Obscure & Neglected Female Singers Of Jazz & Standards (1930s to 1960s)

Discussion in 'Music Corner' started by Ridin'High, Sep 4, 2016.

  1. Tribute

    Tribute Senior Member

    Though that may have some truth on the surface, society is only beginning to learn the extent of issues that women in "the workplace" face and have suffered through in silence (including the professional worlds of recording and performing). Despite whatever their press agents have said, or what they themselves might have said in interviews, it is very plausible that professional women singers faced criminal levels of "harassment" from almost anyone who had some control or power over their ability to continue, whether it be club owners, band leaders, management agencies. press agents, and record company staff. Even law enforcement officials who had complete power over a musician's ability to perform within a city (you know of the cabaret card system?)

    You must have heard that old threatening line: "You'll never work in this town again.". It certainly happened to many female vocalists.

    In addition to all that, for those who made it through this gauntlet, and even struggled to maintain both the career and family, there was the problem of long road trips (only woman on the bus) the 2AM last sets at clubs and difficulties of getting home safe (not faced by the men), and more.

    Finally, there were the cases of women who regarded their work as an art form, and refused to continue to accept the total control of the music industry and pressure to focus on lightweight pop (Jeri Southern, a good example).

    It really wasn't all about just getting married, having kids and doing housework. Most of the stories were never told and never will be.
     
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  2. Colonel Potterby

    Colonel Potterby Well-Known Member

     
  3. Colonel Potterby

    Colonel Potterby Well-Known Member

    This is a very interesting and informative overview of her career. Thank you for writing and sharing it.
     
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  4. Tribute

    Tribute Senior Member


    I have broadcast all of Millie Vernon's LP/CD's several times. I have never collected her obscure batch of singles (never on LP or CD).

    It was disappointing that the Audiophile CD deleted one track from the 1982 Audiophile LP (Something To Remember You By). There was plenty of room on the CD. So, if you like Millie, you need both.

    I saw one post that indicated that Millie died in February 2009, but there is very little about her on the web. Perhaps you can dig up some more.

    The producer of the Audiophile CD was stated as Richard Vernon (probably a mistake as there are many info mistakes in the CD liners, it is probably Dick Zalud, her husband), so I would guess that "Millie" is her preferred spelling.

    I do disagree with your comment that one might think it is a man singing on some later recordings. The large majority of mature women jazz singers develop voices in a deeper range, even if they had a higher voice in their 20's. There are not many Blossom Dearie voices among mature women singers
     
    Last edited: Sep 12, 2018
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  5. Tribute

    Tribute Senior Member

    I just did a 2 hour broadcast of Millie Vernon. Included her complete 1956 LP and a sampling of her other three recordings. Has anyone here ever heard her obscure singles?

    A number of people hearing her for the first time loved her singing.

    I wish I could call Millie and tell her about it.

    [​IMG]

    [​IMG]
     
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  6. Tribute

    Tribute Senior Member

    Time to get some more posts here!
     
    Reader likes this.
  7. Reader

    Reader Senior Member

    Location:
    e.s.t. tenn.
    I don't know enough about the topic to add much but do read it as it appears. I also go back and double check as I get a few things mentioned. This thread has introduced me to much that I've never heard but that I do want to hear. Unfortunately, my taste is bigger than my billfold.

    Thanks to everyone that introduces new music to me and others here.
     
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  8. Reader

    Reader Senior Member

    Location:
    e.s.t. tenn.
    Wish there was a way to hear your show.
     
  9. Tribute

    Tribute Senior Member

    It is somewhere past Pluto by now. No tape or archive.
     
  10. Tribute

    Tribute Senior Member

    I should add that there were also many women who were able to make that first, and maybe a second or third record, and who seemingly disappeared but actually kept on singing professionally.

    They may have settled in nightclub performances in one of the many cities where records were rarely recorded and the national press did not exist. Sometimes, it seemed that even Chicago wasn't big enough to succeed in.

    They may have gone into some aspect of musical theater. Anything that was not Broadway got no attention. Many actually had a television career, but those memories and "tapes" are lost.

    They may have wanted to sing songs that the record companies no longer wanted to record. They may have gone into teaching (can you imagine going to Jeri Southern for lessons?).

