Petition launched to reintroduce Technics turntables (Update: The SL-1200 is Back!)*

Discussion in 'Audio Hardware' started by englishbob, May 27, 2014.

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  1. rebellovw

    rebellovw Forum Resident

    Location:
    hell
    Practical use? The blue one on mine reveals dust like nothing else - I love it. Carbon brush until the record is clear and passes the blue light test. Not to mention dark queuing.

    What you describe sounds like a bug.
     
    PhilBiker likes this.
  2. snorker

    snorker Big Daddy

    Not sure what you’re seeing, but mine lights the stylus all the way across the arc. There’s only one point on the arc where the beam is precisely aligned with the stylus, but that’s not necessary to illuminate it...try pushing it down to turn it off and you’ll see it lights the whole cartridge when it’s up.
     
  3. arem

    arem Forum Resident

    It really is for very low light situations, when DJing in a club the pop-up light is super helpful. But for any typical at home use its pretty useless. I only turn mine on once in a while to make sure it's still working. 20+ years and still going...
     
    bluemooze likes this.
  4. RPM

    RPM Forum Resident

    Location:
    Easter Island
    Don't you listen records in the dark?
    It helps seeing the gaps between tracks for cueing. Does not rotate, don't try.
    It's a great feature folks, even Luxman copied it on its new tt.
     
    rebellovw, arem, oregonalex and 2 others like this.
  5. rebellovw

    rebellovw Forum Resident

    Location:
    hell
    Criticism of the pop up light in a 1200 thread now I've heard everything. :laugh:
     
  6. Chris Treece

    Chris Treece Forum Resident

    Location:
    Haworth, UK
    punkmusick likes this.
  7. dolsey01

    dolsey01 Forum Resident

    Location:
    Boston, MA
    Yet, these are like Unicorns in the US. I really thought retailers here would have these in plentiful supply for the holiday season.
     
  8. AArchie

    AArchie Forum Resident

    Location:
    Colorado
    When I was looking for a 1200G I found many GRs. Look on the Technics sight at the dealer list. I contacted most of them when looking for the best deal. :sweating:
     
    Aftermath likes this.
  9. AArchie

    AArchie Forum Resident

    Location:
    Colorado
    I've been thinking more about the tonearm resonance I had (before I put heat-shrink tubing on the arm) on my 1200G. My "tonal memory" has it more in the range of Middle C on a piano. I looked up Middle C and its frequency is 261.6 Hz. Back2vinyl's frequency investigations in the above post seems to have identified it. Reading some of the posts on page 62 of this thread, there is also mention of a 300 Hz resonance ("In his review for Hi-Fi News, I think Paul Miller said he found a tonearm resonance at around 300 Hz."). For whatever reason, in my system, that resonance was especially pronounced.
     
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  10. snorker

    snorker Big Daddy

    I got an email from Kevin from KAB about this, which I think was prompted by your email to him. I tried testing for the resonance you described, but I couldn’t hear anything.

    Not exactly sure what to listen for, but I listened with my HD 650 headphones on and used a paper clip....When I put the arm down on a stationary record and tap the tonearm with the paper clip I just hear a little plink, but not any unusual resonance.

    I tried the frequency sweep on the AP Ultimate test record and didn’t notice any anomalies. I also ran the silent groove test and tapped with the paper clip, and did not hear anything unusual, just a little plink. It ran very quietly on the silent groove test track.

    Not sure what was going on there, but glad it was a simple fix for you.
     
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  11. FashionBoy

    FashionBoy Forum Resident

    Location:
    Toronto, Canada
    Does anyone know if the 1200G tonearm uses ruby bearings? Couldn't find any info on the Technics website re the bearings.
     
  12. Davey

    Davey NP: Portishead ~ Portishead (1997)

    Location:
    SF Bay Area, USA
    Doesn't look like it ...

    [​IMG]
     
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  13. AArchie

    AArchie Forum Resident

    Location:
    Colorado
    I've been testing with full gain. My pre puts out as much as 30 volts and if I tried listening at this level I'd be in total clipping. So, what I'm hearing is an extreme that doesn't necessarily show up under listening conditions. Also, different carts react differently. That said, I think the effects I'm getting are real and worth eliminating.

    With an unaltered arm tube I get two constructive resonances ( I estimate them somewhere in the 300 Hz and 60 Hz ranges.). The 60 Hz comes with the tonearm on inner grooves and with the dust cover up (TT power on or off). This one goes away if I hold the DC, take it off or put it down. I think it comes from my amp transformer and gets somehow amplified by the DC. This one persists even with a treated arm tube so I'm not sure it's related to the arm tube at all. It could be coming from the record and up through the stylus. The 300 Hz happens anywhere on the record and gets reconstructive at high volume but is there as a decaying "ringing" when the arm is tapped at any volume. Previously, I had mostly eliminated this with heat shrink tubing on the arm tube but today I removed the HS and applied silicone tape. The silicone tape 100% removed this resonance. Kevin uses a silicone inner tube which may be better but I don't want to rewire my tonearm to get inside! The silicone tape is about twice the weight of the HS at about 6.5 gms. The effective mass is lower since it's applied over the entire tube and not at the headshell.

