The recently "out of print" Iron Butterfly and Johnny Cash LPs are both available for $100 at Music Direct, along with many other "collectible" LPs and SACDs at flipper prices. This is starting to feel like a scam...
Well...It's not like MD has multiple copies available. Iron Butterfly looks to be gone. If MD held back hundreds of copies and then put them up for sale for double the price after they went out of print, then it would be a scam. Either way, I like to see records remaining in print.
If you want to create artificial demand, you come out with a very limited supply of something that is easy to supply adjust. To that, you hold back copies and increase price once they are 'sold out'. ... Any of this sound familiar?
The Vanilla Fudge is FAR better than you make it out to be. It's a dense recording which a better cartridge and phono stage will be able to unravel far better than your Parasound Z-Phono can do. I know that phono stage well. I have heard it separately, and my wife's Parasound preamp has it built-in. While the Z is a good, low-budget phono stage, there's far more in the groove than that can dig out. I'd start with seeing if you can borrow a much better one without changing anything else in your system and see if you hear more from the Vanilla Fudge. You might be surprised. In my system, being able to hear the individual contributions of the players, particularly opened up by the midrange of the 45rpm, made me realize that the playing of that album was on a practically jazz-like level. Lots of interplay and support. Honestly, I only bought the Vanilla Fudge after much prodding, thinking that it couldn't be worthy of a 45rpm treatment. It wasn't on my list of favorite albums. I had the Sundazed pressing as well. The MoFi became my favorite purchase of the year.
Look, it's nice that you have "better" equipment and can hear something that pleases you, but that sort of bypasses the real issue. I have hundreds of albums that sound terrific and detailed on my system. (I am a 99% headphones listener.) I can hear small differences between different versions of albums, as in the recent other threads on Kind Of Blue and Out Of The Cool. If somebody is re-releasing an album where the benefits of that particular mastering are only audible on expensive systems, something is wrong. I should be able to hear at least some the benefits on my system, as I do on most audiophile releases that I buy. Maybe they should focus their efforts on releasing more records that could be appreciated by anyone who has something better than a Crosley as a playback device. What I heard on the VF was perfectly fine, but I wouldn't rush to change my equipment just to hear this particular album slightly better. It isn't worth it. I have been putting off buying a new phono preamp for a couple of years now, and will probably get one by the end of the year, so I'll revisit this at that time.
Kevin Gray said in his interview with Danny Kaey and Michael Ludwig that indeed, audiophile releases benefit from better playback systems.
It doesn't matter that you listen on headphones or through speakers. Your system is only as good as its weakest link. Looking at your system, by far, it's the phono stage. And if the information doesn't get through that, you're not going to hear it. I know the limits of MY phono stage, and it's a $3500 one. There are phono stages that are quite a bit better at certain things than mine. But knowing your's so well, and knowing the many upgrades in phono stages I have done (and auditioned) in my system, I can tell you that your missing a lot. The problem is that one doesn't know what they're missing, what the phono stage is NOT doing, until you hear one that is much more capable. It's not like the Parasound is making your system sound bad. Far from it. I recommend it to someone starting out as the lowest level of decent. Kind of like a Rega Planar 1. But you have a Planar 3, a much better table. And your other equipment is better, too. There's a type of complexity and tonal color that the Parasound can't match compared to better phono stages. Instead of arguing, just try borrowing one and hear for yourself. The "proof of the pudding is in the tasting." Taste for yourself and find out. I can just tell you, and you can see from the 'likes' from my post, that there are many who also think there's MUCH more to be mined from that MoFi reissue of Vanilla Fudge than you're indicating. You may not like the album, itself, all that much. But that would be a different story. We're just discussing it from its audiophile potential, and we're saying that it's REALLY good, well worth what MoFi put into it.
You do realize you are in the Ultra Disc One Step thread? $125 records aren’t for “anyone with better than a Crosley”. Or $50 audiophile reissues, for that matter.
