juxtaposition from my POV. I disliked the LaScala AL5 and preferred the Forte III but felt there was a bass imbalance vis-a-vis the Cornwall III, but the CW IIIs have a shouty midrange that's hard to ignore. When the CW IV was announced I jumped all over them and been listening to them now for the better part of two months. I also have three other speakers nearby that I rotate in-n-out of the system (Quad ESL 57, Falcon LS3/5a, ProAc Tablette 10 Sig). I can see how the CW struck you as being forward, and they are on poorly mastered pop/rock. On golden age Classical (Decca SXL, RCA living stereo, Mercury Living Presence, et al) they can be sublime to downright impressive in scale and weight. They have a narrow listening window and are directional (what horns aren't?). I see you own tube gear and they do love/respond well to PP or SET amps. They display the sort of jump factor and dynamic expression that far exceeds what the Dahlquist can muster (I owned DQ10s eons ago) but still play small scale convincingly.

 

I agree on their abilities regarding dynamics. And I listened to a range of music, one selection being my RCA Shaded Dog of Rieners Pictures at an Exhibition ( the finale). The scale was great and that impressed me. But it was even better on the AL5s. So much it had me laughing and slacked jawed. I’d never heard it sound better.

Btw I liked the IVs control in the bass / bottom end. It was tight and punchy ( bettering my DQ 10s) and certainly didn’t overpower the rest of the range. And I never felt I was hearing the ports. Those 15” woofers never sounded flabby or slow.

(Btw I recently had my DQ10s woofers refoamed and the Xovers recapped. They really sound great again. But I’m considering different speakers, and horns are an option.)

Like I said, my one real knock on IVs was the shoutiness of the horns and narrow directionality. The sound never seemed to escape the cabinet boundaries. For me it did with the AL5. Btw just felt the Fortes didn’t do weight and scale enough to meet my needs.

 

What's with the +/- 4 db ? How about at 3 ?

 

Dunno. You'll have to ask Klipsch.

 

Did you demo with a tube amp at the dealer? I doubt if you would find them "shouty" when played through a tube amp, as specially a SET.

 

just watched a review on youtube that mentioned they can be bright and shouty if toed in and smoother if aimed straight ahead

(i guess that's somewhat true for most speakers)

 

They were hooked up to a Pathos tube/ SS hybrid integrated at the dealer....100w IIRC.
My Sonic Frontiers amp is a 75 w channel push/pull tube. Owned for some time and that’s staying.

 

Then I think that you will find that they will perform better with your A/B PP tube amp.

I don't personally consider hybrid amps to be tube amps.

SS power amp section can make horns sound shouty, where tube power amp stages do not exhibit this tendency.

 

Curious that you were curious enough to listen to them. Looking at your equipment listing, you have a system that is almost diametrically opposed to the Cornwall or a horn system, in presentation. What made you try them?

 

Why is my rig diametrically opposed to a horn system? Because I don’t have a low power SET tube amp? I own DQ 10s? I’m open to listening to different speakers. That’s why I demoed then. It’s called an open mind.

I’ve owned many speakers over 40+ years. My old best friend bought a pair of Altec Valencia’s in 73. I heard them a ton in the 70s. I lived with him and those Altecs from 80-85. Does that count towards my horn bona fides?

 

The sound never escaping the boundaries problem could be a placement issue. How large a room did you demo them in?
In my 22’ x 24’ room my lowly Cornwall 1s act like giant mini monitors. It’s hard to believe by looking at them but they really do vanish.

 

It seems I wasn't clear. I was only curious. It was more to do with observing differing paths to musical bliss and trying to understand how fellow audiophiles get there, and maybe share that. I did not seek to attack you, and I am not an apologist for Klipsch.

I'm also one who has had horns, open baffles, field-coil single-drivers and electrostatics, so I can empathise with your search. Some days I think horns are in my future. Others, sealed or ported monitors like Rogers or ATC.

The one experience I'd like to determine my affinity with the new range of Klipsch horns is long(-er) term exposure to them. But I'd likely have to buy a pair first which incurs losses. I've heard a few modified Heritage speakers in recent years which are amazing but very setting dependent. So it would be a risk all around, for us to buy a pair.

 

And I watched a review of a guy using a low-brow Yamaha amp who didn't find them shouty, harsh, brittle or bright; go figure ! Plus, Steve Guttenberg loved them !

 

The room was probably 14 x 20. One of their smaller rooms. They were on the long wall. Keep in mind there’s a lot of gear in there. I was seated about 10’ from the speakers, which were about 2’ out from the wall and about 7’ apart. They were very slightly toed in. Probably not optimal setup. Which is why I’m considering a home demo. I’m not saying they sounded bad. But there certainly was horn coloration.

 

An observation I have with CW IV and I heard this on the Forte III, in a average height listening chair with the tweeter axis more or less level with my ears; I found the smoothest midrange response listening on the mid-horns axis. If I slouched in my chair the mids became more coherent and less phasy. Having the CW IV at home i've been experimenting with temporary pedestals, raising the speakers between 6-10+ inches. When I settle on the optimum height for me i'll have my fabricator weld up stands. There's a 'venetian blind' effect inherent in horn drivers of this type which is not unlike early Quads. With CW's, listening on the 'wrong' axis will drastically affect the outcomes.

 

So you mean at almost a meter high, your ears are above tweeter level ? Tall couch or tall guy ? What's been the optimal toe-in so far for you; by on-axis you mean toed in quite a bit ?

 

I mainly listen from a reclining lounge chair where my ear is at 38-40" from the floor. The CW IVs tweeter center is about 35 1/2" off the floor.

 

I'm 6' 2¨ and my couch allows the tweeters on my floorstanders to be at perfect ear-level. Tweeter center is at 36¨. So I guess the Cornies would be spot-on. Pity the y just don't sell them down here ! They'd prolly sell them for about somewhere between 2-3 times the USA retail price anyway.

 

Trade offs my friend...I've been to Buenos Aires you guys eat better, drink great wine with every meal and the women are HOT!

 

Untreated paper woofers paired with a fabric dome tweeter will get you the least amount sound coloration in a loudspeaker if that's a primary goal.

Horn coloration used to really stand out but in this era of plastic/metal/kevlar woofers paired with equally exotic tweeters, I don't even think most people remember what uncolored speakers sound like unless they're into vintage.

 

I had the CW III and I found the cabinets "sang along" with the music. There was a upper bass resonance that obscured midrange detail. (My Forte I and Forte II do this to a much lesser extent. And my Belles were WORSE). So, I am wondering if this has been addressed on the CW IV via bracing?

 

It's a whole new cabinet with different bracing and it no longer uses the shelf port of the classic Cornwall. Whether resonance issues have been addressed, I don't know. I still haven't heard them yet.

 

I try to find things out on the Klipsch forum, but so many there have no idea there IS cabinet resonances from various Klipsch models. So, I am reluctant to trust anyone's opinion over there as PWK is God and all Klipsch speakers are perfect. Then there is the other faction where if and only if you do all these mods can you get good results. Ne'er the twain shall meet.