    I can't post pictures here but the HS is a cleaner look while the tape works much better. I might try getting some silicone tubing to see if it will stretch to fit over the headshell locking ferrule which would give a nice clean look to the arm. I think having a silicone tube on the outside of the arm is functionally no different from having it on the inside like Kevin does. The nice thing is that all of these mods are completely reversible.

    Oh, as far as sound when tapping with a paper clip, I now get a dead sounding "thunk." :)
     
  14. snorker

    snorker Big Daddy

    Glad you were able to correct it to your satisfaction. Equally glad I can’t hear it on mine, whether it’s actually there or not! :laugh:
     
    recstar24 likes this.
  15. dmckean

    dmckean Forum Resident

    Location:
    San Diego, CA, USA
    There's no longer a need for jewel bearings in this day and age. Modern bearings have amazing tolerances and jewel bearings are extremely fragile and even more expensive than they were back in the day.
     
    FashionBoy, displayname and recstar24 like this.
  16. Classicrock

    Classicrock Senior Member

    Location:
    South West, UK.
    I'm convinced people can convince themselves they are hearing things. A member of another forum rejected two examples of SL1200G because he could hear 'rubbing' noise with his ear close to the spindle. Wonder if anyone else has had this issue? He is waiting another replacement from Technics so I will follow this. May be genuine but some audiophiles can be paranoid or plain nuts.

    Saga from here -

    Just ordered the 1200G! - Page 9

    He also got a duff Yamaha amp but I think that is more common.
     
    Last edited: Nov 26, 2017
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  17. snorker

    snorker Big Daddy

    Looked at that thread. No offense to the guy, and I hope he gets one he deems acceptable, but it sure sounds like it’s what you suggest. :rolleyes:
     
    PhilBiker likes this.
  18. Classicrock

    Classicrock Senior Member

    Location:
    South West, UK.
    The shop found their demo model made the same noise so maybe there is a bad batch out there or a container was dropped? 3 weeks to get another.
     
    PhilBiker likes this.
  19. snorker

    snorker Big Daddy

    Yeah, who knows. I just wonder if what he heard is just normal, and most wouldn’t notice or think twice about it.

    Anecdotally, it’s a universe quieter than my previous Clearaudio Concept. I could hear motor noise on that easily without putting my ear up to it. But it actually didn’t bother me...I just figured that’s the way it was supposed to be.
     
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  20. recstar24

    recstar24 Senior Member

    Location:
    Glen Ellyn, IL
    Would love to hear your thoughts/recommendations on record clamps/weights/puck-like devices. I'm eyeing the KAB technics specific RC1200 but am trying to gauge effectiveness as well as some cost comparisons.
     
  21. AArchie

    AArchie Forum Resident

    Location:
    Colorado
    I'm using the Rega Michell clamp that is configured for short spindles like on my G. So far I like its function but I'm thinking of building up the outer rim of the platter (under the matt) so that when I push on the clamp it will compensate for any record dish and/or warp. Kevin's clamp might not grab the spindle firmly enough to always get the needed clamping pressure. My MK2 had his threaded spindle clamp and I love that!
     
  22. recstar24

    recstar24 Senior Member

    Location:
    Glen Ellyn, IL
    Thank you! It appears that the spindle may be different on the G/GR than the original mk2, meaning the KAB threaded clamp may not be fully compatible?
     
  23. AArchie

    AArchie Forum Resident

    Location:
    Colorado
    Not to beat this to death ...

    I'm not sure if this is directed at all to me but if you turn your gains up enough you hear lots of things that can't be heard at normal listening levels. My goal is to eliminate whatever I reasonably can so that I don't get even subtle distortion. Actually, in my case, I was trying to convince myself that there couldn't possibly be resonances in the G tonearm. But that's hard to do when there is "runaway" feedback" -- even if it takes volume well above the listening level.

    Back2vinyl reported anomalies at 85 Hz and 250 Hz when he tested his GAE (page 62). I think I am seeing (hearing) what he saw too. I haven't been able to get rid of the low resonance at this point but silicone tape on the arm tube got rid of the higher.

    The test that I use is one that Kevin at KAB recommended. That is, with the stylus down on a stationary record and with volume up, tap the arm with a straightened paper clip. If there is ringing then resonance is indicated.
     
  24. AArchie

    AArchie Forum Resident

    Location:
    Colorado
    Kevin's threaded spindle uses a clamp he provided that had a male thread inside it. He use to offer this as one of his modifications. He would have the spindle drilled and threaded which required it to be pulled from the TT for that operation. His current threaded clamp uses a tight bushing to grab the spindle and a separate threaded section to push the clamp down on the record. If the friction fit on the spindle slips then the clamp pressure will be relieved. The Michell clamp uses a collet that grabs the spindle -- like what is used on a drill to hold the bit. It can be super tight. Clamping pressure is developed by pushing down on the clamp as you lock the spindle. It's not as precise as a threaded spindle clamp but so far it works well.
     
  25. recstar24

    recstar24 Senior Member

    Location:
    Glen Ellyn, IL
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