SH Spotlight People always ask me: What does brickwalled digital compression sound like?

Discussion in 'Music Corner' started by Steve Hoffman, May 23, 2003.

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  1. davenav

    davenav High Plains Grifter

    Location:
    Louisville, KY USA
    Thanks Steve. Great analogy.

    For some reason most of the world reckons 'louder' means 'better.'

    My favorite example of worst digital compression is Who's Next. Familiar story so I won't elaborate. But it's sad.
     
  2. JonUrban

    JonUrban SHF Member #497

    Location:
    Connecticut
    Steve, forgive me if I am asking a stupid question, but is the digital compression something like taking an audio music file and modifying it with something like a BBE "Sonic Maximizer", or a software smiley face EQ? Or is it something else all together?
     
  3. Audio72

    Audio72 Senior Member

    Location:
    So Cal.
    Thanks Steve.
     
  4. Geoman076

    Geoman076 Sealed vinyl is Fun!!

    Location:
    Massachusetts
    I also remember a T. V. commercial analogy that was posted a while ago (maybe by Steve also).

    When you are watching a television show, some parts are loud and some parts are soft. When the commercial comes on, the whole commercial, whether someone is whispering or yelling, is all at the same volume. That is also compression, a total loss of dynamic range. That is what makes you reach for the remote to turn the volume down. There are some parts of the show that you were watching that were as loud as the commercial, but it didn't hurt your ears, because the whole thing was not at the same volume.

    That's how I like to explain it. How'd I do??
     
  5. BeatleFred

    BeatleFred Senior Member

    Location:
    Queens, New York
    Gary- Yep, its the 25th Anniversary Edition.
     
  6. Michael

    Michael I LOVE WIDE S-T-E-R-E-O!

    Geez, That was painful and now I have to Windex my glass slider! Point well taken...
     
    mikaal likes this.
  7. peterC

    peterC Aussie Addict

    Location:
    sydney
    Thanks Steve!

    Now I have a tactful way of describing some of my ex-girlfriends.
     
  8. Grant

    Grant Life is a rock, but the radio rolled me!

    This is the saddest part indeed.

    But I wonder if artists feel intimidated by the record company, so they say they like and want thier album maximized.
     
  9. Grant

    Grant Life is a rock, but the radio rolled me!

    Just one question Steve, is digital compression so bad just because people tend to push digital compression to and past it's limits, or is analog compression really that much smoother? I'm asking as a person who only has experience with digital compressors and analog tape.
     
  10. oxenholme

    oxenholme Senile member

    Location:
    Knoydart
    So is it digital compression that makes that Simon & Garfunkel 'Old Friends' set impossible to listen to above a certain level? I've always been curious, at first it sounds beautifully clear, but when I turn it up a tad it seems to distort in a strange way, and I wondered if they'd mastered it just at just a little bit too high a level.

    Mind you, for all Sony were one of the co-developers of CD, they've managed to produce some truly diabolical sounding discs, and I'm not too sure about some of their SACD's either.
     
    Jarleboy likes this.
  11. Grant

    Grant Life is a rock, but the radio rolled me!

    HUH??? They didn't use any compression on that box! Perhaps it is the EQ you don't like?

    I would say it would be wise to take a serious look at your system to see where and why it is distorting.
     
  12. oxenholme

    oxenholme Senile member

    Location:
    Knoydart
    The S & G are the only discs I have where this happens. The EQ is very much to my liking, and at low level the sound is crystal clear. I've got the digipak set in a "book", and as far as I can see they are the USA pressed discs rather than the Austrian that we normally get in England. They are mastered at very high level.

    The "presence" is just a bit obtrusive compared to other acoustic CD's I have on (for example) Shanachie. I have one or two CD's that are mastered at higher level - The BBC Wired For Sound is probably the loudest disc I've ever had, but the music is different and maybe a bit of distortion would be less apparant.

    Sound is subjective and very difficult to describe. My observations on the S & G discs are in good faith - they are certainly the best I've ever heard the material, but to my ears something isn't quite right.
     
    Jarleboy likes this.
  13. Steve Hoffman

    Steve Hoffman Your host Your Host Thread Starter

    Grant, remember that thread about DIGITAL EQ vs. ANALOG EQ?

    Same deal here. Digital EQ is just like the Terminator; it swoops down and chops off the dynamic peaks without mercy, adding nothing to the mix. It never sounds good and if overused, can totally ruin a recording.
     
  14. OcdMan

    OcdMan Senior Member

    Location:
    Maryland
    How does digital EQ chop off the dynamic peaks? I thought that was digital compression's "job"...?
     
  15. Steve Hoffman

    Steve Hoffman Your host Your Host Thread Starter

    Sorry, I meant DIGITAL COMPRESSION.

    Too early in the morning when I wrote that I guess.
     
  16. Grant

    Grant Life is a rock, but the radio rolled me!

    That's what I was thinking... I can see where digital compression could sound bad because of that brick wall, and analog always provides *somewhere* for the sound to go, but EQ?

    Steve, could you elaborate for clarity?:confused:
     
  17. Steve Hoffman

    Steve Hoffman Your host Your Host Thread Starter


    Sorry.
     
  18. OcdMan

    OcdMan Senior Member

    Location:
    Maryland
    No worries. Everyday, all day, feels like too early in the morning for me. :D
     
  19. proufo

    proufo Forum Resident

    Hello Steve.

    Your analogy reminds me of a photographer that did pictures of naked models pressed against glass. Maybe you have seen his work.

    Following with the analogy, it may not be natural but as a special effect it can find its place.
     
  20. Steve Hoffman

    Steve Hoffman Your host Your Host Thread Starter

    Yes, but that photographer used film and special darkroom techniques to make the final result pretty nice.

    All compression does the same thing, analog and digital. It's just that analog compression does it so it sounds good just like the photographer does it with film to look good.
     
    trumpet sounds likes this.
  21. proufo

    proufo Forum Resident

    It's not the one that did the B&W pictures of submerged models. The ones I mean are simpler, something a lady might tease you with when she's in the shower.

    Fried eggs come to mind but much, much nicer.
     
  22. Graham Start

    Graham Start Forum Resident

    Location:
    Toronto, Canada
    I think a good visual comparison would be to take any photo, load it into Photoshop or some such image editor, and crank the saturation and/or contrast way up. Bright and colourful, grabs your attention, but is painful to look at for prolonged periods of time. All subtlety and detail are destroyed. A very high suck factor indeed.
     
  23. Beatle Terr

    Beatle Terr Super Senior SH Forum Member Musician & Guitarist

    A very high suck factor indeed.


    Graham, I love that line!!!! CLASSIC, however words well put.
     
  24. RockWizard

    RockWizard Forum Resident

    Thanks Steve! Lately, when I see something is "remastered", I CRINGE!!
     
  25. Steve Hoffman

    Steve Hoffman Your host Your Host Thread Starter

    The key word REMASTERED doesn't always mean bad. But a lot of the time it does, sad to say. Bad to audiophiles, I mean.*

    Audiophiles are people who appreciate good sound as well as good music.
     
    Steve356 likes this.
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