Music Matters Definitive Blue Note 45 RPM and 33 & 1/3 RPM vinyl series (pt7)

Discussion in 'Music Corner' started by MilesSmiles, Jun 13, 2014.

  1. Not suggesting that the 45 is degraded more, just that the qualities that digitization degrades are those more present on 45s, in my experience. Air and space around instruments, timbre and decay, massive sound stage, and overall smoothness.

    And when played through my system, I do not hear an increase in detail retrieved on Adams Apple SRX compared to the 45. I hear an upper midrange bump on the SRX that brings the sax forward and some of that detail gets brought forward with it. But it’s all there when playing back the 45 as well.

    Ultimately, I find the 33s and 45s to have unique sound signature. The SRX has a bit of a different sound signature than the non SRX 33s as well, though the difference is not as great as the 33 vs 45 in my opinion.

    I think it ultimately comes down to ones system and ones personal sonic preferences. But I am always interested to hear specific anecdotal comparisons on titles available on both formats.
     
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  2. Stu02

    Stu02 Forum Resident

    Location:
    Canada
    I hear what you are saying but Ive done a bunch of Fremers blind listenings that he does on Analogue Planet for fun and I think you can hear the salient differences well enough most of the time ... Obviously different records here but the point being you can pick out the basic sound signatures often
     
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  3. recstar24

    recstar24 Senior Member

    Location:
    Glen Ellyn, IL
    I think @Tim1954 point is more in response to a poster claiming some kind of false narrative that everyone digs the 45’s over the 33’s sonically and the only reason people dig the 33’s is due to convenience, when said poster has been shown to actually prefer the 33 sample over the 45, and Tim thankfully called him out on it :) You and @Tim1954 ‘s philosophy is probably more consistent with the majority of us on this thread, in that it truly is a case by case basis and system dependent.
     
    Last edited: Jun 16, 2019
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  4. FWIW I did @Tim1954 ’s blind comparison on ear buds through my phone at work and correctly determined 45 vs 33. But I wanted to confirm on the bigger system and never got around to it. And ultimately it’s a 50/50 shot on those things anyways.
     
  5. AnalogJ

    AnalogJ Hearing In Stereo Since 1959

    Location:
    Salem, MA
    I think I also pointed out that I was listening to reduced samples, and what sounded good over my computer speakers may not relate to listening to the vinyl live.
     
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  6. Tim1954

    Tim1954 Forum Resident

    Location:
    Cincinnati, OH
    It is a 50/50 shot if you are trying to guess which clip is which.

    Describing which sounds better to you is a different matter. And a question for which there can be no “correct” answer.
     
  7. Twinsfan007

    Twinsfan007 Forum Resident

    Location:
    Phoenix, AZ
    Just wanted to give an update to the Blue Note Juju mono original pressing that I was trying to get last week or so. I went into the shop the other day and asked again if he'd sell it to me. He at first said probably not but then I asked how much he wanted. He told me that they're moving to a new location in downtown and needs some money so he said he'd sell it for less than the price of a new OneStep. I couldn't get the money out of my pocket fast enough! :D I'm a very proud new owner to an original pressing of Juju by Wayne Shorter!!
     
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  8. guidedbyvoices

    guidedbyvoices Old Dan's Records

    Location:
    Alpine, TX
    Trying to put together a cart for Fathers Day shopping for me. I never have a problem getting to $150, but adding one more to get to $200 and "free" shipping I always get stuck on, and semi blind buy.

    For a fan of Andrew Hill's Judgment and In N Out, thoughts on McCoy Tyner's Real McCoy? I'm a big Elvin fan, it seems a no brainer even though I'm not familiar with it.


    edit - ha, just saw this:
     
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  9. johnt23

    johnt23 Forum Resident

    Location:
    Oregon
    Get it, and don't hesitate. It's worth it just for the first track "Passion Dance".





     
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  10. johnt23

    johnt23 Forum Resident

    Location:
    Oregon
    Now my turn to ask for advice. Any thoughts on Clifford Jordan "Cliff Craft"? I listened to sound samples and for me the music is just fine, but not particularly inspired. Is it a grower?
     
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  11. patient_ot

    patient_ot Senior Member

    Location:
    USA
    In terms of the music only, I personally find Clifford Jordan's 70s work for labels like Strata East way more interesting than his earlier BN recordings. YMMV.
     
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  12. Cervelo

    Cervelo Forum Resident

    Location:
    Upstate, NY
    I agree, the recent PP reissue of Cliff Jordan's 1970's Glass Bead Games keeps finding it's way to my turntable. It's not too often where every song on a 2lp set is excellent, plus the mastering and sonics are outstanding.
     
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  13. monkboughtlunch

    monkboughtlunch Senior Member

    Location:
    Texas
    From a technical standpoint, what causes crackle surface noise during the last few seconds of one side of an LP?

    The LP (Matador) is otherwise quiet on that side and the reverse side is quiet too.

    Record was cleaned, no change. Same issue on other turntables.

    Seems like there must be some imperfection in the vinyl, but why at only one spot at the tail end?

    And no, it’s not mistracking.

    Anyone else experiencing this on MM pressings?
     