Acoustic Sound has done this for a long time OOP ? A few stashed away price goes way up Even if they know they are repressing it soon
Sorry to hear of your woes, especially with the exchange rate Music Direct didn’t ask me to return my “badly off center” Fragile One Step lps I would insist that they send you the new lps and have you keep yours Send them a short clip that this is a major problem (they might be trying to screen out super picky buyers by insisting they mail them back) Your video would be more helpful if you broadcast the sound of the non fill “newspaper ripping” sound All the best
Well, that was an exaggeration. Let's put it another way. I bought the KOB UHQR. I hear the differences among the UHQR, a 1973 Columbia, the MFSL 45, and even the Classic 33 SV 200g. If I had $25,000 equipment, I would undoubtedly hear even more. But I didn't need the $25,000 equipment to appreciate the differences, and the quality of the recordings. I might feel differently about the Vanilla Fudge if I had a previous pressing for comparison, but I don't. I have to judge it on its own merits, not relative to another version. So, as I said before, it's good for what it is. My problem is that I had higher expectations. If I'm being told that I can't appreciate the quality of the Vanilla Fudge 45 because my equipment isn't good enough, that tells me that I probably should avoid any future MFSL 45s of albums where I have reason to question the quality of the source tapes. There are too many other ways to spend my vinyl dollars that will be more satisfying.
The Vanilla Fudge just may not play to the Parasound's strengths. But as many have said here before, there's a reason that there are $10,000 (and higher) phono stages. They don't just exist because some have billionaire money to burn. They really do reveal much more rhythmically, tonally, with more insight, precision, and drama. I think you may be revealing an example of how a budget piece of equipment can limit what you listen to, as you'll tend to listen more to what the equipment does do well. Can you only appreciate a OneStep with very expensive equipment? Of course not, but you won't appreciate it nearly as much as someone who does. I know that my Art Audio Vinyl One is not going to do enough justice to a large scale symphonic work as a much better phono stage, for example. It doesn't provide the greatest insight and ease with the largest scale works. Nor does it provide the tautest of rhythm compared to a $10,000 phono stage. It's better in these areas than the ones I had before it, except for one that might have rocked more. But it renders color, harmonic complexity, and image size in spades, about as good as I've heard. Want to be seduced with a sexy saxophone, or jazz vocalist, or some acoustic music? It's gorgeous in these areas. As one of the designers of my phono stage once said to me, the Vinyl One is the one he wanted to listen to after hours, late at night. (The same company sold a more expensive model from a different designer). And with it being a tubed phono stage, I can change its personality with different tubes. It's still good in other areas, but it's exceptional in the areas I listed above. Again, I recognize its limitations, as I do for all of the equipment in my system.
They might request mail backs to keep defective pressings out of the secondary market. Analogue Productions just requires evidence that the defective pressing has been destroyed.
I agree with Bruce, as highly anticipated this lp was for me it probably going to played once or maybe twice. This lp does not sound that great, and as much as I love a couple of songs on this.....its really a why bother
I think guys who believe that their system is going to make a turd sound great, when it's a turd...are simply deluding themselves. There is no system on earth that can compensate for a poor master tape or the resulting reissue of that tape. IME, none! In some cases, the more resolving the system, the worse the turd sounds..because you are new hearing more veiling, more issues in the frequency extremes, worse image specificity and on and on! The opposite is also true, a great recording will sound great on a marginal system...and even better on a great system. When I bought my MoFi One Step copy of S&G BOTW, I was expecting a poor sounding recording...and I wasn't disappointed. The SQ was not there in the first place...and the One Step did nothing to improve the situation..as how could it? I sold that easily and have not looked back. OTOH, the master tapes of the Opus 3 LP's I alluded to above, make the Vanilla Fudge reissues ( in all versions-- MoFi etc.) sound as if they are broken. ( and on ALL systems). Bruce is 100% correct, you just cannot make a "silk purse out of a sow's ear"...
BS, look the guy has equipment he's used to, he has many many nice records, some wow him in their sound quality, some don't. It's all relative and if the sound quality is there for some records and not others, with their taste, then it's just not there. Having much better or should we say much more expensive equipment is not going to make the record sound better for him, just different. I know you have gone on page over page how fantastic VF sounded, great it works for you. However if someone else doesn't like the sound quality doesn't mean their equipment just isn't good enough to hear this mythical nirvana you hear, and it's all because you spend more to get this special SQ. Again everything is relative, someone can have a $10,000 phono stage and it can sound like crap to them or in their system. Let's see, I use the RIAA staging built into my McIntosh C100 preamp and that unit cost me $3500 used 10 years ago. They have since gone up with a bunch of us talking online how good the preamp really is. Anyway, my SOTA Phono Head Amp cost on average of $500 used, (if you try to find info of this online it will probably lead you to me again as with the C100) Sumiko Blackbird Cartridge $1,200, SOTA Star Sapphire table and SME Series V Arm used $4500, IC Cables $300. My Whole vinyl frontend just barley went over that $10,000 phono stage. Are you going to tell me if I say a record doesn't have the SQ like others do, my system isn't good enough? All records are different, All cartridges are different, All Systems we play records back on are different. We all can play records back and come to a different conclusion as to their SQ. But to say one persons system isn't good enough to weigh the sound quality in their opinion because it differs from yours is assured. All the while they can hear SQ differences between all other records sound quality changes?
