DCC Archive Let It Be vs Get Back Album

Just finished listening to the George Martin mix---really thought it was a much better album (you gotta love the intended photo cover also) than the Spector production--for those who have heard this--- what's your opinion? Lastly--will we ever in our lifetime see the film released again?

 

Well by the time Apple and all the legal staff involved gets their act together we all may be all too old or long gone to enjoy it. Apparently the film has been remastered (check out the stereo sound during the rooftop performances on the Anthology video.) We really need this film available once again. DVD 5.1 all the way (where possible.)Also how about a nice deluxe box set version along with a standard DVD/VHS edition, and of course have Steve remaster the CD with bonus tracks. Gotta think big here.

 

Well by the time Apple and all the legal staff involved gets their act together we all may be all too old or long gone to enjoy it. Apparently the film has been remastered (check out the stereo sound during the rooftop performances on the Anthology video.) We really need this film available once again. DVD 5.1 all the way (where possible.)Also how about a nice deluxe box set version along with a standard DVD/VHS edition, and of course have Steve remaster the CD with bonus tracks. Gotta think big here.

 

I own a boot of 'Get Back' and I think in some ways it's a mess like 'Let It Be'. For me, it's too sloppy but that was their goal. John Lennon was really into the idea of presenting the Beatles in an honest, non-polished form (warts and all). That was the original idea behind the album (That's part of the joke of the then/now cover idea). 'Get Back' succeeded in representing that goal but I think (just my humble opinion) that Lennon was really in a sabatoge frame of mind with the Beatles at that point. He wanted out since 'Sgt. Pepper' and at that point he really wanted out. He seemed to have trouble for years making the 'final cut' from the band. Look at where his life was going during those years. Everything connected with that album (even bringing in Spector and how some songs were manipulated: 'Long & Winding Road'-part of the lawsuit) was at a very low for the band and especially Klien (the inclusion of the book to charge tons of $$$ for the album, "new phase of the Beatles", etc.). Phil Spector (again my opinion) did a great job cutting through all the tapes and crap to make the album more coherent but his alterations (adding choirs/strings/fluff/muzak) hurt it more than help it. He gave a dead horse a new sense of energy but went way too far. It might have been a better album if he kept to the "intent" of the original mixes or at least the feel. I have 'Let It Be' on VHS and it's a great, sad documentary about the final disintergration of the world's greatest band (it's like watching a marriage on the verge of divorce). The roof top concert is fun to watch but you can tell that they just can't stand being together. I think it should be released on DVD/VHS but it's not a happy film. Maybe they see it like that to and that's why it's still MIA??

Todd

 

Oh I'm sure that they're not too excited about re-releasing the film, even though its just sitting on the shelf, remastered. If you watch Anthology they were still uncomfortable talking about it.

BTW, I don't think George Martin had much to do with any mixes. I seem to remember it was Glyn Johns that made several attempts at assembling an lp. 2 for sure, maybe 3? All rejected. The last one finally came out on one of those Vigotone John Barrett CDs. Anyway you slice it, the whole project was left unfinished.

As far as the Let It Be release I really don't care for Spector's treatment of Across The Universe, Long & Winding Road, Let It Be. The rest is ok. Overall, I'd rather listen to the boots.

What I'd really, really like to hear is the whole rooftop mixed from the multitracks! All the boots of that are sourced from the mono Nagra reels.

 

I have the Glyn Johns "Get Back" remastered on Vigotone. Once you hear that, I think a lot of you would think differently. It's a wonderful piece of history into what "Get Back" might have been; less produced, more natural and incidental rather than fragmented and over produced, some material while not left off, was edited horribly. Glyn Johns had a tight project, IMO. I didn't feel that way listening to just the Spectored "Let It Be". I also own a copy of the film that was duped from laserdisc, possibly the RCA flip-top plastic jobbie. All the inperfections of the film and splices...

I also have an 8-disc'r on Vigotone called the "Get Back Sessions Vol 2" which covers a LOT of the mono tape that was run filming it all. It gives you a long running perspective on the other state of Twinkingham, when the only thing the Beatles seemed to jell on was jamming randomly on older tunes they knew, mostly John's odd ideas, Paul following it. As most people can agree, they were artistically in different corners of the room, and nothing ever seemed to make sense. I think they held on to the fact that they wanted to get the hell out of there, and make music quickly and true to their own expectations. They just didn't want to comprimise a thing. Some of it is really neat, like Mal working with them doing "Maxwell's Silver Hammer".

Everything had it's reason, but the brilliance is best exemplified when you listen to the jams they fell into. There's more than 18 hours of material most people haven't heard during the January Twickenham time. Sometimes I can't even listen to an hour of it at a time though. It's like listening to a car trying to start in vain.

 

I agree with Sckott. I prefer "Get Back" to "Let it Be" - it seems to flow as well as can be expected and holds together better as an album.

