Many Supernait2 owners have tried the SN2 with and without the power supply, and have preferred the sound without it. Personally, I would have a hard time paying that much for a separate power supply. The SN2 sounds good enough as it is, I believe. I'm saving for one now. Dave
The CD5i was great. My first 'modern era' (black casework) Naim system was the entry-level CD5i>Nait 5i. At the time (2005?), the whole shebang was $3k (a bargain, in retrospect.) Shoulda stuck with it, it was all any sane music listener should need.
There's some properly weird posts and thoughts on Naim gear here. I know a lot of people who own Naim amp systems, none of us are even vaguely culty, we just went into a hi-fi shop listened to a load of stuff and decided the Naim sounded great. It's very well built kit that lasts and last and lasts. It sounds just fabulous (no matter what people might say to the contrary) and this whole thing about power output just shows what a meaningless metric power rating is for an amp. Yes, they are only rated at low tens of watts, but the point is they can dump some serious current into your speakers which is where a lot of systems fall down and they are more than loud enough for an excellent home sound system. They massively over engineer PSUs and it makes a difference. Seems pretty odd to say it's outrageously expensive too. People spend insane amounts of money on cars all the time, and their value drops through the floor as soon as you drive out the showroom. I got a 42/110 combo second hand in the mid '80s, I really can;t remember exactly how much, but it would have been in the few hundred quid region. I still use the 110, it still sounds great and the only thing I've had done to it is electrolytic replacement. You can add a power supply for the pre amp. I was ultra sceptical about the benefit of this, but was astounded at home much it improved the quality. I have a friend who owns a hi-fi shop and he brought a second hand one round for me to listen to back in the mid/late 90s. I kept telling him I would not buy one because it could not make a difference, but a couple minutes in to the demo I agreed to buy it. I upgraded my 42 pre amp to a NAC 82 in the late 90s, again second hand and it still works flawlessly to this day. I have replaced the electrolytic and tantalum caps in the pre amp's PSU which cost me about thirty-ish quid. As the units are so easy to take apart and put together, replacing capacitors is a synch. If that is beyond you, there are plenty of places who'll do it for a very reasonable price. So, in thirty odd years I've spent something in the region of £1500 ish on amps that people are blown away by when they listen to my hifi. For a Pre amp/PSU/Power amp separates combo I think that's a bloody bargain when you consider how much use I've had out of them. I'm no cultist, I really couldn't give a monkey's what anyone else has, all I know is that my ears tell me it sounds awesome and it's superbly built and durable. All this is making me think I should finally upgrade that power amp. In the end, anyone who buys hi-fi on anything other than how it sounds to their ears is not doing it right and if people shout you down because you find something sounds better than what they do, that's just immature. So, if some Naim folk really do that, they're idiots, but there plenty of us who own Naim systems and love them simply because they sound fabulous to our ears.
Good thread! I owned a NAC 32.5/NAP 140 system with a Teddy Pardo TeddyCap power supply and it was awesome, had it at least a decade. Great phono section too. And I had a Nait 3 for my second system that was inexpensive used and fun to listen to. Then I got a Rogue Sphinx, then a Heed Elixir—both great integrated amps. Then an Accuphase E270 for a few years, loved it. Picked up a Naim NAC22/NAP120 for a second system, half for the historic value to me, and it sounded very good. Demoed some new naim stuff a few months ago and loved it. Now my main system is Naim NDX 2/Supernait 3/HiCap-DR with a Rega TT and Spendors. I’d demoed a lot of amps—tube, class A solid state, AB, class D—and all had something great about them. But I’m really enjoying music on the new Naim system. Another thing I like is Naim’s DIN cabling and speaker cable. DIN connections are better than RCA, both channels in one cable for less cable mess, and the source and power units come with a cable generally. The naim Naca5 speaker cable sounds great and isn’t expensive compared to a lot of other brands. It’s just stiff af. Good stuff.