    Usually, I would blame the record companies for not recording all of these great singers more frequently, and for not giving them greater artistic freedom and forcing them to accept material and arrangements according to the latest fad. Often, the record companies were the party that did not call a session.
     
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  11. Tribute

    Tribute Senior Member

  12. Tribute

    Tribute Senior Member

  13. Tribute

    Tribute Senior Member

  14. onlyacanvasky

    onlyacanvasky Your guess is as good as mine.

    Lots of Cathy’s singles are entirely forgettable (there’s something that just rubs me up the wrong way about a 30-something year old woman having to sing about boys at school - paraphrasing someone else way up thread, you sing this or you don’t sing at all), but she did cut some good tunes. The very early ones fronting Larry Fotine’s band have a nice swing, and there’s some standards on Ivory Tower and Shy, but Songs For Sentimentalists is really a great record of standards and I love how she handles them.
    It’s beautifully recorded, but every copy of the LP I own (is it five or six? I forget…) is a dynagroove plagued mess. It’s a shame some foreign branch of RCA doesn’t do what EMI Japan did about five years ago with Shy and just produce a beautiful reissue of it out of the blue. Make it a twofer with Travel By Carr!
     
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  15. Milton Brown

    Milton Brown New Member

    Location:
    Waterloo Iowa
    Boswell Sisters are my all time favorite singing group. Ella Mae Morse my fav gal singer. I think Lillian Roth was great Glad to see the Great Ethel Waters getting praise. Janis Martin is my favorite gal rock-n-roll singer.
     
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  16. toilet_doctor

    toilet_doctor "Rockin' chair's got me"

    Location:
    USA
    Thank you for mentioning Lillian Roth - we didn't talk about her yet.

    What are your 3 favorite jazz/standards singers?
     
  17. toilet_doctor

    toilet_doctor "Rockin' chair's got me"

    Location:
    USA
    "As bad as it was it was good"

    [​IMG]
    Lillian Roth
    (1910-1980)


    "What a cutie she was in the early 1930's!
    Here she sings some standards with a good
    jazz band, her voice is as rich and swingin'

    as ever! Essential music!"
    (comment)




    "7 years old she made her Broadway debut in The Inner Man. Her motion picture debut came in 1918 in Pershing's Crusaders. Together with her sister Ann she toured as "Lillian Roth and Co." At times the two were billed as "The Roth Kids". One of the most exciting moments for her came when she met U.S. President Woodrow Wilson. The President took Lillian and her sister for a ride around the block in his chauffeur driven car, after attending a performance of their vaudeville act.

    [​IMG]
    Look into the eyes of these girls...

    Roth entered the Clark School of Concentration in the early 1920s. She appeared in Artists and Models in 1923 and went on to make Revels with Frank Fay. During production for the former show, she told management she was nineteen years of age."

    1 min bio
    Early Life


    Roth was married at least five times, to aviator William C. Scott ("Willie Richards"), Judge Benjamin Shalleck, Eugene J. Weiner ("Mark Harris"), Edward Goldman ("Vic"), and Burt McGuire. Prior to her marriages, she was engaged to David Lyons, who died of tuberculosis. She divorced W. C. Scott in May 1932 after 13 months of marriage (Pittsburgh-Post Gazette 5-6-1932). In 1955 she met Thomas Burt McGuire, scion of Funk and Wagnalls Publishing Company at an Alcoholics Anonymous meeting.
    Roth joined Alcoholics Anonymous (A.A.) in 1946. The two were married and McGuire managed Roth until September 1963. At this time she received a note from him stating that their marriage was finished. According to Roth, he left her penniless after withdrawing all funds from their joint bank account.


    In 1970, Roth was sharing a penthouse on Manhattan's West Fifty-Eighth Street. Her fellow occupants were another woman, three poodles, a police dog, a chihuahua, and three dachsunds. Her last employment included work as a bakery employee, hospital attendant, and package wrapper and she cut pies at the Automat.

    In 1971, however, she made a triumphant return to Broadway in the Kander and Ebb musical 70, Girls, 70, which despite its short run was recorded by Columbia and has remained a popular cast album. She also returned to feature films, which she had left in 1934, to play a pathologist in the cult horror classic Alice, Sweet Alice (also known as Communion) in 1976. Her last film was Boardwalk, with Lee Strasberg, Ruth Gordon and Janet Leigh (1979). A successful concert at Town Hall was released as an album by AEI Records after her death. One of her final appearances was in a well reviewed club act at the legendary N.Y.C. night club, Reno Sweeney.