 

Well, let me counter: I was disappointed with the "Get Back" mixes. I don't think Glyn Johns was too keen on going through all those tapes to find (or if necessary, assemble) the best takes. I understand the concept of "warts and all", but:

1) Why would you choose a take of "Got a Feeling" from earlier in the sessions, prior to the inclusion of the "everybody had a hard year" middle eight? It sounds like it just dies in the middle.

2) Nasty uninspired, unfinished take of Two of Us. I think Spector at least picked the best takes.

3) Don't Let Me Down is OK - still the George Martin B-side take was superior. Why not use it?

4) An extended version of Dig It? This is probably the only title in The Beatles cannon that I would not have missed if it had never been released. A previous analogy about "sounding like a car that just wont start" is applicable here. Phil knew that there was about 50 seconds worth hearing. Glyn thought about 5 minutes was good. I agree with Phil.

5) The "unreleased" titles: (Rocker, Save the Last Dance) are snippets. Most of us did better jams on old favorites when we were 17 years old in dad's garage. Harsh? Yes. True?....

5) In defense - the bare bones Long and Winding, Let it Be and Across the Universe have their charms, but most are available elsewhere.

BTW - The Vigotone bonus tracks, 2 takes of Teddy Boy - were NOT part of the original mix. There is NO finished take of the Beatles performing this song. These are both first (and second) walk throughs, with Paul shouting out the chord changes to the others as they play. Lyrics are unfinished and mumbled. Not worth the price of admission.

Overall, Glyn Johns mixes are interesting, but it is easy to see why they were rejected.

Just my 2 cents..

 

The job was touted as a "warts and all" artistic idea from the start. When you listen to the Twickenham tapes, both on studio mic and on film, then you listen to Spector's version, the whole idea of presenting what the Beatles did in that time period is best on the Glyn Johns. Hey, that's just my opinion.

True though, Spector's version may have been more listenable to the passing fan, and if I were to choose what would be more acceptable to a critical ear, it may have been Spector's version, but that's not the version I like the best. What they did on the roof to what they did in Twickenham... the raw egg whites are in Mr. Johns mix.

 

Nit-picky correction: That snippet of a song which is mis-titled "Rocker" on just about every bootleg is actually the old Fats Domino tune "I'm Ready". The Band covered it on Moondog Matinee.

I agree with Al, though... the Glyn Johns Get Back album is overrated by many fans. Lots of strange/bad choices in the takes Johns used. While Spector did some awful things (primarily his overblown Across the Universe and Long and Winding Road) at least he generally found the best takes of the songs he used. And aside from the above-mentioned songs, his mixes aren't bad. In my opinion the Spector mixes of Get Back and Let it Be outclass the 45 mixes of the same songs. I can't stand hearing LIB with the second solo buried in the mix.

From all the Get Back session tapes I've heard, I think it would be possible to assemble an album stronger than Spector's Let it Be. But the Glyn Johns Get Back album is definitely not it.

 

A few comments/questions...

First, I must say I like the 45 versions of Get Back and Let It Be over the LP versions. Let It Be in particular just has more of a Beatles sound on the 45, with the brass mixed down and the backing vocals mixed up. The LP mix sounds too schmaltzy.

Second, I know Johns did a few different versions of the LP. Did he use the same takes each time?

 

I prefer Get Back, but I have to admit, from the sound of other tapes from those sessions, it still could be improved.

I get the impression that John didn't want to take the "warts-and-all" feel to the extreme that Johns left it because he hated the original test pressings so much. Personally, I have to agree that "Rocker" and "Save the Last Dance" should be left off, as should "Maggie May" and "Dig It." I just don't buy the whole bit about preserving the atmosphere of the Beatles just playing around and having fun. That feeling's already there without those tracks, which just feel too amateurish to me (furthermore, they aren't even funny like other outtakes the Beatles have recorded earlier in their career).

Considering the mess that's been made those sessions, I would like to see the surviving Beatles revisit them once again. It's not going to happen, but I think they had a great idea going. Maybe they can go back and put together a 80 minute or even a two CD set of the tapes that would show a work in progress, similar to, say, "The Charlie Parker Story." You could put earlier takes, like the great "I got A Feeling" take on A3 that unfortunately broke down, on the CD and revisit them later in a final, completed form that could show how a great performance is made tighter or properly executed over time.

But, who am I kidding? The only way that's going to happen is on a computer and a CD-burner, not over at Abbey Road.

 

Luke,

I have a question about the differences between the LP version of Let It Be and the single mix...need your help!

I think Phil Spector repeated a line at the end (...there will be an answer...) the first time with the guitar overdub mixed out, the second time with it mixed in).

I believe there were two guitar overdubs. The single and LP have each of them. So far no version has both.

I like the single version better. The LP version has the guitar part mixed so loud it nearly eclipses Paul's vocal.

Read this in the Beatles Recording Sessions book.

Thanks!

