Mobile Fidelity Sound Lab has been cutting vinyl from digital since a long, long time ago...

Discussion in 'Music Corner' started by Ben Adams, Jul 14, 2022.

  1. Well it’s more or less true. But you don’t have to believe it.
    Pretorius likes this.
  2. nutsfortubes

    nutsfortubes I never met a transistor I liked.

    New Jersey
    :DI think this is a case for Woodward & Bernstein, they will get to the bottom of this cover up. :cool:
    bluesfan and Aftermath like this.
  3. morinix and Steppenwolf like this.
  4. Jerquee

    Jerquee Take this, brother, may it serve you well.

    New York
    ...and overreactions.

    It's an area of serious deep sensitivity for some.

  5. kundryishot

    kundryishot Forum Resident

    Everything in the recording process colours the sound
    Sneaky Pete likes this.
  6. Wounded Land

    Wounded Land Forum Resident

    Okay, it just seems strange to me that MoFi would do that. I don’t doubt that it happened, just the motivations behind it I can’t figure out. To me it feels calculated on the part of the VP (blanking in his name), but I suppose you can read it as a friendly but naive invitation.

    I suppose my real question is who knew what when?
    DancingSea likes this.
  7. David Sonnier

    David Sonnier Forum Resident

    Broussard LA
    A while back I saw an email sent from Mofi to someone here (I think) assuring them that their LPs were cut from the master tape. The only exception were the silver series.

    I don’t own any MFSL LPs, so I can’t comment about the sound. But their marketing was certainly misleading/deceptive.

    I went to the Mofi website and they are now adding the details of how their LPs were cut. Everything I’ve read so far is Tape to DSD. But they haven’t finished editing all the LPs yet, so maybe something will show up as all analog eventually.
    kundryishot likes this.
  8. Graham

    Graham Forum Resident

    London, UK
    I am a journalist. Interviewing people is much harder than it looks and, for me, always nerve-wracking. Esposito did a good job.

    Anyway, he broke the story on his YouTube channel so he is a journalist, just not by profession. That video was also very even-handed.

    Furthermore, Fremer’s complaints about not sending a ‘real’ journalist to the MOFI offices a) reek of a superiority complex and b) disregard that it was Esposito who broke the story in the first place.

    I’m unsure why the Post needed to write about the tragedies in his personal life, but good on Esposito for getting where he is.
    Harrison, no.nine, indyalden and 30 others like this.
  9. Frank Daniels

    Frank Daniels Forum Resident

    From a Washington Post article in 1985 that is strangely related to this subject:

    "Until 1979, the Coca-Cola Co. used only sugar as a sweetener. In 1980, the company began blending corn syrup with sugar, using as much as 50 percent of the substitute. In 1984, it went to 100 percent use of the substitute and no sugar. At no time during this five-year period did the company advertise these changes to the consumer or indicate them on the Coke label."

    Tony Tortorici of Atlanta, director of public affairs for Coca-Cola USA, said by phone that Coca-Cola Classic is "exactly the same as the original formula for Coca-Cola." However, he confirmed the Sugar Association's history of the percentage change from sugar to HFCS, adding, "It has absolutely no effect on quality or taste."

    indyalden, bkbk, Kyhl and 13 others like this.
  10. David Sonnier

    David Sonnier Forum Resident

    Broussard LA
    I want to add I went to Mofi website and a lot more LPs have been updated with the cutting details.. looks like quite a few older ones were cut from tape. All of the Cars LPs, saw a Roy Cooder, an Elvis Costello, and a few other older ones. Haven’t seen any One Steps that were cut from tape. There’s still a few LPs to go.

    And some of the future Van Halen LPs have yet to be decided on.. those LPs simply say process to be decided later.
  11. sangfreud

    sangfreud Forum Resident

    reading the comments to that wapo piece is a masochistic exercise. has any audiophile anywhere ever made the claim they can hear the difference between DSD256 and the source?
    bkbk and Sneaky Pete like this.
  12. TommyTunes

    TommyTunes Senior Member

    In his latest video, Fremer doesn’t like the “hit” job that the Washington Post did on him. He should remember it when he reads their political commentary in the future.
    Scott222C, aroney, Kyhl and 7 others like this.
  13. Terry

    Terry Senior Member

    Hmm, thought politics was off limits here
  14. violarules

    violarules Forum Resident

    Baltimore, MD
    At least I admit I have no idea! His notions seem based little on evidence.
    mpayan likes this.
  15. Jasonbraswell

    Jasonbraswell Vinylphile

    Really interesting comment Mr H.
    Props to Blue Note I guess.
    Sounds wonderful IMO on many of their reissues.

