Phono or shielded IC : previous Morrow owners, what did YOU upgrade to?

You must understand that the SUT, being built into the turntable, only shortens the cabling distance for the un-boosted MC signal (and means you don't have to buy your own second TT -> SUT RCA cable). Other than that, there is nothing unique. The cable between the transformer and the phono stage is still very much a "phono" small-level signal, needing ~40dB gain, and making that cable just as susceptible to noise as any other SUT->Phono preamp or MM->phono preamp cabling.

The cartridge is loaded by the MM phono preamp's 47K through the transformer's winding ratio, dividing that resistance by the ratio (so you can see how that result compares to the cartridge's loading recommendations). However, any transformer also has a self-inductance, one that is not specified for the CM-1131 used. This is another contribution to the R-L-C loading, and since we have no idea how to fill in the missing parts of the formula, to understand how the transformer amplifies the importance of capacitance, it would be best to use a standard low capacitance cable as others might have used when evaluating the synergy of these transformers, while employing a cable with the best shielding rejection of outside interference.

If there was a preamp built in to the turntable (as you might find in an Audio-Technica or cheaper), then the type of cabling would be of little concern.

 

This may or may not be helpful. For a while, I got sucked into Morrow Audio cables but have since extracted myself from the hyperbole. I was using a set of Morrow MA4 RCA interconnects (the unshielded version - pre 2018 design) which were by far the most expensive cables I'd ever purchased. I was never ecstatic about the results in my system and, in the end, UPGRADED to cheaper cables. I still use a set of Morrow's (lower spec) for another system but, in time, will also take those out of the system.

I initially moved out the MA4s (with Pure Harmony plugs) for Atlas Equator OCC Integra interconnects and much preferred what came out of my system with the latter - at less than half the price of the MA4s. Since then, I have further experimented and have been more than surprised to have found another pair of interconnects that have resolutely stayed in my system: Mark Grant Cables HDX1s - less than half the cost of the Atlas cables and only 1/5th of the cost of the MA4s.

To my ears, music with the MA4s in place had a tendency to sound bright, even a touch brittle, with some recordings. The sound stage was decent, but.... With both the Atlas and Mark Grant replacements, the higher frequencies were notably smoother and the stereo sound stage was wider by, approximately 1/2 to 2/3 of a speaker width for each channel. With the HDX1s, the bottom end is a touch firmer (less "soft") than with the Atlas' and I just prefer the overall "feel" of the HDX1s.

In short, Morrow Audio products will not have a long term future in my system(s) and, based on a couple of responses to email enquiries I made, it's hard to disagree with the comments made by @The Dragon (reproduced below). My enquiries were along the lines of asking about differing audio characteristics of cable levels and the benefits, or otherwise, of using copper or silver RCA termination plugs. The responses were, IMO, rather unhelpful insofar as the respective responses were variations of "it (next level of cable) will be more musical..." and "..you'll hear 10% more..." [of what?]. I'm not sure that kind of information is any more helpful than, say, myriad forum posts by, well, us - including me...

I've not tried them personally but Black Cat Coppertone RCA cables seem to be well regarded but they are more expensive than Mark Grant's offerings.

Whatever you end up with, happy listening.

 

It certainly is helpful. Thanks for taking the time to write all this!

Truth be told, Morrows certainly sound much better than standard RCAs so definitely a step up but I'm just curious to try something else.

Audio Sensibility is interesting as they're local to me and might be able to arrange some sort of in-home trial pretty quickly. They unfortunately advertise their prices will increase on July 1st.

It'd be real fun to have a bunch of cables (5-10) to test. I don't mind paying once I have a goal but the current way of doing things certainly feels like trying to hit the bullseye in a pitch-black room.

 

Tried morrow recently when I added a step up transformer to the analog side of the house.
really didn’t work well for me at all, they seemed to really change the sound of my system in a strange way- weird bass.
I gave them a chance for a month but nothing improved, so I went back to blue jeans lc-1. my system sounds better and measures more accurately using room eq wizard with the lc-1 cable than the morrows or other cables i’ve tried from audio quest and monoprice- though none of the cables caused the bass oddities I noticed besides morrow.

