Of course it does....to you. You don't like the new MFSL SACD so you will agree with anything negative said.
c’mon this „description“ are copied from the site of the german distributor, and the distributor got the text from Mofi. Laughable! My opionion, the MFSL SACD sounds different. Better? No!
In my opinion, it depends on what kind of better we’re talking about. If we’re talking clarity, space, EQ balance, basically as an engineering marvel? The MFSL wins hands-down, surprisingly. However, as a dancing record, something to boogie with, it just isn’t made for that sound the way the original was. As a pop record itself, the original master is better. In short better is entirely dependent on what experience you want from the album. I get more enjoyment from dissecting mixes and masters than I do from just listening to listen. In my case, the MFSL is a much better master.
I’m actually shocked I didn’t notice this earlier, you use terms like sonic signature but don’t know the difference between the term mix and master? The MoFi “mix” is 100% identical to the 40th anniversary mix which was also identical to the original SACD, and even most of the other records barring the original mix of Billie Jean. What MoFi did was adjust the master which involves adjusting the bus or overall sound rather than individual components. Mastering includes volume control, EQ, and compression to create a consistent sound experience from song to song. Mixing, on the other hand, is the process of taking the original recordings of each individual instrument of the song and arranging them in a cohesive and musical manner by means of panning, volume control, EQ, De-essing, compression, and various effects including (but not limited to) reverb and chorus, echo and delay, etc.
Ok so I’m not hearing things LOL I read that comment and toggled back and forth with the CD, vinyl and SACD and couldn’t understand what that member was talking about. Drums sound fantastic.
I agree. But what means ORIGINAL MASTER RECORDING in this case. Faithful to the original master or change the sound of the album? I think Mofi’s approach was the audiophile market.
Have you tried the packaging it came in? That actually tastes like cardboard. You might like that better.
“ORIGINAL MASTER RECORDING” just means that they found the original stereo mixdown tapes to use for transfer. Nothing more, nothing less.
Hasn't this always been MOFI's approach? As I've understood it, they've never tried to recreate the sound of original pressings, but at least in theory were trying to improve on them by going back to the master tapes (and usually adding their signature EQ moves). I think anyone buying a MOFI release and expecting it to try to recreate the sound of an earlier or original pressing are bound to be disappointed.
What he said. Compression that's judiciously and artistically used on individual elements of each track is very different from compression that's used "globally" on all finished tracks at the mastering stage. What MoFi does is re-master. What Giles Martin did to Revolver is a re-mix.
Recording - compressors are a requirement for virtually every commercial recording since 1930 Mixing - compression is an artistic choice. The merits or lack of, can be debated until the end of time. Mastering - Dynamic Range Compression is never needed IMHO, with some Classical stuff exceptions.. Notice I stated "Dynamic Range Compression" !
Still used in 95% of instrumentals. It’s a way to control volume and dynamics, and it’s very good at keeping instruments where they need to be. It’s only a problem when you overdo bus compression. Good try though.
