Led Zeppelin II RL-Which pressing sounds best?

Do you think that my at/gp pressed at Presswell will actually sound better on my fave song on the LP -- "Bring it on Home" -- the last cut on Side 2, than either my RL Presswell or my RL Monarch (assuming they're in similar condition)?


(Anyone in addition to tlmusic who has experience / input / opinions appreciated too!)

.

 

Hi James,
When you speak about Columbia, do you intend bot CTH and CP plants that are at the same level?
Or there are other further differences between these two...
I think I'm one of those "poor" collectors here about the LZ II RL SS because I have only one copy and it is a Columbia, Pitman, NJ press (CP). It is in EX++ condition.

 

I couldn't agree more.

 

I've pretty much given up hope on finding any of these outside of eBay for hundreds of dollars. I've checked every LZll I see for years, no RL. Actually, I find very few LZ albums in suitable condition to even consider buying. The whole catalogue has been rehashed many times but not really in a definitive way(except maybe the Classic 45 box).
I'd like to see a deluxe 45 RPM box from the original tapes ALL remastered by Bob Ludwig. Press it at QRP maybe? It would probably cost $400-$500 but still sell out in pre orders before release. Oh well, there's always Mothership I suppose.

 

When you speak about Columbia, do you intend bot CTH and CP plants that are at the same level?
Or there are other further differences between these two...
I think I'm one of those "poor" collectors here about the LZ II RL SS because I have only one copy and it is a Columbia, Pitman, NJ press (CP). It is in EX++ condition.

 

Can anyone else comment on sound differences between various RL cuts/pressings? Do the 1A matrices copies sound best? Sound differences between pressing plants? Do the ones with "SS" aswell as the "RL" sound better? How big are the differences? Thanks.

 

FWIW - I have a Presswell RL (no ss on side one) (nm) and a Monarch RL (containing an ss on side one) (vg+), and on my system, there is no discernable difference soundwise between the the two. Also, the run-out groove on both is the exact same length. I've been doing a shoot-out all week and even had Balki (another forum member) over to see if he could hear any difference and he was stumped as well. If anyone here has compared these two pressings, please let me know if you can hear any difference between the two.

From having looked at a number of these, mostly online albeit, and listened to the aforementioned two, I think this is the same mastering (i.e. by Ludwig at Sterling Sound). The only sonic differences would be from the metal parts used by the two plants - and as I said, I can't hear any difference. If anyone else would like to chime in and tell me what they think the difference is (i.e. between the ss and non-ss) I'd appreciate it.

 

Nice read thus far, will help at the record collectors expo on Saturday. I own I,III, IV and Physical Graffiti on vinyl but not II which is my favorite zep album. I've came across 2 copies in the last month but they were both so beat up I didn't even bother to check the runout grooves for the "RL" Ill keep an eye out for a monarch

 

I also have the Preswell with no "SS" on Side 1, it has A-A matrices both sides. Apparently SS both sides is supposed to sound the best but so are the A/A matrices copies! Also have a Monarch with "SS" both sides, can't tell any difference in sound quality here!

 

IIRC the key is the run-off on side 2 (I'm sure it's side 2). The best sounding have ss on both sides and a very short run off compared to other copies.

 

The IIs I have both have an ss on side 2 and an equally narrow run-out groove.

Now, the Monarch I have has an ss on side 1 and the Presswell does not. The run-ot groove is the same on both side ones in terms of narrowness (not as narrow as side two). So my comparison/question is only related to side 1.

FWIW - the second sides of these two (which both have the ss) sound the same to me as well, but I am curious about the first side.

 

A myth. Ludwig cut three lacquers for Atlantic: A, B, and C. Owned them all, compared them all. The dead wax areas have slightly different widths including the two that are fairly narrow or rather, come closer than usual to the label, but sound-wise, theres too little difference to mean anything.
The closer you get to the label, the slower the relative stylus/groove wall speed and the more information thats crammed into a reduced length, resulting in lower fidelity. Plus each pressing is different, stampers do wear as they stamp, and the pressing plants themselves impart slight but noticeable differences in sound. So even if there's a smidgen more bass in the narrowest dead wax of his cuttings, it gets 'paid for' by the last track.

Again, the criteria for an RL Led Zep II is try to get the cleanest playing one possible.

 

Thanks for the clarification Raunchnroll.

 

I love my original Atlantic UK pressing .

 

How good are the speciality pressed copies people? As nice sounding as monarchs/presswells? Thanks.

 

What about the lacquer RL cut for Columbia, (the 1A) shouldn't that be a fourth lacquer?

 

My RL CP (Columbia, Pitman) copy has the following dead wax:

Side 1: ST-A-691671 RL ss B 3
Side 2: ST-A-691672 RL ss A 3

The lacquers are B3 and A3 (more or less at 12 o'clock), if my understanding is correct...

 

When I heard this Presswell:

SIDE 1 ST.H-691671-J HT W
SIDE 2 ST-A-691672 W AT GP PR

I thought it might be a secret RL (as if there were such a thing). It just sounded great to me. I know at least one other forum member had a similar reaction.

 

Yes - I left out the Columbia's. I was referring to the 3 he did found on the Atlantic pressings, the Presswells and Monarchs. These are the pressings that have the 'narrowest' dead wax. (forgot which letter code specifically)

 

Comparison just done between these two:
1) RL ss MO press with narrowed side 2.
Side 1: ST - A - 691671-MO - CC RL ss LW(sideways) △13933 (2) W AT
Side 2: ST - A - 691672 - MO AA LW(sideways) AT RL ss △13933-X W

2) UK plum "wreck" copy.
Side 1: A2 1 1 3
Side 2: B2 1 1

To my ears, the RL doesn't kill the UK plum. They are very similar...
IMO, If you have a nice copy of this UK plum, you don't need to have the RL ss...if not for a collector purpose.

 

honestly the cleanest possible RL is gonna be the german....unfortunately, its an rl on side one only..but german vinyl is more often found mint in my experience and quieter too.ymmv

 

My American press RL is almost dead silent, if you can find a quiet one you're golden, american vinyl wasn't that bad in the late 60s, its more a lot of these are scratched to bits

Side One: ST-A-691671-A and then the following a sideways P LW then upright W AT RL

Side Two: ST-A-691672-A and then sideways P LW and upright AT RL SS W

 

I have a excellent condition UK Plum, 2nd issue, Not a "wreck" one with these stampers you speak of. Sounds pretty good to me. All this talk of RL makes me want to track one down, but I dont think I have the energy. I certainly dont have the will to pay $100 plus.

Can the RL really be that much better? From what I understand its a louder cut. We know anything LOUDER in comparison to something QUIETER will seem BETTER, its the human condition. Therefore, I wonder if it does actually sound that much better than a plumb.......anyone done a comparison whilst being aware of this very important but often not understood factor??

 

yes it is really that much better. It is about as dynamic and exciting as recorded rock and roll gets on vinyl IMO!!!

 

Check my post #151 and #156 here and you will find a feedback from me: http://forums.stevehoffman.tv/threa...of-led-zeppelin-ii.84938/page-7#post-10418093

Anyway, my feeling is that the US RL and the UK plum A2/B2 are very similar...IMO.