    Also, Previn on the older Contemporary releases is fantastic. Just some other data points for good piano tunes on vinyl.
  16. Tommyboy

    Tommyboy Senior Member

    New York
    It’s time for Mobile Fidelity to change the slogan/banner “Original Master Recording”, on the album jacket, since they don’t always cut from the master. It’s too vague and once again, deceptive.

    Going forward, they should only use “Mobile Fidelity Sound Lab”, like they did for the silver label series.
    BuyMeVinyl and MonkeyTennis like this.
  17. ILoveLucille

    ILoveLucille The infernal desire machines of Steve Hoffman

    Savior's Compound
    I think they should use "Original DSD Copy Recording" as the banner.
  18. Fastnbulbous

    Fastnbulbous Doubleplus Ungood

    Washington DC USA
    I am very late here but the crux of the issue appears to be this:

    "One of the reasons [audiophiles] want to excoriate MoFi is for lying," says Howarth. "The other part that bothers them is that they've been listening to digital all along and they're highly invested in believing that any digital step will destroy their experience. And they're wrong."
    The first part is straightforward: If MoFi has been misrepresenting its product then it deserves to be excoriated. Audiophiles have been sold a product, at an exorbitant price, in the belief that it represents the best-quality listening experience based on their values.

    The next part is far trickier. What if their values are wrong after all, as Howarth contends? After all, if the final result sounds better, what does it matter if the source is digital or analog? And if it does matter, what does that say about the audiophile's values? I suppose this is more of a philosophical issue at this point.

    Disclaimer: I don't own any MoFi releases and my present system is modest at best. I abide by the maxim "if it sounds good, it IS good."
    oneway23 and Graham like this.
  19. DaleClark

    DaleClark Forum Resident

    Columbus, Ohio
    The cat is out of the bag. Everyone knows who did what. Everyone has taken their sides. Hopefully, everyone can go back into their own space and get on with their life. The big win is with the consumer who will now have MoFi's releases labeled somewhere about the source (internet, album, sticker, somewhere the info can be found). Ludwig looks like he's moved on. Esposito seems to be business as usual. Fremer has his new website and writing job with TAS to ramp up. As far as any Youtuber, the three I just mentioned are the main vinyl influencers hands down. The others, including myself, are just small fish in a big pond. I do think, however, MoFi will be affected greatly and will have to perform a major campaign to promote its process and practices. Not a bad thing. Personally, I have quite a few digitally sourced vinyl LPs. However, I'd rather pay for an SACD or Hi Rez download for such sourced material vs vinyl. I'm a huge digital and analog fan. In the vinyl realm, I'd rather spend my money on analog sourced material or originals (unless it's The Beatles or Pink Floyd,,...I'll buy anything).

    the quality of the actual recording and mastering plays more into the sound quality vs format (LP, CD, etc)

    Last edited: Aug 6, 2022
  20. mpayan

    mpayan Resident Mofi Shill

    No wonder I loved Taco Bell and a Coke back in 1975 as a kid in SoCal. And later couldnt stand Coke.
    highfell likes this.
  21. Roland Stone

    Roland Stone Offending Member

    Seriously, I waded back five pages, didn't see it mentioned. I should have known!
    Mazzy likes this.
  22. Adagio

    Adagio Forum Resident

    Heres another example of more misrepresentation....

    Miles Davis KOB (2X45) has the banner "Original Master Recording"

    Now the website provides the detail: . 1/4" / 15 IPS / Dolby SR analog remix master to DSD 64

    My initial impression when I first heard the album was it sounded like a re-mix. But figured my ears were deceiving me. Turns out it wasn't my ears.
    indyalden, DaveyF, jo66hn and 2 others like this.
  23. AnalogJ

    AnalogJ Hearing In Stereo Since 1959

    Salem, MA
    And, as an aside, I can taste the difference pretty quickly. They still produce Coke with sugar for the Mexican and European markets. They went to a corn-based sweetener because corn was cheaper than sugar in the US. The corn-sweetened version tastes a bit bitter, while the sugar-sweetened one tastes smoother and has a slight caramel note to it.
  24. AnalogJ

    AnalogJ Hearing In Stereo Since 1959

    Salem, MA
    And all along, I talked about a glassy, thin quality to the high end of their KOB, something typical of digital (I hear it with The Eagles s/t OneStep). Now I can better guess why.
    Adagio, Elofan, Wounded Land and 2 others like this.
  25. Crush87

    Crush87 Forum Resident

    New York
    Bizarre that these updates are subject to change
    indyalden, Joe Stark, 4-2-7 and 2 others like this.

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