Discussion in 'Audio Hardware' started by ThorensSme, Nov 26, 2018.
Sounds interesting Pete.
just have to try it out over the next 3 months of lockdown along side the hr that is long in the tooth ,to do fine adjustment,, this is simple and remembers it when switched off ,
Do you need a different pulley? ”you will note a different pulley is used”. If so why?
The question for me is which has the best speed stability HR or True Point? When it comes to eas of use or functions it seams that True Point is a winner. And you can adjust each speed is a very nice feature.
the pully will come with the unit , he could not see
The pulley was changed as we did not see the point of keeping the michell one with the speed now done from the controller ,now,, there will be a double pulley for this if needed, their are 2 designs one is push button and the other is a rotary knob ,
with fine adjustment on the front , yes it does remember the fine adjustment when switched off , i dont under stand electronics, at all, the was some thing i have wanted but only dreamed off , with the help of Charlie of Truepoint ,,and my motor he came up with this a modified pink triangle upgrade power supply ,, which is just plug and play ,, will be available in 110 v , as well the quality is very good, the fact that it can and does hold the speed all the way through the lp ,,was an ear opener ,,, no more fighting to get to the fine adjuster at the back of the HR and having to move it in and out of the rack to do that is to me worth the cost of this , also to have the benefit of just pushing or turning a switch is a benefit ,, unusual to have a choice but as they are a proven product it is not a problem ,
When I had a Gyro my HR needed the speed adjusting perhaps two or three times in ten years, it's not like there is any issue with the HR going off speed, people can make their own minds up as to which unit they buy based on price, functions, looks, but anyone suggesting the HR's speed isn't stable and stable long term is wrong.
well i have a hr and it is never stable, some thing the dealers know about,, but then who am i to argue, the price is cheaper than the HR , you can find out the price from TPA , not me as it is not an advert i was just showing what i had made, for my odyssey as the HR is never on speed,
and to adjust it you have to take it out of the rack if it is in one and then find a small enough screwdriver to adjust it ,, may be you use a strobe disk that is not as accurate as the Laser Tachometer ,,
Well my HR was the tenth made so perhaps the quality went down later on, but mine was 100% stable and worked as advertised, any occasional speed issue was likely down to the belt not the HR, I ran it alongside an Orbe plus either a Technics or JVC DD so playing the same record against the Gyro and any more than a very minor speed variation was very obvious and yes I did and still use strobes, never had any issues with their accuracy regardless of whether a laser tachometer may be even more accurate, surprised you have one, but struggle to find a small screwdriver I have plenty of screwdrivers, but no laser tachometer. It's interesting that you criticise the HR for drifting out over time whilst recommending a supply that is brand new in a Michell application the Michell having a somewhat different belt and pulley arrangement to the Pink Triangle so who knows how stable the TP Audio supply will be in long term use.
I've been avoiding this thread because it'd become somewhat confrontational, I post about my experience having used the HR for over a decade, but remaining neutral about the TP supply and get told that I'm wrong and everybody else seems to know the HR doesn't work as advertised and that the TP is better and cheaper, well excuse me if I believe my experience is somewhat more valid than a recommendation for a supply barely tested with the Michell. Incidentally if you sold off your HR did you tell the buyer that it didn't work and was no good?
well the hr is not for sale as it is for odyssey
''people can make their own minds up as to which unit they buy based on price, functions, looks, but anyone suggesting the HR's speed isn't stable and stable long term is wrong'' as i said you are stating the only power supply should be the HR , is a market place the has different ones, based on Price alone, all i have done is to put my experance and the fact that i had this made, to do the odyssey TT, ( gyro),, it is like i am not allowed to put a point of view or even mention any thing that is seen confrontational,
to the Michell community , but to tow the line, i have used the HR for along time along with an orbe , qc , and the orbe nc ,, but now as i am getting older i use the odyssey , that is 70% gyro 30% orbe, so the next step was to have a power supply made that would allow me to keep the speed constant ,
this meant the Pulley was changed as you no longer have to move the belt to 45 ,, putting a little bit more tension on the belt,, now it stays the same tension all the while, and hopefully the same speed,
in the past their was a speed change button which later on disappeared,,
so excuse me if i seem to of just put what i think on here , to have words twisted ,, it is early doors to even recommend this ,, as it is not an advert but just and opinion which we are all allowed to do , as for cost it is down to the person who wants one to contact TPA, at least they will make their own minds up , and not be put off by any one, or pointed to that direction by me, it is just to help people and show them there are alternatives, out there , all the very best pet
Looking through the Michell site I found under “performance accessories” arm plate decoupling kits for Gyro owners. I think these are new and replace the previous long screws and spacers between frame and tonearm, at least that’s how I got my SME arm plate delivered in 2018. Has anyone tried this kit?
