Discussion in 'Music Corner' started by MilesSmiles, Jun 13, 2014.
IMHO, that's at least partly on Hubbard. He was never the most tasteful soloist.
Point taken, but don’t confuse what is on those tapes with how RVG cut vinyl. The stuff MM did after Steve was no longer involved retained all the dynamics that were being displayed when he was. I believe that the big differences of opinion were how much deep bass should be added and how much top end should be retained. Using compression was never at issue.
Well, try listening to the LA recorded tracks on Miles’ Seven Steps To Heaven.
I would if I didn't find Miles's 60-65 period so dull.
Um, any improvement on the AP reissue?
One is on it’s way to me from Kansas...
The AP is the only version I know.
The NY tracks are fine.
Oh crap. I found the AP "Someday my Prince" a bit bright, but the lovely packaging encouraged me to try "Seven Steps"
Wonder if this is why Mofi avoided them in their last bunch of Miles?
Seven Steps isn’t bright overall and it has some beautifully recorded piano on the NY tracks. It’s just the LA recordings did not come out as well and Miles is WAY too hot. Not just bright but just too damned loud!
by the end of the 45 series and going into the start of the 33 series, it’s clear sonically MM really was locked in. The cafe Bohemia live sets I believe were the last of the 45’s dec 2013 released and really showcase the best of what MM could offer sonically.
Try not to let the mastering worry you too much. I have an OG Japanese stereo pressing and it really sounds like garbage. Everything is muddy, and the bass sounds like it's being played in the next room over. That said, Seven Steps to Heaven and Joshua are such driving tracks that the album still gets lots of play. The atmosphere on the slower LA tracks is a nice contrast. There's plenty to love on this album even though it may leave some things to be desired from a fidelity standpoint. Miles is really searching for the next thing during this time so it is George Coleman's only studio appearance and Herbie Hancock's debut with Miles. I'm sure the AP release will make it sound as good as it can. Enjoy!
I'm not sure that is true. I recall reading that they dialed the dynamic range back a bit when they put out the 33 series, partly due to the limitations of the format, but partly to make them pop a bit more. You have to turn up the 45s more, but they sound more natural to me.
I just picked up a sealed "Six Pieces of Silver" 45rpm today. I missed this one when it came out in 2011, and have been looking for a reasonably priced copy for a while. On opening it I can almost hear a sigh of relief from the record which has sat there sealed for 8 years - finally I can hear it saying I am going to be played
Sorry,but what intend you for "KG & RR @ CA. ,KG @ CA. ,KG@ATM, KG&SH @ ATM. ?
I agree with Steve on this issue. The differences are not about the speed (he adds cables as also having nothing to do with the differences, fwiw).
Anyway, the only one I’ve heard any difference in is True Blue. The 45 seems just a touch more dynamic, but I still prefer the 33. Others that have been released on 33 and 45 show little to no difference in dynamics.
Dynamics are a non-issue with any MM release, IMO. 33 or 45.
As I mentioned, however, my list is strictly to do with the mastering timeline.
Great record. Silver had so many good ones but this is one of my faves.
Where did you read this and was this a quote from KG, RR or JH?
Mine too - I can't wait to play it / its now clean and ready to go.
It was a long way back in this thread. A LONG way back. But JH has said (recently) that the 45rpm format, inherently, is the superior one for sound. But it's not the only factor.
Understood, but that doesn’t mean they dialed back the dynamics.
I’m with @AnalogJ on this side of the conversation. Ron has even told me that when it comes to pure unencumbered dynamics, you can’t beat the physics of the 45. Depending on the overall level of the tape and where things were recorded volume wise, as well as how much dynamic range is actually on the tape and session, I’m sure many of the 33’s were cut at a close enough level to the 45 where you can’t really hear a difference dynamic wise. But it’s very clear to my ears that on a good number of 33’s, compression was clearly applied to slow a better cut to lacquer but also to have the sound pop a little more. True Blue is a very obvious example in my system and ears, and at least with that example I agree with @AnalogJ ’s position.
Just to be clear, I am not saying that 45s can’t have more dynamics than 33s. My ears say they can. What I am asking is if Ron or Joe or Kevin actually said that during the cutting process they dialed back the dynamics for 33s.
Ron never used those specific words with me, what he said (to the best of my memory of conversation) is that some of the 33’s based on how they were cut could not match the dynamics of a 45. The 45 format basically allows you to cut a really dynamic track uninhibited (as long as you can fit it comfortably on a side), but a 33 enforces some limitations dynamic wise that need to be accounted for. At least that’s what I inferred from our conversation and my own knowledge of the cutting process
I got around to acquiring Fuchsia Swing Song a little while back and am giving it it's second listen right now. Really love this session, better than Contours. It's not as crazy spastic as that album but retains Sam's raw energy. And Tony Williams always brings it. Love how the piano is captured, really full and present. Feels like everyone had a few cups of coffee before playing lol. In a good way.
It’s a gem. I also prefer it to Contours and as a bonus I think it’s a better recording.
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