 

I'm not surprised. The cable Morrow uses was not designed for audio signals.

 

I feel ha on guys not being engineers . AND Not trying to thread crap but I didn't like the idea of Morrow sending out email letters to those on his email list asking audiophiles to donate used albums too him so he could open his record store.

 

I liked what my Audioquest Diamondbacks, that I got from Music Direct for $85, did for my system than what the Morrow MA3's did, at like 3x the cost. There was just more fullness, more depth, to the sound. instruments and voices just seemed more real, more existing in a time and space, than just an electrical reproduction.

 

If you like the Morrows, you like the Morrows. I've never heard them but they do seem to be an odd-ball design and, with the multiple individually fully insulated wire bundles, a questionable design choice for a phono application where low capacitance is in order.

What @harby said above is true and important to remember -- the phono cable between the a SUT and a phono preamp is loading the phono cart is like the phono cable between the cart and the SUT. The same considerations apply. It is not like a cable between a CD player and a preamp, or an active phono gain stage and a preamp.

Between a SUT and an active phono pre, good shielding is pretty much essential or you're going to have hum, and low capacitance is ideal (by virtue of the nature of their design, no Morrow cables are low capacitance, in fact, they're high capacitance. For example the Morrow PH4 phono cable is 123 pF per foot in capacitance, that's enormous, a average audio coax RCA cable is more like 30 pF/ft and something like the Blue Jeans LC-1 is 12 pF/ft. The PH1, at least, is a more average 30 pF/ft. It's true, with moving coil cartridges, capacitance loading is not as critical as it is with MM, but 123 pF/ft?! To me that's just a poor design choice for a phono cable).

Between a SUT and a phono preamp the ideal cable would have low capacitance, very low resistance shielding that's effective at audio frequencies (so braided copper directly wired to the RCAs, not foil, or at least not just foil, connected via a drain wires), and as close to 100% shield coverage as possible -- including running the shield right up to the terminations (so, double braided shielding is a good choice). In my experience, unshielded cables used between a SUT and a phono pre will always result in induced hum and noise; and so too will cables where the shield is floating at one end.

I think the best design for phono cables with RCA connections is old fashioned coax with double braided copper shielding. You could try shielded coax in a air tube construction sort of geometry, or star quad arrangements if they're not those such that they increase the capacitance too much. If you want the lower inductance of a Litz geometry, you might try the Cardas cables. KAB makes a relatively inexpensive interconnect out of Cardas 1X21AWG Litz cable with cotton dielectric -- the KAB Spiral Air -- with average capacitance of around 33 pF/ft. I've always been curious about that cable, especially with the KLE terminations.

But, personally, I've tried some different things in that application -- SUT to phono pre -- including Teflon dielectric twin ax, twin ax with shield floating at one end, unshielded braided cables (the latter two of which both buzzed like a bee), and I came around to just using the cheapest and least esoteric cables between my SUT and phono pre -- solid core, double braided shielded, coax of the lowest possible capacitance in the shortest possible length (1.5 foot long LC-1). It's not going to sound bright, exciting or zingy -- but to my ears, whenever things sound bright, exciting and zingy, it's probably because there's too much noise, high frequency hash or IMD present -- but it will be quiet, smooth, and revealing of low level inner detail.

 

I've used these (made from Mogami) and I have yet to find any cable to surpass them and I have tried several including multiple Nordost, Cardas, Wireworld, Audioquest, Audience etc. A warm yet detailed sound with delicate top end. The low price goes against audiophile sensibilities- they just work and sound incredible. Cannot recommend them enough.

ART (American Recorder Technology) "POP"
KAB Electro Acoustics http://www.kabusa.com

 

Cable business was established long before the record store.

 

Is this better than the quad definition? For so cheap I might as well pay the .50 cents. What are the best RCA connects on parts express?