  14. SpeedracerF

    SpeedracerF Forum Resident

    Location:
    Roosendaal
    I never really considered that it wasn't recorded by Rudy, but I guess it makes perfect sense considering the record was recorded in Paris.

    What I am wondering is, in which way this might have affected the sound of this recording. I'm not really knowledgeable on the subject, but from what I've read Rudy really had his own signature sound with it's own pro's and con's. For instance, I have read that he wasn't the best at recording piano's. I wonder if anyone here has an opinion on whether or not Rudy's absence has a positive or negative effect on this recording or if it's hard to say either way.
     
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  15. Fender Relic

    Fender Relic Forum Resident

    Location:
    PennsylBama
    Yes,on at least one and I keep forgetting to make a note of it. IIRC,it was Tina Brooks-True Blue.
     
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  16. guidedbyvoices

    guidedbyvoices Old Dan's Records

    Location:
    Alpine, TX
    Well, after buying a bunch around New Years with the new SRX's, I thought I was pretty much done with buying any more MMs, especially with the tone poet and BN80 series. My wife and kids weren't sure what to get me for Father's Day, so I got a green light for an order, grabbed these. Brings me up to 30 total (nine 45's, the rest 33's)

    These had my eye/ear for a while due to price and had played them a bunch on apple music, and liked all three quite a bit.
    Donald Byrd - Cat Walk (love that bari sax with the band)
    Johnny Griffin - Congregation (his other two didn't grab me much, but this one did for some reason (especially Latin Quarter)
    Jackie Maclean - Right Now (the drums on apple music sound really weird, mostly the bass drum, but when I asked a few months ago here, everyone said they sound fantastic on the MM. Otherwise, musically I love this album, especially the first two tracks)

    This one - I know the sound issues, but the price is at least on the lower end, I love Sonny and am on a big kick of his, and I'm interested to hear this, knowing the flaws, and maybe flipping the mono switch helps with any weird issues
    Sonny Rollins - Newk's Time

    And this a last minute near blind buy - played it last night on Apple and liked it a lot. A while back I tried it and it didn't click with me, but this time it really did. Most likely because since then I've gotten into In N Out, Inner Urge, and Andrew Hill's Judgment
    Mccoy Tyner - Real Mccoy


    If MM didn't drop price on the Johnny Griffin and Donald Byrd, I may not have considered another purchase. The price drop made me check them out, got me hooked on them musically, and made me consider another big buy (for me at least, these are budget challengers for sure). Hopefully they'll consider dropping price on other titles down the road to $35-40....
     
    Last edited: Jun 17, 2019
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  17. Chris Bernhardt

    Chris Bernhardt Forum Resident

    Location:
    Chicago IL
    It's a great record.
     
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  18. Morbius

    Morbius Forum Resident

    Location:
    Brookline, MA
    Cat Walk is excellent and as far as Donald Byrd goes you won't be able to stop at just one. No experience with Jonny Griffin but he comes highly recommended. Right Now is a sleeper and I can't believe it isn't more popular. What ever sonic issues may exist with Newk's Time I think you'll find they're grossly exaggerated, I've listened through the album several times and never heard anything I'd find objectionable. The Real McCoy shows RVG taking on some more modern techniques and the album is recorded pretty hot and all the players really stand out especially the drummer. Glad you found some bargains, its nice to see some of whats left of the MM catalog becoming more accessible!
     
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  19. monkboughtlunch

    monkboughtlunch Senior Member

    Location:
    Texas
    Any idea from a technical standpoint how this flaw occurs?
     
  20. guidedbyvoices

    guidedbyvoices Old Dan's Records

    Location:
    Alpine, TX
    Thanks! Before Donald Byrd price dropped, I’d checked all three of his MMs out on Apple because I loved Chant (which is coming from Tone Poet). The price drop made it an easy decision, and chant will be a day one buy for me.

    Newks Time - my understanding is the issue is some sound bleed anomolies due to Sonny walking around or turning or something like that, noticeable in the cymbals maybe? I’ve heard something similar on the BN 75 of Mobley’s Workout, and once I knew what caused it - RVG trying to adjust for the soloists in the room - it didn’t bother me anymore. I notice it but it doesn’t bother me. At least that’s what I think caused it and my understanding of it
     
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  21. Gabe Walters

    Gabe Walters Forum Resident

    That was the line from MM, but it’s tape dropouts. Very noticeable in the drums, not just the cymbals. Steve Hoffman worked the console to try and keep the sax present. Bernie Grundman’s approach was to take an existing digital recording, dub it to tape, and splice his tape dub into the damaged master.
     
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  22. guidedbyvoices

    guidedbyvoices Old Dan's Records

    Location:
    Alpine, TX
    Bernie, meaning the BN75?
     
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  23. musictoad

    musictoad Forum Resident

    Location:
    Salt Lake City, UT
    Alright everyone. Street of Dreams or Into Something?
     
  24. wellers73

    wellers73 Forum Resident

    Location:
    Brooklyn, NY
    Tough call. Into Something has great playing and is maybe a bit more "audiophile" sounding, but Street Of Dreams is just a gorgeous and very moody record. I listen to it a lot more than Into Something...
     
  25. SoundDoctor

    SoundDoctor Forum Resident

    Location:
    United States
    Into Something is going to be a BN80 release next year if you're willing to wait...
     

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