    Natural born actress and entertainer, she radiates...

    1930

    SING YOU SINNERS ~ 1930

    Huguette's Waltz ~ 1930

    1933

    If I Could Be With You

    COME UP AND SEE ME SOMETIME ~ 1933

    LILLIAN ROTH 'Eadie was a Lady'

    CD: Lillian Roth "Beyond My Worth" Simitar Ent. 1998 Remastered

    [​IMG]

    [​IMG]
    (I bought it at amazon in like new condition for $1.29 + shipping).

    Review
    "Rare voice of Lillian Roth
    When I purchased this album, I never heard the voice of Lillian Roth before, there is nothing by her on the several thousand CDs I have. I recently watched the movie starring Rita Hayworth "I'll Cry Tomorrow" and I like it. Although Lillian never had a charted hit, but she had a nice smooth voice which is very pleasing to the listener. I would love to hear what she originally sounded like in the thirties, when she was so popular, There is nothing available of original recordings of this fine lady that I know of.. The songs on this album were recorded in 1957, which are OK, but I only wish they were original thirties recordings. There are three cuts on this album which I liked, and will give some airplay on my radio show...:
    IT'S BEEN A LONG LONG TIME; THAT OLD FEELING; I'LL NEVER SMILE AGAIN. Although these were my favorites, the others on this collection are still done well
    ."
    Brian Lee Hart
    WVUD Radio
    Newark De

    Her voice strongly resembles Rosemary Clooney,
    and if you like Rosie...

    It's Been a Long Long Time

    Until the Real Thing Comes Along

    I'll Never Smile Again

    Title track (Her own song)
    Beyond My Worth

    Two albums Lillian Roth Sings (1957) and I'll Cry Tomorrow (1957)

    "When I bought this LP years ago It had an extra album in it on the budget label Tops with the Don Elliott Orch instead of the Don Costa Orch as on the Epic label. Both records are in poorly kept condition,the Tops brand is worse, they're not too bad sound quality wise, but are badly scratched up, did the best I could with cleaning, thought they were worth uploading as there were few Lillian Roth songs posted, and I thought she has a unique singing style of her own worth sharing." (comment)
    That Old Feeling - Lillian Roth with the Don Elliott Orchestra 1950's

    I Don't Know Why (I Just Do)

    Lets Fall In Love - Lillian Roth with The Don Costa Orchestra - 1955

    Happiness Is A Thing Called Joe

    After You've Gone

    It Takes A Woman To Know A Man

    Lillian was a jazz/swing pioneer and torch singer of the 30s,
    her 78's never see the light of day...
    She left two albums of standards for us in the 50s.
    and...
    Many fans of the genre of Rap music will be shocked to find out who was its founder in the 50's...
    Yes, guys, Lillian Roth - this wonderful lady was 40 years ahead of her time:
    Lillian Roth - Sing, You Sinners!

    Books

    [​IMG]

    Roth's autobiography, I'll Cry Tomorrow, was written with author-collaborator Gerold Frank in 1954, and a toned-down version of it was made into a hit film the following year starring Susan Hayward, who was nominated for an Academy Award. The book became a bestseller worldwide and sold more than seven million copies in twenty languages, and the film renewed the public's interest in Roth. She recorded four songs for the Coral label (the first commercial recordings of her career), which were followed by an LP for Epic and another for Tops.
    She also headlined a vaudeville revival at the Palace on Broadway.
    A highlight of her act was an imitation of Susan Hayward imitating her (Roth) singing "Red, Red Robin".


    In 1958, Roth published a second book, Beyond My Worth, which was not as successful as its predecessor, but told the compelling story of what it was like to be placed on a pedestal that she could not always live up to. Roth had managed to re-invent herself as a major concert and nightclub performer. She appeared at venues in Las Vegas and New York's Copacabana and was a popular attraction in Australia.

