Discussion in 'Music Corner' started by Steve Hoffman, Jun 15, 2013.
you're right. I think a lot of the tracks on the album have the same phasing issue, actually
I tried on the only stereo copy I could find of Waterloo Sunset..on You Tube
The main vocal is on the right and the instruments are sort of leftish of centre, and the backing vocals are floating around the whole spectrum. If I reverse the phase of one speaker, the main vocal is hard right, the instruments hard left and backing vocals directly in the middle...now I'm confused.
Not that much....I have a crick in my neck from prostrating myself before the floor-level speakers (which seems like an appropriate response!)
Phase refers to differences in signal timing.
Polarity reversal means connecting the pos(+) to the neg(-) and the neg(-) to the pos(+)
I just played "Waterloo Sunshine" from Kink Kronikles and my dog perked his ears *way* up when those backing vocals started. He's listening to music with me on my easy chair (he's a Chihuahua so be nice, OK?) so I guess my speakers are positioned OK. I hadn't listened to The Kinks in quite a while so it was nice that this thread came up to remind me of their greatness...
What about the US tri color Reprise stereo?
A ways back we had two cats, neither spent a lot of the time in my listening room, except, whenever I played a Puccini opera, the one and only the one would always come in and plop down; whenever I played a Verdi opera, the other one and only the other one would come in for a spell. It was kind of trippy really, a quite repeatable experiment, and each composer fit their personality to a T.
Ok, back to the Kinks, hitting play on "Phenomenal Cat" [Mono] right now.
I must admit that I have no Kinks in my collection so I downloaded the stereo version from iTunes and converted the MPEG into MP3, stuck it on a usb drive and played it. I am wondering if the MP3 conversion affected the impact of the effects because though I can hear the BG floating around the effect is not as pronounced as the posts he indicate it to be. I tried various speaker positions, though I did not spend a huge amount of time. My speaker position is somewhat triangular and I have space between side walls and back plus they are toe'd in so I see a small amount of inside speaker from listening seat.
For years these were considered to be eighties remixes and they might be for all I know. I have heard that these alternate mixes appear on reissues dating back at least to the seventies, though. Could these be Ray's in-phase mixes that Andrew Sandoval was talking about? I haven't seen anyone mention it yet but "Tin Soldier Man" on the new box set The Anthology 1964-1971 sounds like this alternate mix to me.
I finally got around to this. I ended up with my speakers about 6 inches farther apart with slightly more toe-in. It works great, those vocals are really wrapping widely around floating in the background. It is not subtle and it is pretty dramatic. Lots of fun and that happens to be a great tune.
One negative I stayed up too late listening to the entire Kinks Kronicles double LP because I was enjoying it so much.
"Electric Ladyland" is full of that "surround sound"
Same experience here
oop posted in wrong thread. And not oop as in Out Of Phase.
It works with the mono, but you end up with your speakers across the street...
A couple of further suggestions, based on my virtual surround earbud listening:
Al Green: Tired Of Being Alone-the background vocals.
Larry Groce-Junk Food Junkie-the mass applause. On my earphones, the singing and instrumentation sounds like mono, but the applause sounds like it's behind my head.
"Waterloo Sunset" on the recent Sanctuary Records 5CD Kinks box set The Anthology 1964 - 1971 is in stereo.
Is that as good a version of the song to use for our host's test as the other CDs mentioned in this thread?
I think they actually fixed most of the Something Else-era tracks' phase issues on the Anthology, so probably not.
I have a sixties tri-color U.S. stereo, but I remember hearing or reading somewhere that some US Kinks are possibly fake stereo?
Admittedly I have not read through the whole thread.
The 60s stereo vinyl is stereo. I have one on Reprise.
Face to Face is a mix of fake and true stereo, and a couple of albums IIRC before that are fake stereo, possibly including all of the Greatest Hits. The first album is true stereo except for You Really Got Me and maybe another track or two.
Just to clarify, Steve, are you referring to the S/T 'Deep Forest' album or the 'Sweet Lullaby' maxi-single?
By the way, one of the finest examples of this "vocals floating in the air" phenomenon that I've heard is on Rundgren's 'Hello It's Me' - specifically the background vocals on the Hoffman-mastered version on Rock Of The 70s/Reelin' in the Years. I've heard a LOT of versions of this song, and this one is by far my favorite - even better than the one on 'Super '70s'.
Steve - if you see this and remember if there was a different approach to these 2 masterings, or if they came from different sources, I'd love to know the details!
Yeah. Place them in a soundproof room with a lock on the door.
There are no stereo mixes for Kinda Kinks or Kontroversy, so if you see a Reprise pressing for either in stereo, avoid it.
The common CD. Q-Sound. (Which I usually hate).
Separate names with a comma.