Discussion in 'Music Corner' started by Steve Hoffman, Jun 20, 2010.
Wow! How I wish we could get the Sinatra Capitols released like this.
Steve, I have a question about the 'Love Is Thing' 3 tracks.
On the 60's stereo remix replacement master you talked about in an earlier thread, the stereo image of the orchestra is really wide.
On the version you just did for the 45 RPM (the only one I have heard so far) the orchestra stereo image is much narrower.
I am assuming the orschestra spread is fairly wide on the 3 tracks due to the width in the replacement mix.
Can you please explain what the difference is between the two and why?
We didn't narrow anything. I hate when engineers do that. The music tracks have a nice natural center-fill. The old mix from the 1960's had the music out of phase. We corrected it. It's not folded in on our version, it's normal.. The old mix had a lot of compression on the orchestra. We have none. We have Nat's voice up through the entire mix, the old mix didn't. The orchestra bleeds through on Nat's mike giving the illusion of a narrow stage perhaps. It's not. The original three-tracks sound exactly like what you hear on our new multi-channel SACD, full left, center and full right, as pure as possible.
I thought the old mix sounded a bit wonky and figured there was a phase issue in there somewhere. The phase issue in the old mix may have also exaggerated the width some.
The bleed on the vocal is what was throwing me off on the new mix. I haven't got the SACD yet and had a chance to hear what the center channel mic captured.
Thanks for the explanation.
Acoustic Sounds has finally shipped my SACD today. Can't wait!
Just for the record, there are several old stereo mixes of the LOVE IS THE THING album that were created by Capitol from the three-track 1956 recording. First, in 1957, was the two-track open reel stereo mix, done at 7 1/2 ips to dupe expensive open reel two-track tapes. That mix sounds a lot like ours (pretty darn pure) except they had some kind of Dee-ssser on his voice which throws into distortion. This mix was retired when four track tapes came along for consumers and a new mix was prepared, basically the same as the LP reduction mix done in 1959 for the new stereophonic LP's. That LP mix has been the main mix throughout the stereo era. A few songs wore out and were replaced with other mixes in the 1960's. When the first CD came out in the late 1980's, a new mix was created for SOME songs by Larry Walsh. The DCC version was a completely new mix and the new Analogue Productions reissues have three new mixes: The multi-channel SACD mix, the two channel SACD mix and a unique mix done live for the 45 RPM version.
Just in case anyone cares: The original 7 1/2 ips mix done for the first 1957 open reel tape version has never been reissued on anything, in any country. I think we were the first people to preview that old tape (long thought lost in the ozone) since 1957. It was the mix most faithful to the spirit of the recording. In fact, I used it as a guideline for our new mixes. You can hear this old mix if you find a two-channel open reel consumer tape of LOVE IS THE THING on eBay or something. Make sure it's the two channel tape and not the four-track tape with music on both sides. That's a turkey.
Just recieved my copy of the new SACD.
This is one incredible sounding disc.
And Steve was right: The mono "hit" version of "When I Fall In Love" is significantly different from the now-familiar stereo version. The opening sounds like an entirely different song due to the focus on the cello. I know it's the same take as the stereo version, but this is a really, really different sounding version -- and I love it. The stereo version always sounded a little too "blurry" to me; the strings just wash over you. But this mono mix seems more focused and powerful. "Stardust" sounds fabulous in mono, too.
That's why it's such a breakthrough that the mono version is on our SACD/CD as well. The mono was the version that was fussed over by the engineers back in 1956. After all, stereo LP's were not even invented yet.
So, hail the mono! Hasn't been reissued in 50 years.
It blows my mind that it took 53 years -- Nat Cole was only alive for 44 years! -- to give this classic album its due. On one Super Audio disc, you have the classic mono version, a stereo mix and a multi-channel mix ... I don't see how the SACD release of this album could ever be equaled, let alone bettered. I can only imagine how much these discs will sell for in the secondary market once they go out of print.
I wasn't sure if I could rationalize buying all of the Cole SACDs, but after hearing the first two discs, there's simply no question: I'm going to get them all ASAP, along with the vinyl version of "The Nat King Cole Story."
Congratulations and thanks to Steve, Kevin, Analogue Productions, Capitol Records, and everyone else involved in this campaign.
Just ordered the SACD. Although, as I've mentioned before, it's "The Nat King Cole Story" that I'm dying to hear on SACD, this one I'm really interested in hearing, since it's one of Steve's personal favorites. I've really only known this album from the later abridged (Green label) LP on CAPITOL and more recently, in the BEAR FAMILY box set, so this will be my introduction to this album in it's, proper and original track order
And *that* is the version I can't wait to hear!!!
That's the version that was recorded in this control room:
I ordered the SACD version yesterday and can't wait to hear it. Already have a copy of the DCC LP, an original Capitol 45 EP (Part 3) and an original Capitol mono LP (as pictured in Steve's post). Can't get enough of this wonderful music.
mine vinyl arrived today, SACD shipped today....very psyched to get home tonight...
I think they're being careful to ship them based on when they were ordered. In other words, the earlier you ordered them the sooner you get them. For instance some people who almost certainly ordered there's back in 2009 are getting them now or even got them a few days ago. I ordered in Jan, and so I'm a bit down on the queue. The website says my copy of Love has shipped, but I haven't gotten an email yet...
oh maybe, probably a small staffed operation anyway as far as shipping staff, so that could make a difference too. I think this just arrived to them anyway and I would wager this is the one they've got the most orders on so far. though thats just my guess...cause its sprinkled with Stardust...
The SACD is wonderful; it is hard to say which (MC/Stereo/Mono) layer I like best. Incredibly beautiful.
I got the Ray Charles "Genius Sings The Blues" SACD a couple of weeks ago. As good as it is -- and it is great, IMO -- the SQ on "Love Is The Thing" leaves it in the dust. Ray's recording sounds old; Nat's sounds new.
Nice Work. Just Beautiful.
I now look forward to the "After Midnight" disc.
Steve, did Nat have a necklace or something that he would play with while singing?
I hear him playing with it in the break down take at the beginning of 'I Thought About Marie' and ocassionally in spots in the final takes of songs on this and the other LP's.
Go to my first post in this thread. Look at the second picture of NAT. See his wrist?
man the vinyl sounds really spectacular...
I wish I had the money to get the 45's. Any test pressings for a Nat devote who left a corporate job to refollow his dream? Seriously, hopefully down the road.
It is becoming clear that not having an SACD front-end (for stereo DSD playback) is unacceptable. I do wonder why something like this album can't be released as hi-res flac for download? Steve (or anyone), is that a reasonable desire on my part?
The original vinyl of Love Is The Thing is what got me back into records in the first place.
My mom had a beat up one and I played when I was in my early teens, in the 1980's, I liked it but never thought about the sound quality. Then, many years later after I had forgotten about it and had only cd's I found an old capital cd version of this, I think it was called Love Is The Thing and More, anyway when I played I felt it just wasn't the same. I got my mom's version out and played it. I really started to get into vinyl after that. Now I am like Mel Gibson in that movie, he always had to purchase a copy of Catcher in the Rye everytime he saw one and if I see and old vinyl copy of Love Is The Thing I gotta buy it, as long as it is in vg+ condition. hehe
For your mom to tell you it is good and you bought it makes her a cool mom and you a good son
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