There are also kits for easy VTA adjustment. These might be new as well.
Been available for years. Must have replaced the bolts on my Gyro about 10 years ago or more with one of those kits. All newer decks came with the isolation bolts supplied.
As I recall there are Rega and SME versions. The SME one is in the pile of parts waiting to be fitted by the dealer when lockdown ends. Not sure how much of a SQ upgrade it is but at about £25 it seemed silly not to add it when I was changing the motor and PSU.
Like @Classicrock I thought that it had been around for a few years
So, the new SME tonearm spacers were not supplied on Gyros yet? Would make sense as I definitely got my Gyro SE with spacers and long fit-through screws.
I must admit it is also unclear to me from the picture on the Michell site how the arm plate is fixed to the frame.
Current production and for years before come with the two part isolation spacers and bolts (for Rega as standard). If you buy an additional SME mounting plate you get the 'new' shorter top bolts with it. Dealers should give you a free SME mount with a new deck if requested.
Yes, the picture on the Michell site shows only the bottom threaded studs and the isolation part into which they screw. For some reason the shorter top bolts, which obviously come in the kit, are not shown.
Once installed I do not think that it would be too clear which you have (original or two-part) apart from the anti-static strap/wire. If you have the strap you have the newer two-part kit.
the spacers are made of delrin with a m5 male and m5 female threads with a small o ring there are small m5 bolts included , , the ones some of the lads have been using are the 15-2omm long anti vibration bobbins off eBay at £2.50 , work a treat , with the sme and the rega arms,
All, thanks for your help! I took of one of the armplate spacers off to check (the fact that I have a grounding connection installed made me think indeed) ......and it turns out that I do have new ones with the shorter top bolts .
I installed them myself only 2 years ago, I must be getting old.
The anti vibration bobbins are an interesting idea, worthwhile trying since the cost are peanuts, although delrin should normally be quite good as well.
Arm plate decoupling kit from Michell is not good value or worth doing IMO if you have an older deck.
I did the upgrade quite a few years ago and frankly, you would have to strain to hear much of a difference
from the original.
I use totally different (non OEM) armboards now with a totally different technique to isolate/decouple
the boards from the subchassis.
The main advantage is better earthing and less static build up though I did detect a small SQ improvement (Rega RB300). Why don't you enlighten us further?
Not much to really enlighten anyone with. You described it as a small improvement-in my case it was probably more miniscule than small
but I can't say I've ever experienced static issues with the table and I run fully balanced from table to phono stage and my phono stage also
has a ground lift switch which I use so that is possibly why it was even less impressive to me.
I just felt it was kind of like throwing money away. Relatively speaking, you can, for example, improve the performance of the table
dramatically (you do not have to strain to hear it) by replacing the standard steel ball in the main bearing with something better that costs
about 1/8th of the price of the decoupling kit. I've used a silicon nitride Grade 3 ball from Boca Bearings for about 3-4 years now with great
results although there are some that fear using silicon nitride.
Once you get into changing armboards and the overall isolation from the chassis/subchassis, it's a much pricier proposition unfortunately
so not really fair to compare that to the decoupling kit when it gets down to it.
i had a small problem with the earth off the arm , when tested it was a complete loop , the extra earth that came with the michell caused the whole arm to be earthed, so i just earthed the chassis ,using the rega arm board created an earth loop ,but now, i use an acrylic armboard and a kimber TAC HB Cable and sme 309 ,
no problems with static at all, and i use a ceramic ball, as blakep said it is not fair to try and do alike for like when the deck has been modified , also the cost of doing the mods have to kept in mind, recent change was a new motor to a 7watt cl40 this caused the HR to drive the new motor too fast and would not control it at all ,and the new PSU went back ,to have the transformer upgrade, the wow and flutter is now less than the original gyro , but the cost was stupid , with armboards costing £200 , and the psu
waiting to bite the bank account at 490 , the motor direct from the manufactures was 114 , the cost if you continues just go up and up ,
Thanks for reminding me of the silica ball bearings. I still have one, which I received together with Pete’s pylons, but I didn’t install, as I like to evaluate the gains individually later, but I forgot about them ( there is is again the aging thing...)
what they all found with the delin it does not isolate as much as the rubber bobbins, my concern in using them they have to be all the same height, a set i had was .25mm small on one which would throw the azimuth off , as there was 4 that arrived in the order it was not problem , there are 2 different lengths ,,15 and 20 mm please check the length needed , m5 male and m5 female threads,
well the gyro is nearly done, https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sZYQ...ature=youtu.be
with only the new platter to be completed, i did change the psu again , with a further upgraded version ,
Playing 'Move it on over' - George Thorogood and the destroyers on The Gyro sounds amazing.
( True Point Pylon upgraded.)
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