Looking for a DAC under €1K !

The Chord Mojo is well within your budget, as is the Cambridge Audio DacMagic.200 M. (New 2021 Cambridge model ?). Audiolab M DAC ?

 

You probably know personally that big changes and big differences in sound character within the same price category of the device are very difficult to find and get.
You are looking for a new DAC below € 1k, but, I think you should be aware that all potential candidates will be very, very similar to your current SMSL Su-8. Some big differences are unrealistic and quite difficult to expect.
Differences, if they happen, will be measured in "drops", in "millimeters" ... if you understand what I mean.

Let's be realistic. Your McIntosh MA252 is such a dominant and powerful amplifier and yet it is the “link in the chain” that produces the analog signal and sends it to the speakers. McInt probably can’t allow (and probably won’t allow) a small DAC in the system to determine the character of the sound and be the “main ruler” in the area of sound.

Knowing, over the decades, the “laws” of the Audio Hobby that happen in our listening rooms, this (very likely) still won’t and shouldn’t happen.
Especially important is the fact that you are looking for a DAC for the office ...
Realistically, the office isn’t a place for loud audio-hi-fi music after all, is it?
My apology if I'm wrong, but I don't think I'm wrong too much

I believe you won’t often be in a position to loudly determine if your DAC has some thunderous “bass beat” or not.
Especially since you are planning a connection with your Harbeth speakers which, realistically, are limited in the bass range quite high (75 Hz +/- 3 dB).

So, all you are looking for from a future DAC is reliability, build quality, quantity and type of connectors, as well as a personal preference for a brand (whether you like it or not).

Looking for some big differences in sound compared to the current SMSL Su-8 DAC ... my apology in direct opinion, is, it's a bit of "Sisyphus' job".

It is a common rule that basically all devices within a similar price range, in practice, sound really very similar and carry a very similar sound stamp.
Differences can and probably do exist, but, these differences can be and are (mostly) correlated with the rest of the system that the user has.

I mean - if one DAC device sounds like "A" to my friend, that same DAC can sound completely different to me in my space and with my system components.
And no one here can tell us exactly that for any DAC.

We all have our DAC devices here, but we all have our candidates and favorites in our premises.
You can only establish the actual audio condition by direct rehearsals in your space, which, I'm afraid, is still impossible for a large number of devices.

So, let me repeat. My opinion was that it was positive to focus on the general construction of the device and the reliability of the workmanship.

Gustard is not my favorite (don't get me wrong, I personally have an Atoll DAC), but, my friend had an A22 ... now I'm watching an A26 Pro.
The construction with its own transformers is unmatched compared to the "Choper" power supply you get with cheap models.
Stable and quality electricity is the basis of good sound ... keep that in mind when choosing.

 

Thank you very much !

My office is in fact an "home office", it's 30 square meters and I listen to music all day long (a minimum of 10 hours each day).
I've added a little sub to the Harbeths (a Cambridge X301) and I listen at reasonable level (60 to 70 dBs).
I agree that the Mc has a predominant character but when I tested the Border Patrol DAC I surely heard obvious differences in sounding and I thought that going from a €200 to a €1000 Dac could make some hearable changes.
What do you think could be a real "step up" ? I could afford a bigger investment if I restrict my vinyl expenses ;-)

 

Yes, a linear power supply makes a lot of difference with the Qutest, but I think the Qutest will be too smooth sounding with your MA252. If your MA252 has balanced inputs, you should try to find something that has balanced outputs (the Qutest does not).

 

Thank you !

The friend of a friend can lend me a R2R Dac to test (Dragon something ?!) with balanced outputs and it seems to be a sort of Ares II oem (or knockoff).
I'll tell you how it sounds.

 

I bought a Topping D70 and an SMSL SU-8v.2 a couple years ago to see what all the fuss was about. At the time I was using a Resolution Audio Opus 21 ($3k) as my dac. After a couple months of listening, I sold the Topping. After a couple more months I sold the Opus 21 and lived happily with the SU-8.

I used the SU-8 for a solid year before getting the itch to try something different. When I found a good deal on a Benchmark DAC3 HGC, I bought it. Maybe a month worth of listening I found I preferred the Benchmark. My amp allowed me to switch back and forth for easy comparison which you might think revealed the differences. Quick A/B comparisons didn't reveal any difference. It was listening for a day or two and then switching that made the difference. And it was more of a general relaxation when the Benchmark went in.

Next up was a Gustard X26pro. This dac seems to be loved by many. In my 3-way comparison though, the Benchmark was tops, and surprisingly, I honestly preferred the SU-8 over the Gustard. As @Tajo1960 said, the differences are subtle, and for me in quick A/B switching, pretty much indistinguishable.

One last question for @Roland Bart, have you explored the "color" settings on the SU-8? I found these to really bring out the best in the SU-8. My favorites are "Rich 1" and "tube 1."

 

Hi Timind and thank you for your views !
I try to make a way in the jungle of informations ;-)
As I said, I'll try soon a R2R Dac (Draco not Dragon !!) and I think I'll order a D90 to compare (it's easy to return).
And I was very happy with this Su-8 until I heard beautiful voices and deep spacing with the Border Patrol's DAC.
I've tried numerous combinations on this SMSL and Slow Linear/Tube 3 was sounding very well on a Class D amp. With the Mc I selected Standard with Slow Minimum.