SACD # 010372 arrived here earlier this week, and I finally got an opportunity to give it a spin. Let me first say that I do not have the 1999 SACD nor have I ever heard it. No vinyl either, other than a vague memory of what it sounded like 40 years ago. I can only compare to the ESCA 5408 Japan pressing and various standard, commonly found US discs. I actually haven’t heard this album in a while so my ears were pretty fresh going in. I started playing it at a fairly low volume (maybe 70-75 dB or so), and I understood why some might think this version sounds a little dull and anemic. It didn’t jump out of the speakers the way I remembered it sounding. As I started turning it up, it really blossomed. By the time I got to the 2/3 mark of WBSS and the “mama say, mama sa…” vocals, the congas, and the gospel sounding chorus at the end, it was pretty well cranked - probably 85+ dB, and my feet were tapping, head was bobbing, and my jaw was on the floor. This thing needs to be cranked! At least to some degree it does. I’m looking forward to playing it in the car and with headphones to see if that first impression still stands. Anyway, I got a little sidetracked and couldn’t pay close attention to some of the tracks during this first session, but I will say that I heard nuance in McCartney’s voice that I never knew was there. Same with decay/reverb in many places throughout the disc. Lots of detail in the vocals but without any edginess or artificial “air”. Very smooth and realistic. Not hearing the cardboard box thing at all. In fact, IMHO ‘Billy Jean’ really slams. Same with ‘Beat It’ and ‘PYT’. No lack of punch or impact from what i could tell. The layers on ‘Human Nature’ are unreal. I may post this on the “imaging” thread, but i kept pausing the disc because there was this odd, very subtle ringing/chiming sound during that track way off to the left. If you’re sitting at the middle of a clock and your speakers are at 10:30 and 1:30, this would be coming from right at 9:00. Anyone else notice this? I kept pausing the music, listening to see if it was my microwave timer going off, LOL. Nope, dead silence. Back to the music. I’m going to dig out my ESCA over the weekend and check it out to compare. I remember that one being very crankable too but don’t recall it having the smoothness or clarity of this one. EDIT: to say that the thing that *did* jump out at me in Billy Jean was that snare drum sound. It almost sounds like a snare and a rim shot at the same time - very clangy and metallic sounding. Anyway, I don’t remember that being so prominent in other versions. Not a complaint, just an observation.
I'm glad I didn't read this thread until after I heard the MoFi SACD. I found it incredible. I've never heard the original SACD. However, I own multiple early US presses (no Michael Jackson co-producer), an early US CD, along with some unfortunate remasters, and the DSD HD Tracks download. This master is the most musical of the bunch to these ears. The effects on Thriller may seem more haunting on the original vinyl... but the guitar solo on "Beat It" and the bass on "Billie Jean" and Michael's vocals on every track have never sounded better to these ears.
After watching the video on the mastering of thriller I wonder : The album was initially too long for it to be a sonic marvel on vinyl. Bruce Swedien then edited some songs to shorten the total playing time. I guess the 12" versions of Billie Jean and Wanna Be Startin' Somethin' were the initial album versions. Were any other songs shortened ? But what tape did they edit ? Wouldn't that have been a copy of the mastertape or did they have multiple first generation mastertapes ? Was mixing automation used on Thriller ? (making it possible to print a second mastertape)
Five songs total. I posted a link to this video a few months ago in the Thriller 40 thread. The whole documentary is worth hearing but you can forward to 1:33 where it goes into more detail about the first test pressing Grundman did.
I don't see your equipment profile posted, so I can't take your "opinion" seriously at all. If it was another system, please post details. If you can't, then I consider this trolling. Please move on...
My MFSL SACD #004634 arrived 5 minutes ago via Amazon (using 3rd party seller MovieMars-CD.) Going to give this a listen now and rip the Red Book layer to the PC. Then I will be comparing it to some of the versions of Thriller I own: 1. A vinyl Pressing from the '80s. (Though, I doubt I will pull this out of storage. I haven't listened to any of my vinyl albums in a long time. I think the last time I listened to one of my vinyl was about 10 or 11 years ago.) 2. A CD Pressing from the late '80s or early '90s (not one that was pressed in Japan, though. It was the one that says "Now Made In The U.S.A." Epic EK 38112) 3. 2001 Special Edition 4. 2008 Thriller 25 5. 2009 Japan Cardboard Sleeve MiniLP Reissue (This is just a reissue of the 2001 Special Edition, I believe, but pressed and manufactured in Japan.) 6. 2022 Thriller 40 7. 2022 MFSL SACD I don't own the Sony SACD or digital Hi-Rez downloads. So my comparisons are going to be predictable, I think. I imagine the new MFSL version, including the Red Book layer, will blow away all the other versions I own. Now it's time to dig into this. Hopefully this sounds better than Thriller 25 and Thriller 40. Will report back in a few days about my comparisons (I don't think I will compare all 7 versions of Thriller I own, but will try to do at least 4 or 5 of them.)
Still need to listen to the new SACD (received it 10 days ago, but still had no time for playijg it, #3400 0r so). I must say though hat both, my Dutch LP from US stampers (bought for 0.50 Euro on a flea market ca 15 years ago) and my Japan for Europe CD (first mastering I guess) both sound fantastic.
