Nagaoka MP-200, Technics SL-1210GR, & Tonearm Height

No, the 2m Blue is on the Pro-Ject Carbon Classic which was set by the factory so I don't want to mess with that. It came with the 2M Silver and I swapped it with a 2M Blue stylus after a couple of years. So 2M Blue stylus in 2M Silver cart.

 

I have MP-200 on SL-1210 MK2 with 6mm rubber mat. (new SL-12** has 3mm rubber mat) I have set MP-200 VTA on 1 -1.5 depend on actually mood. It should be adequate to yours VTA set to 0 (zero) on new SL-12**.

 

But what is interesting is why is my MP-200 riding too low.

 

Weaker cantilever suspension?
What the bigger question is, is what kind of alignment is that?

 

Baerwald from vinylengine site technics alignment. Is there something wrong with this alignment? My MP-200 is just 11 mount old. Is it case for claim?

 

It just looks randomly shoved towards the end of the headshell. I guess its supposed to look like that.

 

I think the alignment doesn't have effect on cartridge suspension. I tried to set VTF 1.6g instead 1.78g. The result is little bit better not so low but I think still lower what I have seen on pictures. Can anyone take a picture how it looks on yours ? thx

 

Alignment doesnt affect it yes. No one said that.
Every cantilever has different suspension. That is all.

 

aha yes yes of course. I was worry about collapse of suspension. It is not cheep cart.

 

Main explanation for a low-rider is usually too much VTF, the need for shims to alter the angle of the stylus, or suspension collapse. Not sure what is going on with yours. Does Nagaoka use a tie wire inside the stylus assembly of their carts? If that broke it could make the suspension sag.

 

I have never set more than 1,8gram on main cart.

 

Mine is mounted so the screws sit center of the gaps. The headshell completely covers the "A" and bottom writing. I have mine set to 2g. I might go down to 1.8g.

 

Here's the operation manual again with measurements on how to set it up:

https://www.turntableneedles.com/assets/images/productimages/nagaoka_MP_series.pdf

And here's the 1210 mk2 manual:

https://manualsbrain.com/en/manuals/757708/?page=4

The overhang should measure 52mm which matches the 1210GR overhang (page 13):

https://www.technics.com/support/downloads/data/operating-instructions/SL-1200GR_TQBM0053_EB_eng.pdf

 

If for the benefit of @octavius, just above he indicated the use of Baerwald alignment, not default Technics, so the added overhang would be expected, along with some change in offset angle.

 

Ah, thanks for the clarification. I didn't know Baerwald alignment was a thing. Just found this: Something I've never understood about Baerwald alignment..please explain

So what are the advantages and disadvantages?

 

It's just another alignment methodology. Baerwald and Stevenson being the most common. Technics proprietary alignment is a variation of Stevenson alignment. Stevenson optimizes alignment for the inner grooves, while Baerwald and similar alignments optimize for the lowest average distortion across the entire record. I have always preferred and used Stevenson or an alignment based on Stevenson.

 

Interesting. Thanks!

 

My concern here from your start was perhaps you measured the cartridge height to be 18mm when it actually may have been 17mm, which would explain the cart sounding better to you at the 0 position rather than the 1 position. Today I got word from someone who found an illustration from the Asian manual for the MP-200 which shows the height from stylus tip to cart top to be 18.5mm. This would indicate more divergence in what Technics recommends and what your ears say is best. At any rate, it's all somewhat interesting and your experimentation has paid off.

 

Probably it depends also on suspension of cartridge.

 

If you believe it depends on suspension then ya might want to experiment with VTA adjustment; however, that experimentation is limited on carts less than 17mm in height unless they're shimmed first with more shimming than necessary to level the cart. That's a lot of work. My Shure V15V-MR is 15 mm high; thus, to level it I had to fit a 2mm shim to it to level at Zero VTA position. This allows me to experiment with tail high conditions but not tail low conditions. I would need a 4mm shim to experiment with tail low conditions. At any rate, my 2mm shimmed cart at 17mm tall is level on standard weight LP when TT is set at Zero VTA and the sound (tone) is virtually identical to SACDs of same music so I'm quite satisfied with the Technics cartridge alignment/balancing/leveling recommendations. Wish I could eliminate the snap, crackle, and pop but that's a lost cause and the reason most of my record playing these days is to digitize it, filtering the pops. I find I'm not even doing that much anymore since I can now download all the music I have on LPs from Apple Music, which sounds really good.

 

i´ve got the mk5 with a jelco head shell holding the mp-200 using 4 in the vat adjustment, also im using the thicker mat and additional counterweight, do you guys think that's too high? I did experiment with various heights and determined 4 was the best to me, as I felt it didn't pick up the imperfections that much, maybe I'm very wrong, I will try again in some days, by the way I hope you are enjoying the G such a beauty... maybe one day, one can dream.

 

i think it maybe right - i'm using a mp150 @1.75g on a nagaoka headshell on a mk6 (with 4mm herbies mat) and i'm at 3.5 vta - sounds fabulous.

 

Tonearm should be parallel to the record for correct VTA (or set the SRA for even higher accuracy).
You should get yourself an acrylic VTA/azimuth block to check it accurately, something like this:
https://www.amazon.com/VTA-Azimuth-Gauge-Alignment-Block/dp/B0771Z3XMH/

There are other brands that sell the exact same type but with another logo on it for about 3 to 5 bucks though, if you like bargain hunting.