 

In my trials, the standard setting is one of my least favorite. I haven't tried all of the filter settings, as I can't hear any difference in them. With the color settings though, the changes are fairly obvious.

I should have mentioned, the Opus 21 is an R2R dac. It had an enjoyable smoothness to its sound. If I try another DAC, it will be something like a Pontus II. With all the hype, how can one resist? Good luck with your search.

 

Topping D90, Audiolab M-DAC+, Cambridge 200M (depending on your format/hardware needs and requirements).

 

Have you had a chance to feel the A-Lab M-DAC + at work?
My good acquaintance has it. It’s the warmest DAC I’ve ever seen (according to the heat it radiates). It gets pretty hot at work. I didn't mean "warm sound".
In the long run, I’m not sure how much the surrounding electronic parts and the elements in it “love” the resulting high heat.

EDIT:
I mean, I’ve never had clear ideas of brands that like to cram a lot of electronic elements into a very small space. Then everything was crammed inside.

A-LAb M-Dac + has a printed circuit board in 2 floors, and each is heated, and the layout is one above the other. Lots of elements with high heat dissipation, and in a relatively small volume.
When the device is simpler designed and easier to perform, it is usually 1 printed circuit board and everything has room.

But, when the device is more demanding, and the author of the idea has a desire for minimalism of the case, then what happens happens
There are several other well-known brands that love the minimalism of the case.
And then, when you look at the back ... OMG. Sometimes tweezers need to be used to connect all the cables we need

Or if you have RCA or XLR connectors with a slightly thicker base ... iso-material should be placed between them to prevent short circuit contact

 

Since you liked the BP, as do I, you may also like the Mojo (2 version now) or the Ayre Codex. I've lived with all three for years, and they have a somewhat similar sound, and I like them very much. You can pick up a used Mojo for about $400, and a Codex for around $900. Both are excellent, and both are also very good headphone DAC/Amps.

 

You can often find the Ayre QB-9 USB DAC in that price range, both the original and the later DSD version. Really good sounding DAC if you only need the USB connection. It does have true balanced outputs too. They are a little less plentiful on the used market now since many have taken up the Ayre offer of the new "Twenty" board, so they basically replace the insides of the old units creating a new, even better sounding DAC for $1500. They started this program a couple years ago.

 

Check out reviews of the RME ADI-2 DAC. Its DSP can be used to tailor the sound to your preference.

It's possible your SMSL Su-8 is transparent so a big change will require eq or other treatment. I'll assume you like your amp and speakers!

 

Nope, sorry, haven't tried any of them, but they'd be what I'd be looking at under £1000. The Topping looks incredibly good.

 

Thank you all !

I'm going to have to take a month off and take out a loan to test it all out.

I'll start my tests with 2 dacs : a Musician Audio Draco and a Topping D90se for a simple and good reason: their availability !

I took note of your other advice and I think I'm going to spend the night on the internet and YouTube ;-)

 

I was recently looking for an entry level DAC, which you are not.

But I had narrowed my choices to Schiit or Topping. I was leaning towards Schiit, but they were back ordered many weeks.
The entry level Topping devices I saw reviews for said they leaned neutral to bright. I was looking for something warmer.

I then found reviews for JDS Labs DAC and amps. I settled on an ATOM stack for my new HD6XX headphones.

JDS Labs is worth checking out. I am very pleased with both the amp and DAC so far. And they have great service.

 

Thank you !
Seems to be the no-nonsense entry level gear without all the things you don't really need.
I just wish I can find a Dac with no remote, no screen, no i2s, no bluetooth, no MQA, no volume control, etc...
I'm a little minimalistic in my gear tastes.

 

Then you need to find the DAC with the most distortion, poor linearity and poor jitter rejection!

A filterless TDA1543-based DAC like the Border Patrol is the complete opposite of high accuracy DACs from the likes of Topping, Chord, etc.

If you are so taken with the sound of the Border Patrol (despite its terrible measured performance), why not just save up for one?

If you want maximum flexibility, you could consider something like the iFi iDSD Pro. It is over your budget, but has a wide range of operating modes which should allow you to tune the sound to taste (it is also much more than just a DAC).

 

... and no DAC
It's joke, of course

 

Start cheap $100 and work up. Seriously. This is sorted tech and doesn't require exotic hardware to sound amazing.

 

Cambridge DacMagic. Silly money, balanced outputs, and superb design (measurements comparable with a DAC costing 10x).

 

Thank you !
Yeah, I only listen to things that measure horrible and I don't take my pleasure from accuracy ;-)
I only saw one offer for a BP dac on the French market and it was already sold...
Today I'll listen to the Denafrips clone and perhaps it'll end my searchings.

 

Totally ! Perhaps I should just buy a Jack/RCA adapter to connect the headphone out of my laptop to the Mc ;-)

 

Thanks !
It's a frequent recommendation and it's easy to find. It's already on my list. I always loved this brand since my A60 integrated.

 

I think the bench tests are online somewhere - it really is fabulously well designed.