Marillion "Fugazi" Deluxe Sets

Discussion in 'Music Corner' started by The Hud, Jul 5, 2021.

  1. Norco74

    Norco74 You can tell me by the way I walk...

    Sometimes, I wonder if the Marillion remixed issues reported by some members could rather be equipment or room acoustic issues…
     
  2. RockAddict

    RockAddict Forum Resident

    Location:
    UK
    Can't rule it out in all cases, but your post prompted a thought. Some of the earlier Porcupine Tree remasters were fairly loud and, although not identical, the dynamics are comparable in part with the 2021 version of Fugazi. Steven Wilson later acknowledged the loudness issues and remastered the offending albums once more - he referred to the latter versions as anti-loudness remasters.

    With that comparison being available, I'm pretty sure the dynamic limits of Fugazi 2021 are as my ears are hearing and, in any case, the measured DR figures support this.

    My own system tends being warm sounding and I suspect anyone with a setup leaning to the brighter side is really going to notice how " in-your-face" this iteration of Fugazi is. If they enjoy it, great. For me... not so much.
     
    JulesRules, serj and moomoomoomoo like this.
  3. moomoomoomoo

    moomoomoomoo Senior Member

    I still have the '98. I'll have to compare. The scary thing is I felt at the time that the entire 90's 2 cd set series were really loud!
     
  4. moomoomoomoo

    moomoomoomoo Senior Member

    And vice versa. Some equipment & formats are made to cover up the brightness of the Loudness Wars mastering. My equipment list is in my profile. I am very sensitive in the upper mids, so I intentionally put together a system that would be slightly dark/warm sounding to some on quality masters.
     
  5. moomoomoomoo

    moomoomoomoo Senior Member

    Another very relevant point (I don't remember if it was in this thread or the hi-res thread). 2 of us had similar experiences last night: I own both hi-res versions (the 2011 DR14 & the loud DE) of Fleetwood Mac's Tango In The Night. Both of us commented that we had bought both, & deleted the original album from the DE because it is so screechy (Loudness Wars mastering). When I played the entire set last night, the original 2011 hr version of the main album sounded awesome. When the recently mastered bonus tracks came on, I had to turn the volume way down & it was still bright, loud & screechy.

    So why not by an artificial sounding system that makes bad mastering acceptable (since that is the case these days more often than not)? For one, the MAGIC of music that I love when well mastered will disappear on a system voiced to make a DR5 sound acceptable.

    I was fortunate to start building my 24 bit collection in 2011 when the majority of 24 bit releases were not playing the Loudness Wars game. As such, many of my 24 bit albums & SACD's sound amazing.
     
  6. moomoomoomoo

    moomoomoomoo Senior Member

    I just got to Montreal. I agree 100% with your comments. And also on PT.
     
    GRompre68 and RockAddict like this.
  7. MrCJF

    MrCJF Best served with coffee and cake.

    Location:
    United Kingdom
    I've listened to the Remix in the car and on earbuds so far, and it's not great on those. I suspect it will be worse on my hi fi.

    As to the concert, I've not listened to my Real to Reel LP for a long time, but I remember the two sides had very different audience in the mix. Lots of audience loud participation and singing on the Leicester show, the Montreal audience sounded more respectful/subdued.
     
  8. RonFormela

    RonFormela Member

    Location:
    Kellinghusen, DE
    Got the set last week Saturday, but only listened to it yesterday for the first time (started with the 5.1 mix) as I still had to go through all the Van der Graaf Generator stuff in the Charisma box which I got on Friday.
    I really liked what I heard and was especially blown away by all the stuff I heard in the song Assassing. I don't recall hearing so much in that song. It even made me like the song more.
    Overall I like the new mix. Cannot really echo the complaints about the compression just yet. Probably because I haven't given it my full attention just yet.
     
    GiorgioV and Rufus rag like this.
  9. Mirror Image

    Mirror Image Dmitri Shostakovich (1906 - 1975)

    Now listening to the new 2021 stereo remix of Marillion’s Fugazi:

    [​IMG]

    It sounds bloody marvelous! Wow...now this is how the album should sound!
     
  10. Mirror Image

    Mirror Image Dmitri Shostakovich (1906 - 1975)

    Clutching at Straws is my absolute favorite Marillion album, but now with this new Fugazi remix, I’m beginning to think I’m being rather hasty with my choice as having an absolute favorite Marillion album. I have to say that I’m beginning to understand why so many hold these Fish era albums in such high regard. There’s a certain spirit in these albums that you just don’t hear in the Hogarth albums (even as much as I love Afraid of Sunlight or Brave). Also, my favorite guitar solos from Rothery are all on the Fish albums. I also just find Fish a much gifted frontman in general and what he lacks in vocal gymnastics, he makes up in distinctness and a unique aura.
     