    "Roth died from a stroke in 1980, at the age of 69. The inscription on her marker in Mount Pleasant Cemetery in Westchester County, New York, reads:
    "As bad as it was it was good."
    (jazzmusicblogspot)

    Movie Legends - Lillian Roth
     
    Last edited: Oct 19, 2018
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  18. Jazzmonkie

    Jazzmonkie Forum Resident

    Location:
    Tempe, AZ
    I love Lillian Roth in Lubitsch's "Love Parade" with Lupino Lane. It's too bad she wasn't in more movies.
     
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  19. Colonel Potterby

    Colonel Potterby Well-Known Member

    I think Lillian Roth was a fabulous singer. I have everything of hers that was released on CD, and some downloads. I had no idea she did a Town Hall concert that was recorded. I do not believe that ever made it to CD. I would like to hear it.

    [​IMG]
    Lillian Roth
    (1910-1980)


    "What a cutie she was in the early 1930's!
    Here she sings some standards with a good
    jazz band, her voice is as rich and swingin'

    as ever! Essential music!"
    (comment)




    "7 years old she made her Broadway debut in The Inner Man. Her motion picture debut came in 1918 in Pershing's Crusaders. Together with her sister Ann she toured as "Lillian Roth and Co." At times the two were billed as "The Roth Kids". One of the most exciting moments for her came when she met U.S. President Woodrow Wilson. The President took Lillian and her sister for a ride around the block in his chauffeur driven car, after attending a performance of their vaudeville act.

    [​IMG]
    Look into the eyes of these girls...

    Roth entered the Clark School of Concentration in the early 1920s. She appeared in Artists and Models in 1923 and went on to make Revels with Frank Fay. During production for the former show, she told management she was nineteen years of age."

    1 min bio
    Early Life


    Roth was married at least five times, to aviator William C. Scott ("Willie Richards"), Judge Benjamin Shalleck, Eugene J. Weiner ("Mark Harris"), Edward Goldman ("Vic"), and Burt McGuire. Prior to her marriages, she was engaged to David Lyons, who died of tuberculosis. She divorced W. C. Scott in May 1932 after 13 months of marriage (Pittsburgh-Post Gazette 5-6-1932). In 1955 she met Thomas Burt McGuire, scion of Funk and Wagnalls Publishing Company at an Alcoholics Anonymous meeting.
    Roth joined Alcoholics Anonymous (A.A.) in 1946. The two were married and McGuire managed Roth until September 1963. At this time she received a note from him stating that their marriage was finished. According to Roth, he left her penniless after withdrawing all funds from their joint bank account.


    In 1970, Roth was sharing a penthouse on Manhattan's West Fifty-Eighth Street. Her fellow occupants were another woman, three poodles, a police dog, a chihuahua, and three dachsunds. Her last employment included work as a bakery employee, hospital attendant, and package wrapper and she cut pies at the Automat.

    In 1971, however, she made a triumphant return to Broadway in the Kander and Ebb musical 70, Girls, 70, which despite its short run was recorded by Columbia and has remained a popular cast album. She also returned to feature films, which she had left in 1934, to play a pathologist in the cult horror classic Alice, Sweet Alice (also known as Communion) in 1976. Her last film was Boardwalk, with Lee Strasberg, Ruth Gordon and Janet Leigh (1979). A successful concert at Town Hall was released as an album by AEI Records after her death. One of her final appearances was in a well reviewed club act at the legendary N.Y.C. night club, Reno Sweeney.

    Natural born actress and entertainer, she radiates...

    1930

    SING YOU SINNERS ~ 1930

    Huguette's Waltz ~ 1930

    1933

    If I Could Be With You

    COME UP AND SEE ME SOMETIME ~ 1933

    LILLIAN ROTH 'Eadie was a Lady'

    CD: Lillian Roth "Beyond My Worth" Simitar Ent. 1998 Remastered

    [​IMG]

    [​IMG]
    (I bought it at amazon in like new condition for $1.29 + shipping).

    Review
    "Rare voice of Lillian Roth
    When I purchased this album, I never heard the voice of Lillian Roth before, there is nothing by her on the several thousand CDs I have. I recently watched the movie starring Rita Hayworth "I'll Cry Tomorrow" and I like it. Although Lillian never had a charted hit, but she had a nice smooth voice which is very pleasing to the listener. I would love to hear what she originally sounded like in the thirties, when she was so popular, There is nothing available of original recordings of this fine lady that I know of.. The songs on this album were recorded in 1957, which are OK, but I only wish they were original thirties recordings. There are three cuts on this album which I liked, and will give some airplay on my radio show...:
    IT'S BEEN A LONG LONG TIME; THAT OLD FEELING; I'LL NEVER SMILE AGAIN. Although these were my favorites, the others on this collection are still done well
    ."
    Brian Lee Hart
    WVUD Radio
    Newark De

    Her voice strongly resembles Rosemary Clooney,
    and if you like Rosie...

