Let's talk about The Beach Boys - Holland

Fans made them an oldies act. After American Graffiti and the oldies craze took over America, the fans insisted that they play the oldies. At first they resisted, but in 1974 the band sent Dennis to meet with Jim Guercio. His advice was, you have all those hits, so play them. Give the people who are paying their hard earned dollars what they want to hear. They wanted the oldies. So, the band acquiesced and played the oldies, toured with Chicago and became Superstars again.

 

Find a session of their backing vocals where Mike isn’t contributing. You can’t. He was reliable and did the work regardless of his alleged “don’t f with the formula” stance.

 

You're forgetting about how the Endless Summer album went to #1 in '74. After that, there was no turning back...

 

I find California Saga unlistenable, mawkish, and cloying, but otherwise I'm quite fond of the album. I can skip the entire "saga" and with the magic radio material and now the hi-res / sacd We Got Love bonus, it is a full length album anyway and good to great throughout.

 

Not entirely. They were still adding deep cuts to their sets until the end of the 70s and it has long been established that they didn't simply become an oldies act in 1974.

Unfortunately Carl had plenty of issues in the mid-70s and that, combined with Brian's continued struggles, meant that them all pulling together in the studio never really happened. They did try with the Caribou stuff, but didn't come up with much as a group.

 

Its a toss up between this one and 'surfs up' for my favourite 70s album by the band.

 

Adding deep cuts to their sets means they're not an oldies act? Hmmm..... Playing over two thirds of oldies in your set makes you an oldies act. Just ask the Stones.

 

This is true, but Dennis’ meeting and subsequent hiring of Guercio as manager pretty much threw the switch that swung them more toward performing oldies. Endless Summer is the catalyst that drove the fans to demand that they play the oldies. There is a difference there, because in 1974 they were still refusing to play full oldies shows.

 

But remember it just wasn’t the already established BB fans buying Endless Summer - that collection created a whole second generation of new fans who of course wanted to hear those songs live.

 

I love both albums and IMO, they made a great pairing on the double CD reissue since Chaplin and Fataar were an integral part of the band on both albums and they also divvied up the songwriting very democratically on both. They are also both graced with some scintillating keyboard work from Daryl Dragon and they both have that spiritual angle that we first heard on the brilliant Friends album. "You Need A Mess of Help" and "Here She Comes" kick off the album with a one-two punch of funky piano-driven rockers. "He Come Down" is a great transcendental gospel song. "Marcella" is a fine sultry rocker with a nice rolling groove. "Hold On Dear Brother" is a nice country/soul-flavored waltz with tasty steel guitar. "All This Is That" is one of their best spiritual/metaphysical songs with a serene and uplifting vibe that wouldn't have sounded out of place on Friends. Dennis's "Make It Good" and "Cuddle Up" are beautiful songs, once again revealing Dennis as a sensitive and underrated writer. It's all subjective, of course, but IMO, the 2 albums have a similar feel (although they're significantly different), and for me, they would work quite well as a double album . Pairing them up on the double CD basically turned them into one. I go back and forth on which one I like more.

 

Holland is a beautiful album from beginning to end. It has the tranquil spirituality of Friends, a bit of Smiley Smile whimsy (especially on "Mt. Vernon and Fairway"), and with the extended jam and synth solo on "Leavin' This Town", the shifting tempos and narration on "Mt. Vernon and Fairway", and the epic suite structure of the 12-minute "California Saga", along with SMiLE, it's one of their 2 most progressive albums. It's one of the few album in my collection in which I keep 2 copies. I have the white label promo vinyl album complete with the white label 7" "Mt. Vernon" with its paper sleeve, and the cover photo is one of the best album covers ever. It's just a way cool album to have on vinyl, even though I also have it on the double reissue CD with Carl and the Passions "So Tough" which I love about as much as Holland. Although I already had it on vinyl, I bought the CD for "So Tough", and as I mentioned in another post, they make the equivalent of a really good double album (and very nice car music). Even Mike Love (who has a somewhat unfair reputation of trying to get the Beach Boys to stick with the formula of the early surf and hot rod songs), referred (in his book) to Holland as "a damn good album." I have to agree with him.