Many a deficient recording can sound intolerable on a great system and masked over or enhanced on a modest less resolving or less tonally balanced setup More detail and vibrant presentation on a less accurate system might be too bright and in your face on a more neutral refined system
Well I played Vanilla Fudge now the 2nd time to remind me on how bad its sounds.....yup I doubt there will be a third time. Had to listen to Al Jarreau "We Got By" to recalibrate my ears and my heart
Well I think a few months back I mentioned you and I live in the same city and we could get together. Now that things are getting back to normal the last couple weekends I'v have had audio/ record friends coming by and hanging a bit. I have old used VF issues, you can barrow them, have them, or buy them I don't care. You can bring your VF record here and play it on my system side by side with the old & MFSL copies as I have tables setup specifically for that testing. You can even bring your table if you wish and we can hook it up to my system and staging. We can try a cartridge swap on your table, using a Sumiko EVO III and hook it to my system to see how much better we can get your table to sound, or at least different. It's not uncommon for me to drop tables in front of my system to test them out. It might be good to listen to another system, or if different staging and cartridges will bring you more joy over what you already have. Anyway, send me a PM if you would like to contact me over this.
You're making it sound that there's no reason that better equipment does, indeed, sound better. Saying that there's such thing as system mismatching doesn't diminish that fact better equipment will provide better performance, all other things being equal. You'd be laughed out of this forum if you were to insist that a $150 phono stage performs equally well, in practice, to a $10,000 one, assuming the system is matched well. And, by the way, a bad recording might actually sound better on a worse piece of equipment. It won't reveal be as revealing. So in the poster's case, he's saying that the VF album doesn't sound great on his system. I don't doubt it. But that those with better systems than his are pretty wow'd by the MoFi VF, we're saying that it may be his system, not the record itself, that is keeping him from enjoying it as much. I'm particularly focusing on the Parasound Z-Phono, as a weak link in an otherwise quite decent system. I could be proven wrong. But I'd bet that a better phono stage would get that VF reissue sounding better to him. No skin off of my back. It's just a suggestion on my part.
Well if it sound better, it's better equipment no matter the cost. You're conflating the fact if someone has a system and listens to many records and one doesn't sound good to them, that it must be the system is low quality, as that specific record sounds good to you on your system, and your systems better. What I said is it's not about the system in a case where someone plays records and some blow them away, and others fall flat. The system stays as the reference point (static), the only thing in the testing is the different records.
If you think price alone is the be all to sound quality, start laughing because just because a unit cost $150 opposed to $10,000 doesn't make it worst sounding and in fact could sound better. You're generalizing, using price points and that never works well at all. No, he doesn't like the sound quality of this specific title when listening to it, but is fine with other records. I'll also add that I have not been all that impressed with a lot of the One Steps and other MFSL records, at least with the price vs. the cost. I think they could and should do better. I also think there is some psychoacoustic bias going on with some of these one steps. Oh it has to be the best I just spent $150 on this records and need to justify it one way or another, so it's the best thing since sliced bread. Sorry, I don't do Groupthink well at all, I never follow and try to do all my own hands on and listening for myself. I could care less if someone thought something sounds bad or good as I would need to make that determination myself. Oh and I definitely would not tell someone their equipment was bad or their hearing is just because they have a different opinion than mine as to what sounds good.
Nope, I'm not conflating anything. I'm suggesting that the issues he has with the sound quality of VF might be rectified with a better phono stage. Symphony Hall in Boston is considered one of the most acoustically greatest halls in the world. One hundred people go in there and marvel at the sound after a concert. One person at the concert, though, says afterward that the sound of mediocre at best. You might say to that person, "Oh well. It's not for you." Or you might ask that person questions to find out why, when the hall has such a stellar reputation and everyone else seemed to be impressed, he was not hearing good sound. Perhaps you find out he listened the entire time from the bathroom. Or listened from backstage. Or found out he had had eardrum surgery earlier in the day. If you have ever been to Symphony Hall to hear acoustic music, the sound is amazing, particularly about 8 rows back, center orchestra. But you can screw up the sound in there. Overamplify electric music and you can overpower the hall. So knowing the recording is great, it leads to wonder why he's not getting great sound from it.