  11. The Hud

    The Hud Go Royals! Thread Starter

    Before I list my impressions of the remix, I want to state that:

    Fugazi is my favorite Marillion album by far.

    Besides the 4 Fish era deluxe sets, the only other Marillion I own is the 2CD remasters.

    I would consider myself just a casual Marillion fan, I don't reach for them too often.

    All that being said, I really liked the 5.1 of the album. I am going to have to go back and pay more attention to Assassing to hear the changes. I apparently wasn't paying much attention because I didn't notice anything different. I did notice the different ending for the song Fugazi, and while it was unexpected and a little jarring at first, I do like it. I am going to have to listen to the original version again and see which I prefer. I do wish they would have included a 5.1 of the original mix as well.
     
    Rufus rag likes this.
  12. Mirror Image

    Mirror Image Dmitri Shostakovich (1906 - 1975)

    The only problem I have with remix, which is fantastic, is that Rothery’s guitar lead lines in Incubus in the faster section towards the end. I haven’t heard the 5.1 mix, but I plan on watching the documentary a bit later. Of all the Marillion albums, I actually find Fugazi the most fascinating of them all.
     
    The Hud and Rufus rag like this.
  13. moomoomoomoo

    moomoomoomoo Senior Member

    On my blu-ray, Switzerland is 48/16.
     
    RockAddict likes this.
  14. Olias of Sunhill

    Olias of Sunhill Forum Resident

    Location:
    Jim Creek, CO, USA
    Just checked and you're 100% right. Extraction error on my part to pad it to 24 bit. Sorry for the bad info. :angel:
     
    RockAddict likes this.
  15. The Hud

    The Hud Go Royals! Thread Starter

    Have you watched the Misplaced Childhood documentary? I found it really boring. The Script and Fugazi documentaries are great!
     
    RockAddict likes this.
  16. moomoomoomoo

    moomoomoomoo Senior Member

    No worries. As it turns out even with 80's video sound, Switzerland is my favorite part of the box. Nice show & the audio mastering didn't make my teeth hurt!
     
  17. J_Surround

    J_Surround Forum Resident

    Location:
    Southern NY
    I think they did a good job balancing the instruments - you can really pick out the bass line now - but the vocal levels throughout the track seem off to me. It's like they needed just one more mixing pass to properly balance the vocals. Oddly enough, the 5.1 remix seems to exhibit this more than the stereo.

    It's particularly noticeable during the "my friend, your friend, the assassin" bit that starts at around the 5-minute mark, with the multi-tracked vocal parts - they seem to have de-emphasized the lines that were prominent in the original mix (Fish repeating "I am the assassin" on the right) and brought what used to be buried (the low voice repeating "your friend" on the left) to the fore.

    There's a similar vocal balance issue in "Forgotten Sons" on the Script remix - Fish's vocals at 2:25 ("your mother sits on the edge of the world...") are overpowered by the TV announcer's, whereas they're closer to the same level on the original mix.
     
    The Hud likes this.
  18. JulesRules

    JulesRules Operational, partially functional

    Location:
    Germany
    I think this sentence is incomplete :angel:
     
    Pianoman99 likes this.
  19. ytserush

    ytserush Forum Resident

    Location:
    Northeast US
    Fruitful visit to the mailbox today.

    Finally will get to immerse myself in this deluxe edition later. I've been looking forward to it based on the previews I've gotten of the recent Fish On Friday shows.
     
  20. jirie123

    jirie123 Well-Known Member

    Location:
    Czech republic
    Dear members, contributors. In light of recent reactions to the sound and mastering of the last release of Fugazi, but also previous albums of the Fish era.
    So I wonder why Steven Wilson didn't do all these remixes. All the remixes that Steven has ever done (Yes, Gentle Giant, Jethro Tull)
    were absolutely great and practically without a significant effect on the overall sound and dynamics.
    It's probably a utopian idea, but we can only wait for the remixes that Steven Wilson will do.
    Steven Wilson's work is a bet on quality assurance.
     
    Plan9 and JulesRules like this.
  21. moomoomoomoo

    moomoomoomoo Senior Member

    Agreed. Despite public statements to the contrary; I believe that Marillion did not like Wilson's 2.0 mix for Misplaced, (Marillion appears to like loud masters; it's what they do, unfortunately) & chose not to use him for future projects. I am aware that Wilson made totally different publically comments; I believe he was being overly respectful.
     
    GRompre68 likes this.
  22. The Hud

    The Hud Go Royals! Thread Starter

    Wilson only works on albums he likes, so it is entirely possible that Misplaced Childhood is the only Fish era album he likes. He also worked on Brave.
     
