Michell Gyro Owners

Discussion in 'Audio Hardware' started by ThorensSme, Nov 26, 2018.

  1. Classicrock

    Classicrock Forum Resident

    Location:
    South West, UK.
    Well I've not put my ear to it but I can't hear it a foot or two away and it's on constantly. The old AC motors mounted on the deck did give a sort of paddle whooshing noise when rotating.
     
  2. gwernaffield

    gwernaffield Active Member

    Location:
    uk
    The old AC motors have two sintered bearings. If they have dried out then they can be oiled but they won’t be the same as before they dried out, you might get a year or two before they will need doing again. You really need to strip the motor down to lubricate it because if you oil it from the top, it could make the motor noisy, as you will be lubricating the series of washers on the top of the motor and they can then begin to vibrate. You can try using something thin like ZX1 or WD40.

    The best thing would be to send it to us, so we can then replace the washers and circlip etc. and give it a good clean out and lubrication.

    If you are using a QC power supply with it, make sure you turn the QC off when not in use. The QC has a current path to keep the motor warm, over a long period of time this will speed up the bearings drying out.

    here is a reply from Michell ..
     
    Dubmart likes this.
  3. Dubmart

    Dubmart Forum Resident

    Location:
    Bristol, UK
    Personally I'd send it to Michell and get it switched out for the DC motor, I did that with mine and in my opinion the DC motor is an improvement, plus you can add the HR which really ups the performance, I did mine a long time ago and it cost £150 to swap the motors, I expect the price has gone up since then, selling my QC paid for most of it.
     
    GyroSE likes this.
  4. gwernaffield

    gwernaffield Active Member

    Location:
    uk
    the price of the new power supply alone is £533 , not sure the cost of a new motor ,
     
  5. Classicrock

    Classicrock Forum Resident

    Location:
    South West, UK.
    Michell can repair the AC motors apparently. I was told when they came out (by John Michell) that once DC motor went it had to be replaced. Reason for change was not SQ but Papst discontinuing the motor. DC all runs cool if left on all the time unlike the old AC/QC.
     
  6. Dubmart

    Dubmart Forum Resident

    Location:
    Bristol, UK
    Yes, I know, I got mine replaced via chatting to John, but I think the DC is the better motor even against the QC which I think was a pretty expensive upgrade, it's much better with the HR, I know people still using and enjoying early spec Gyrodecs with AC motors so there's no absolute reason to change, but when I had mine I liked to keep it up to current spec or close to it and was happy that each change was an upgrade, a DC/HR Gyro with a good arm and cart is a very impressive sounding deck.
     
    GyroSE likes this.
  7. gwernaffield

    gwernaffield Active Member

    Location:
    uk
    there was one thing about the DC motor Michell cannot repair it ,,I use the DC and the HR ,with a 309 ,my own suspension upgrades,, and have added an extra spider ,,the deck sounds rely good now ,, better than before ,,,
     
  8. Anton D

    Anton D Forum Resident

    Location:
    Chico CA
    If you can happen upon one, the best record clamp of all time:

    [​IMG]

    I think mine is 33 1/3 years old.

    Got it at CES 1986.

    Wow, I'm gonna go get it a present.
     
    Cyclone Ranger likes this.
  9. gwernaffield

    gwernaffield Active Member

    Location:
    uk
    i don't use a clamp I use a Puck , with a funk firm Achromat ,, as the mat is 5mm thick the clamp will no longer work ,
     
  10. Anton D

    Anton D Forum Resident

    Location:
    Chico CA
    Achromat with a puck is great!

    :righton: :righton::righton:

    The label 'depression' on that mat is way good!

    For fun, check out Oswald Mills graphite "mat": Oswalds Mill Audio - Vinyl Accessories | OMA It's kinda thick, but so luxurious. The headshell is cool, too!
     
  11. blakep

    blakep Forum Resident

    Over on this side of the pond Pete, a new DC Motor, adapter and upgraded power supply will set you back $1550 U.S. or 1,230 GBP plus taxes and any work done to do the install. Power Supply alone here is 711 GBP plus taxes.

    Not an insignificant amount of money ;).
     
  12. Dubmart

    Dubmart Forum Resident

    Location:
    Bristol, UK
    Just to make clear, Michell used to swap out the AC motors and replace them with DC using the same housing and keeping the old AC for themselves, I'm not sure if the prices being quoted are for this or a brand new DC motor complete with housing, but I'd be surprised if Michell are now charging £500 just to swap an AC for a DC, though with Hi Fi inflation rates who knows.

    I ran my Gyro SE from '98/'99 until last year, it started AC, I ran it with both the basic power supply and better AC supplies, I had it converted to DC and ran it with the basic supply until the HR was launched, (my HR was the tenth made), as I said for me switching to DC and the HR was an obvious, very obvious upgrade path, whether the cost is worth it is a personal choice, but to get the most out of a Gyro I think the HR is what you need and they do turn up used occasionally for a fair bit less than list price. If I had a broken AC motor I'd definitely weigh up the repair cost against the cost of replacing it with a DC unit, having a DC motor will also make it more saleable in future.
     