 

I know I'm in a minority, but I love 15 Big Ones in all its quirkiness. Whereas Friends, Surf's Up, Sunflower, So Tough, and Holland are progressive, spiritual, and socially conscious albums overall, 15 Big Ones is a fun, lighthearted album, and that's a big part of what the band was all about. I personally really like the way they did the oldies, and they came up with some really nice originals like "That Same Song", "It's OK', "Had to Phone Ya", "Back Home", and even the zany "TM Song" which would have fit right in on Smiley Smile. Brian said in Rolling Stone ,just before the album's release, "I personally ran out of ideas." That accounts for the inclusion of the oldies on the album, but it seemed to have regenerated him enough to come up with some of his most inventive melodies and intricate chord progressions on Love You, which IMO, is the last truly great BBs album. To keep from turning this into a total threadcrap, I sincerely say that Holland is a masterwork that has aged remarkably well.

 

If his buddy had never heard of Blondie Chaplin, there's no way he was even close to being the world's #1 Beach Boys fan. The lout you describe reminds me of a guy sitting 2 seats down from me at the Happy Together tour in 1986. When Gene Clark's Byrds tribute band (billed by the venue as the Byrds) were on stage, he kept yelling, "Where's Eric Clapton, dammit? If I'd known Eric Clapton wasn't gonna be here, I wouldn't be here!" I wanted to tell him that Clapton was with the Yardbirds, not the Byrds, but he was a big bad biker dude with biceps, chains, tattoos, and beer on his breath, so I kept quiet. Incidentally, Blondie Chaplin was also in Gene Clark's Byrds tribute band. I wonder if it might have been the same heckler.

 

Well, that was always going to happen of course and plenty of their pre-1973 shows had also been over two thirds oldies (I know there are some exceptions).

I was simply making the point that it wasn't as clear cut as Endless Summer turning them into an oldies act. In some 1976 shows they were playing 12 recent songs, after all...

 

If a band has 20 hits in their repertoire which are 5 to 15 years old, they will play a lot of them in a concert, anything else would be very surprising.

 

By 1974 they had 25 Top 40 hits. Most shows average about 35 songs performed. So, that is 70% of a typical show. That leaves 10 lesser hits and/or album deep cuts to be performed throughout the show. Today, the band could do a 90 mins show and only play the hits.

 

Did shows between 1974 and 1998 average at 35 songs performed?

Shows in the 70s were more like 25 songs, I think, and then later shows 30 songs.

Probably the 1993 unplugged shows were the longest they had performed at that point.

 

Actually, it depended on the venue, the crowd and the band members. I remember a late show in Phoenix where the show ran well over 2 hours. Something like 4-5 encores as the band and the crowd were really into it, especially Dennis. If on average there were less songs performed, that adds more to my point. Today, they could play a full show plus and still only play their Top 40 hits. That’s a helluva catalog and a career.

 

Rebooting this thread as I couldn't find an answer across 16 pages....
Those who own both the original Reprise and the AP reissue, do you have a preference?

I recently snagged a clean Artisan of Surf's Up after owning the AP for years. A bit (pleasantly) surprised to find that it's a better mastering (and quieter vinyl to boot, AP QC is off lately). So now I'm wondering if the other 70s records follow up a similar trajectory. Obv Holland isn't an Artisan.

My AP of Holland looks gorgeous and sounds nice, if a little bass-heavy. Not sure if that's baked into the mix. Also a bit noisy in spots, even after cleaning.

 

He was probably referring to me.

 

But you can if you name your band after an insect?

 

My original vinyl album is somewhat muffled and bass heavy, like a lot of albums from that time. Doesn't diminish the music, which is as great as any BB album.