 

Yes, Spector made an edit to extend the length of the song, by repeating on of the later sections (don't recall offhand which one it was). Indeed, the first portion doesn't have the guitar overdub, while the section portion does.

Yes, there were two guitar overdubs. The original live guitar solo was not used, and doesn't exist on the final multitrack (although it may still exist on the pre-bounced multitrack - not sure). The guitar solo from the 45 was overdubbed on 30 April 1969. The solo from the LP (as well as the guitar fills on both the 45 and LP mixes) was done on 4 January 1940.

FWIW, here's a little mix I did that uses both solos:
http://lukpac.org/mp3/LIB.mp3

 

This past week on eBay an Apple Get Back sold for $41, and a Vigotone Get Back sold for $51.

Apple Get Back

Vigotone Get Back

I'd been tempted to bid on both, but for some reason I can't remember my attention was directed to The Beatles Anthology 3.

Of the 23 tracks on Disc 2, eight of them are Get Back Glyn Johns titles. Whether they are the exact tracks I don't know, there seem to be first, second, and final Glyn Johns Get Back compilations. Get Back tracks missing from Anthology 3 include The One After 909, Rocker, Save the Last Dance For Me, Don't Let Me Down, Maggie Mae, I Me Mine (though there is a George Martin/Phil McDonald I Me Mine included), and Across the Universe.

Of these seven tracks, three appear to be snippets, and the other songs are available on regular issue cd's sans any too-lush Spector production excepting Universe, so I decided $40 and up was a bit much.

Disc 2 is really a treat, covering mostly the Abbey Road/Let it Be period.

[ December 25, 2001: Message edited by: justhefax ]

 

Phil Spector also added effects to the high-hat, which I don't like.

Like Brian and Luke, I prefer the George Martin 45 mix of "Let It Be". It seems like Spector remixed it just to have his name on it.

After hearing the original intended mix of "The Long And Winding Road" on Anthology 3 I just can't go back to the hit version.

[ December 25, 2001: Message edited by: Grant T. ]

 

1) The track that Phil Spector artifically lengthened was "I Me Mine", not "Let It Be". The original shorter version of "I Me Mine" was recorded on 4-January-1970. You can hear the original on Anthology 3

2) Glyn Johns made some really bad decisions in choosing the takes that he put onto "Get Back". For example, on "Two of Us", he used a slow, unfinished version whereas he could have used the finished version from 31-January that Spector used. The take that both Johns and Spector used of "Long and Winding Road" was also incomplete. They should have used the take from 31-January which was featured in the film. In addition to having a beautiful solo from Billy Preston on the middle eight, it was much more refined and finished than the take from 23-January.

The BEST fidelity version of Glyn John's mix was released by Vigotone. It is called "Get Back -- The Glyn Johns Final Compilation" (VT-182). Although it is the "final mix" (minus "Teddy Boy" and including "Across the Universe" "I Me Mine", it includes both John's full-length and Spector's shortened mixes of "Teddy Boy" as bonus tracks. This Vigotone version seems to be from a cassette copy of Glyn John's master tape.


The other "Get Back" bootlegs, including Vigotone's "As Nature Intended" are inferior. "As Nature Intended" lacks all semblance of highs and Yellow Dog's "Get Back and 22 Other Songs" is from an acetate treated with noise reduction.

If you've absolutely GOT to have the first Glyn Johns mix of "Get Back" (from March, 1969), the best way to hear it is on the 17 disc collection "Thirty Days" from Vigotone. Although still inferior to the great sound quality of the Vigotone "Final Compilation", it is from a decent tape source and doesn't suffer from the lack of highs that "As Nature Intended" does.

If you want to obtain CDR copies of these bootlegs, please contact me via E-mail for information.

Fred

 

For the record, though, there *HAS* to be an upgrade of the final mix out there, as all of the commercial bootlegs are from edited tapes at least a few generations removed from the source.


Somewhere, somehow, the bonanza will be found.

-D

 

IIRC, As Nature (and, consequently, 30 Days, as the same basic source was used on both discs) isn't from cassette..it's from sort other sort of tape medium. I'm also suspicious as to the "cassette" nature of some of the Barrett stuff, but not others (most of Turn Me On Dead Man sounds cassette sourced, but only some of the Hari stuff does).

-D

 

Spector actually lengthened both tracks. Paul repeats "There will be an answer" twice at the end of the LP version, which pushes the track time to 4.01 (the single was 3.50)
Both were mixed from the same take with both solos sitting side by side on the multi.

A few months ago I downloaded a version with both solos playing at the same time in separate channels. Sounds incredible.

 

...which takes us back to Luke's posting above! See his link to this custom mix.

 

I'll never forget Billy Preston's reply when I got to meet him back around 1987, he said that Phil Spector's mix on the Let It Be album was "mush man mush!"
Take it from a guy that was there to begin with.

 

The alternative mix is available on Past Masters 2