    LivingForever and Plan9 like this.
  23. JulesRules

    JulesRules Operational, partially functional

    Location:
    Germany
    Wilson is a dyed-in-the-wool Marillion fan. He was at one of their first shows ever and has mixed and produced for both the band (several songs on marillion.com and Marbles) and Fish (Sunsets on Empire). At the time of MC he said he was not going to do the entire output - just MC and Brave - due to the time table the label had envisaged and him wanting to cut down remix work. There is no doubt he would have done them all if the circumstances had been better.

    Again @moomoomoomoo I understand your frustrations but the remaster of Misplaced Childhood does not support your "Marillion like it loud" assertion, it's barely louder than the original CD (even a bit quieter than the Peter Mew remaster), and it was done by the band's main guy Mike Hunter.
     
    LivingForever and J_Surround like this.
  24. moomoomoomoo

    moomoomoomoo Senior Member

    If the Mew is the 90's 2 cd set, that entire series sounded awful IMO.

    You're right, it is a fairly small difference. The only decent sounding version I've ever heard of MC is the UK EMI 180 gram vinyl LP.

    2017 CD From the Box
    foobar2000 1.6.5 / Dynamic Range Meter 1.1.1
    log date: 2021-09-19 15:01:16

    --------------------------------------------------------------------------------
    Analyzed: Marillion / Misplaced Childhood (Deluxe Edition)
    --------------------------------------------------------------------------------

    DR Peak RMS Duration Track
    --------------------------------------------------------------------------------
    DR9 -2.59 dB -14.16 dB 2:14 01-Pseudo Silk Kimono (2017 Remastered Version)
    DR10 -0.43 dB -12.63 dB 4:04 02-Kayleigh (2017 Remastered Version)
    DR10 -0.25 dB -12.40 dB 2:27 03-Lavender (2017 Remastered Version)
    DR10 0.00 dB -13.21 dB 7:55 04-Bitter Suite: Brief Encounter / Lost Weekend / Blue Angel / Misplaced Rendezvous / Windswept Thumb (2017 Remastered Version)
    DR9 0.00 dB -11.27 dB 4:05 05-Heart of Lothian (2017 Remastered Version)
    DR10 -0.53 dB -12.40 dB 2:13 06-Waterhole (Expresso Bongo) [2017 Remastered Version]
    DR10 -0.03 dB -10.99 dB 1:53 07-Lords of the Backstage (2017 Remastered Version)
    DR10 -0.01 dB -12.39 dB 9:29 08-Blind Curve: Vocal Under a Bloodlight / Passing Strangers / Mylo / Perimeter Walk / Threshold (2017 Remastered Version)
    DR10 -0.06 dB -12.27 dB 4:32 09-Childhood's End? (2017 Remastered Version)
    DR9 -0.40 dB -11.49 dB 2:24 10-White Feather (2017 Remastered Version)
    --------------------------------------------------------------------------------

    Number of tracks: 10
    Official DR value: DR10

    Samplerate: 44100 Hz
    Channels: 2
    Bits per sample: 16
    Bitrate: 849 kbps
    Codec: FLAC
    ================================================================================

    1985 USA CD

    foobar2000 1.6.5 / Dynamic Range Meter 1.1.1
    log date: 2021-09-19 15:10:17

    --------------------------------------------------------------------------------
    Analyzed: Marillion / Misplaced Childhood
    --------------------------------------------------------------------------------

    DR Peak RMS Duration Track
    --------------------------------------------------------------------------------
    DR10 -2.01 dB -13.83 dB 2:15 01-Pseudo Silk Kimono
    DR10 0.00 dB -12.50 dB 4:04 02-Kayleigh
    DR9 -0.80 dB -12.43 dB 2:27 03-Lavender
    DR10 -1.00 dB -13.07 dB 5:53 04-Bitter Suite: I. Brief Encounter / II. Lost Weekend / III. Blue Angel
    DR10 0.00 dB -13.00 dB 6:06 05-Heart of Lothian: I. Wide Boy / II. Curtain Call
    DR10 -1.20 dB -13.09 dB 2:13 06-Waterhole (Expresso Bongo)
    DR9 -1.00 dB -11.22 dB 1:53 07-Lords of the Backstage
    DR11 0.00 dB -12.71 dB 9:30 08-Blind Curve: I. Vocal Under a Bloodlight / II. Passing Strangers / III. Mylo / IV. Perimeter Walk / V. Threshold
    DR11 -0.60 dB -12.70 dB 4:33 09-Childhoods End?
    DR10 -0.40 dB -12.34 dB 2:24 10-White Feather
    --------------------------------------------------------------------------------

    Number of tracks: 10
    Official DR value: DR10

    Samplerate: 44100 Hz
    Channels: 2
    Bits per sample: 16
    Bitrate: 854 kbps
    Codec: FLAC
    ================================================================================
     
    JulesRules likes this.
  25. The Hud

    The Hud Go Royals! Thread Starter

    Makes sense! :righton:
     
    JulesRules likes this.

Share This Page

molar-endocrine