    GyroSE likes this.
  13. gwernaffield

    gwernaffield Active Member

    Location:
    uk
    The prices have gone up a lot ,, the belt is now £21 ,, the replacement springs are £30+ ,, the platter upgrade is now over £500,,,with the orbe clamp upgrade £135 ,, SME put the prices up of their arms ,,,it seems every one has followed,,,
    some will blame Brexit,,, it is hard to price things ,,every day something will change,,,although I agree with having a DC motor ,, the AC one can be serviced,, the DC one is a bin job ,, it is not the motor that is the problem but the stability of the suspension ,allowing the chassis to move causing WOW ,,as the belt slackens off and re-tightens,,, as you know it was only that the AC motor was discontinued by the manufacturer that Michell were forced into using a DC motor ,,, in the first place ,, which never solved the problem of WOW on a suspended deck ,, it also depends on the tightness of the belt ,, every time you place a LP on the deck you can move the chassis on the pointy feet ,,causing the belt to slacken off ,, this causes wow,, so you spend the next hour trying to keep the Michell bounce,, to recenter the chassis and get the tension on the belt ,, only to move it again and again , it is not the motor that is at fault,,, but several factors ,,, change the belt when needed every 2 years ,,,if poss,, check the oil ,,
    check you still have the Michell bounce ,if you have not upgraded to one of the after market suspension upgrades ,, check the deck is still level ,,buy something to stop the feet from moving ,, remember to add the thickness of the foot upgrade to base of the motor ,,so the belt is at the correct height ,, I will check the cost of the motor swap ,,on Monday ,, I am sure Blake is correct with the prices,, for over the pond,,
     
  14. blakep

    blakep Forum Resident

    Those are indeed the prices in North America. Quite a bit higher than in the UK due to the extra layer of North American distribution/retail & transport/import costs. Similar, in reverse, to what I would expect would be the situation with VPI prices in North America vs. the UK for example.

    If you want the stand alone housing in North America, add $279 U.S. or 220 GBP to the prices I quoted above.

    So in Canada or the U.S. it would be DC Motor at $595 plus HR Supply at $895 (plus a $35 adapter if you have a pre 2003 Gyro) plus stand alone housing at $279 if you want that for a total of $1,769 U.S. or 1,405 GBP. Add another $70 U.S. if you want the new DC motor and housing in gold ;).
     
    Dubmart likes this.
  15. Dubmart

    Dubmart Forum Resident

    Location:
    Bristol, UK
    That's an awful lot of money, a lot cheaper to sell your Gyro and buy a newer used one.
     
  16. ThorensSme

    ThorensSme Forum Resident Thread Starter

    Location:
    Seattle
    If you are moving the chassis of the Gyro that rests on the feet just by placing an LP on the platter and/or clamping, then you are doing something way to forcefully. This has never happened to me, I can only imagine the poor handling of LPs and the deck it takes to have this problem.
     
  17. gwernaffield

    gwernaffield Active Member

    Location:
    uk
    honest it does happen , when you take the clamp off , the chassis can move,, I used a piece of marble with indents which the feet sat it to stop this,, if you over tighten the clamp it will happen ,
     
  18. Anton D

    Anton D Forum Resident

    Location:
    Chico CA
    I must be in a very small minority, I prefer my AC motor.

    I think we will see regard for these Papst AC units increase over time.
     
  19. gwernaffield

    gwernaffield Active Member

    Location:
    uk
    I was talking to Jonathan Nye ( Michell engineer ) over the motors ,, Michell cannot repair the Dc version ,, but can repair the AC ,, if I had an AC version I would keep it ,it has to be more cost effective to keep the AC over the DC ,,
     
    Anton D likes this.
  20. Dubmart

    Dubmart Forum Resident

    Location:
    Bristol, UK
    I think you'd be very unlucky to experience either an AC or DC motor failing, obviously more likely with the older ACs, but it's not like the internet is full of Michell owners with dead motors, likewise none of the many Michell owners I know in the real world have ever had a motor fail, it's not something I'd loose sleep over though I imagine it's even more expensive to fix my Orbe if it goes wrong.
     
    Kyhl, GyroSE and ThorensSme like this.
  21. gwernaffield

    gwernaffield Active Member

    Location:
    uk
    has any one thought of making a armboard from solid acrylic , there would be no need to add gerts to the bottom of the existing michell one, ??
     
  22. Dubmart

    Dubmart Forum Resident

    Location:
    Bristol, UK
    Arm boards are made to an exact weight for each arm to keep the deck evenly balanced, acrylic is too light.
     
    Last edited: Jun 27, 2019
  23. gwernaffield

    gwernaffield Active Member

    Location:
    uk
    well I made one and it is only 10grms lighter , than the Mitchell one, also if the arm board is balanced why fit the Gert Pederson one as this adds weight , it will depend on the arm being used, Michell recommend that the weight including the arm should not be more than 1kg , but you can get away with 1,1kg according to Michell
     
  24. Dubmart

    Dubmart Forum Resident

    Location:
    Bristol, UK
    Surprised acrylic is only 10 grammes lighter, is it the same thickness? I doubt 10 grammes will make any difference in the real world, my arm boards are Michell, Pederson mods never appealed to me.
     
    Last edited: Jun 27, 2019
    ThorensSme likes this.
  25. gwernaffield

    gwernaffield Active Member

    Location:
    uk
    it is 30mm with a large counter bore only for sme arms, [​IMG] you have a height agap of about 40mm to the top of the arm board ,, this takes the way the sme is left in mid air to a solid fitting , which improved the sound,,
    I have not got around to making a rega one made,,,, this polished up ,, also added a carbon fibre decals on the top of another one, both made for sme[​IMG]

    [​IMG]
     
    33na3rd, Andy Saunders and Dubmart like this.

Share This Page