    It's Been a Long Long Time

    Until the Real Thing Comes Along

    I'll Never Smile Again

    Title track (Her own song)
    Beyond My Worth

    Two albums Lillian Roth Sings (1957) and I'll Cry Tomorrow (1957)

    "When I bought this LP years ago It had an extra album in it on the budget label Tops with the Don Elliott Orch instead of the Don Costa Orch as on the Epic label. Both records are in poorly kept condition,the Tops brand is worse, they're not too bad sound quality wise, but are badly scratched up, did the best I could with cleaning, thought they were worth uploading as there were few Lillian Roth songs posted, and I thought she has a unique singing style of her own worth sharing." (comment)
    That Old Feeling - Lillian Roth with the Don Elliott Orchestra 1950's

    I Don't Know Why (I Just Do)

    Lets Fall In Love - Lillian Roth with The Don Costa Orchestra - 1955

    Happiness Is A Thing Called Joe

    After You've Gone

    It Takes A Woman To Know A Man

    Lillian was a jazz/swing pioneer and torch singer of the 30s,
    her 78's never see the light of day...
    She left two albums of standards for us in the 50s.
    and...
    Many fans of the genre of Rap music will be shocked to find out who was its founder in the 50's...
    Yes, guys, Lillian Roth - this wonderful lady was 40 years ahead of her time:
    Lillian Roth - Sing, You Sinners!

    Books

    [​IMG]

    Roth's autobiography, I'll Cry Tomorrow, was written with author-collaborator Gerold Frank in 1954, and a toned-down version of it was made into a hit film the following year starring Susan Hayward, who was nominated for an Academy Award. The book became a bestseller worldwide and sold more than seven million copies in twenty languages, and the film renewed the public's interest in Roth. She recorded four songs for the Coral label (the first commercial recordings of her career), which were followed by an LP for Epic and another for Tops.
    She also headlined a vaudeville revival at the Palace on Broadway.
    A highlight of her act was an imitation of Susan Hayward imitating her (Roth) singing "Red, Red Robin".


    In 1958, Roth published a second book, Beyond My Worth, which was not as successful as its predecessor, but told the compelling story of what it was like to be placed on a pedestal that she could not always live up to. Roth had managed to re-invent herself as a major concert and nightclub performer. She appeared at venues in Las Vegas and New York's Copacabana and was a popular attraction in Australia.

    "Roth died from a stroke in 1980, at the age of 69. The inscription on her marker in Mount Pleasant Cemetery in Westchester County, New York, reads:
    "As bad as it was it was good."
    (jazzmusicblogspot)

    Movie Legends - Lillian Roth [/QUOTE]
     
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  20. bethiejw

    bethiejw Active Member

    Location:
    Arizona
    [/QUOTE]


    Has anyone recommended
    Anna Maria Alberghetti?
    Her "I can't resist you" album has a very pretty version of I only have eyes for you. She won a Tony for her performance in the musical Carnival.
     
  21. bethiejw

    bethiejw Active Member

    Location:
    Arizona
    By the way, I watched Lillian Roth in Ladies they walk about a prison movie. She was pretty good. I believe she sang in that. I don't see why someone doesn't make a collection of her 30's material.
     
  22. bethiejw

    bethiejw Active Member

    Location:
    Arizona
  23. Stu02

    Stu02 Forum Resident

    Location:
    Canada
    Hope everyone had a good year or failing that, i hope everyone found support and comfort in music ...,,
    [​IMG]
     
  24. Tribute

    Tribute Senior Member

    I had been thinking that it would be nice to see some more posts from our "thread starter" and the other contributors to this thread.

    We cannot allow the memory of these wonderful singers to fade away.

    Tell us your gift ideas!
     
  25. bethiejw

    bethiejw Active Member

    Location:
    Arizona
    That's a great album, my favorite Christmas one.
     
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