If anyone wanting to try Morrow they have a 35% off sale and I had MA3 in my cart and hesitated so they offered a 50% discount

 

I'm an advocate of coax compression crimp connectors onto appropriate cable, as it maintains full shielding, but needs an appropriate tool.

Instead, probably the best solder-able RCA you can buy for actual signal quality (but pricier than bulk connectors with similar spec) is the Neutrik NF2C-B/2. It has a tension chuck included that can clamp on RG6 sized cables, so your solder joint is not stressed.

The aforementioned Belden 1694F is only available in 1000 foot spools, but you can instead order one of the 4.5GHz SDI digital video cables made from this, cut off the BNCs, and cut the cable in half. It has 19ga center-stranded conductor, and 5x that copper in shielding. Good enough for 3Gb/s uncompressed digital video over 300 feet, probably OK for your turntable.

Still a waste of money except where you are wanting to make a custom-length lowest-capacitance cable for phono.


Otherwise, make your own Morrow MA"2400" for the ultimate in unsuitable-for-phono cable:

 

Not quite that simple. One can very well end up with a cold solder joint despite taking all those steps. Most amateurs don't realize that a joint is no good if it cools with a dull appearance - the right amount of heat must be applied for each scenario and solder type.

I've corrected probably hundreds of poor solder joints during my time in avionics repair, joints that were soldered by professionally-trained techs.

In hi-fi, the majority of cold solder joints I encounter are those in modified or hand-soldered electronics and cables. I find it especially common in boutique cables, yet I've never had a problem with the cheap, molded RCA cables like those from Ratshack.

Some amateurs are lucky enough to get good results with their early attempts but proficiency with a variety of materials and joints takes skill and experience.

 

I returned the Morrow PH3 I auditioned, and spent some time reading here and ultimately decided to roll my own. I chose Mogami 2497 cable, and for interconnects I went with Furutech FP106(R)'s which had to be ordered from Japan. No soldering involved, but the thick middle insulation required some careful shaving during installation. I'm very pleased with the results, enjoying a wider soundstage and level of detail I've never heard before.

 

Congrats on some very nice cables! The Mogami 2497 and 2803 (made with OCC copper) are both very special cables. I use 2497 for phono cables and 2803 for my other unbalanced connections (DAC to pre) with KEI RCA plugs. These maintain the signal integrity of the upper mid to high frequencies better than any I have used. These Mogami cables are well-known in the recording industry. They don't get much play in the audio press because of the DIY nature of using these. Mogami does sell RCA cables using this cable in Japan. In fact, you can order them from Amazon Japan. There are a couple of specialty cable manufacturers who will make these to order. World's Best Cables used to sell on Amazon, but I haven't seen these lately. There is another outfit in Greece selling on Ebay. An interesting side note - the Audience AU24 cables, which received many accolades from the audiophile press and actual users, was manufactured using the Mogami 2803 cable with a sheath to make it more aesthetically pleasing.

Mogami also sells speaker cable using the same construction methodology (2804).

 

Where did you purchase the materials? And was it easy to use the solderless plugs?

 

The Mogami 2497 can be bought by the foot from Redco. The Furutech plugs were bought from a Japanese seller on Ebay.
It was easy to install the solderless plugs, however I want to note the inner insulation is quite thick, and needs to be carefully shaved down a bit with a razor blade. No big deal, just wanted to note that issue.

 

Actually, I use Morrow cables throughout my system and I'm very pleased with them. They replaced Monster RCA cables and I absolutely do hear a difference. Much more detail. I'm using a tube amp, so if the Morrows are brightening things up a bit, thats a good thing and not a bad thing. In fact, going to listen to some Joe Meek stuff right now.

 

This just occurred to me. Here we are, all of us spending lots of money on audio cables to get better sound from our systems, myself included.

Well, we also laud all the Bill Putnam recordings from Universal for how crystal clear and 3D they still sound today.Which they do.

Fact: all the interconnection wiring at Universal Sound was..........................plain old copper telephone wire like every American had in their home.

So just maybe......it aint the cable.