I suspect people get locked into one brand especially for system matching. I am locked into cyrus. I have never liked the naim sound. Last year when i was buying hifi i demoed ome naim and it put me to sleep. As did quad(even more soporific) and rega. Its not just that people are brand loyal, our ears and minds get used a certain sound. Its incredibly hard to adjust in a demo session and you cant afford to take a risk on kit costing thousands naim is considered high quality gear and i can understand its appeal. System matching is crucial when buying hifi. A few years ago i took a chance on changing from cyrus to roksan when buying a new cd player. Massive mistake that cost me £2k. I could not get used to the roksan sound. Hifi is very expensive. Mistakes cost a lot of money This may lay behind brand loyalty. Of course, we may just like what we hear from our kit. If itd not broke and all that Years ago i made a choice between naim and meridian. This was when meridian was more affordable. I then embarked on a meridian phase. Now its cyrus. I cant afford to start again. I dont have around £6K to spare. above all. i like what i have got Thats what its all about aint it?
Thanks have not been on Pink Fish for years, my name and password were still there, one click and I am enjoying living in nostalgia land.
If you want to start a Naim war you have to say Chrome Bumper & Olive, and Armageddon occurs, in the mid 80s I met lots of strange acolytes who were totally mad and I say that as a Chrome Bumper owner. I've no idea about mystique but Naim tried to do everything different, including having speaker connections on the power amp the wrong way round. For myself I had no intention of buying a Naim amp, having gone to buy a replacement for my stolen Exposure VII, VIII but I ended up with my current amp and 33 years later and I've never considered a different amp. I don't believe that a current amp wouldn't be better but it's never seemed necessary. Now Olive and everything went WTF and I know many dealers who let their franchise go as at that point everything was messed up, I've not heard the recent models but I know most of those dealers now sell Naim again.
I jumped on the Devialet ship back in 2016... it was a love or hate relationship to be honest with very crappy software. Not good for vinyl. I sold them a few months ago and now moved to a full analog set-up. Impressive speakers, especially when you demo it to people but horrible for every day use.
I brought a Devialet home for a 3-day weekend a couple of years ago. I found it initially pretty compelling -- super revealing -- but after not too long a time listening it moved to 'annoyingly revealing' (my term) and just not pleasant, for me, to listen to. I have seen (heard) this phenomenon many times; gear that is initially fun to listen to isn't over the long term.
I went to the local shops to audition to buy a 'first nice hi fi in 25 years' and ended up after listening with a Naim integrated, and Devore speakers, in 2011. I slowly over time was able to march up the Naim ladder, by buying "gently used" via Audiogon. Then I found my current dealer who has a significant business upgrading customers and re-selling the units. That certainly is the cost-effective (relatively) way to do this; buying "gently used." Other than the pre and power combo, I know people with all sorts of sources and speakers; no need or even compulsion to stick with Naim sources and certainly not their speakers (which havent been made in at least 5 years). And for the record their streamers support hi res and dsd files, and no the amp won't blow up if you use the wrong speaker wire.
I would never send my amp to Naim for service or repair when's there's a much better and cheaper option Witch Hat Servicing. Set up by the former Naim Chief Engineer, who was involved in the design of the original 250 and all staff are former Naim employees. He's a real nice guy after having a long chat with him, although I'm thinking that's less likely now, as their fame and size has grown. I've also had the displeasure of talking to Naim HQ They also do some potential mods, which I'm sure would be worth considering, were original parts of the older amps have discontinued production they search for and source something they're happy with. I've had all my amp(s) serviced by them and they retained the original sound just obviously better after a recap etc. They also do their own interconnects and I can confirm they are superior to original Naim cables. I've known some Naim owners being very unhappy after they let Naim touch their amps, as it seem they use their new parts, which wouldn't be a issue for newer models but in any event I trust Witch Hat. Witch Hat Servicing
I first heard a very expensive Naim system with Kudos Titan 808s at a dealers' about a year ago and felt exactly the same. I didn't like it at all which, given the good reputation of the Naim brand, puzzled me. I have heard this system again and other Naim gear on a handful of occasions since and have now changed my opinion. After a couple of session, I found them to be excellent. I have concluded that there is characteristic Naim sound that can be off putting at first. However, this is superficial and soon forgotten after prolonged listening. The fundamentals are good if you can get past this.
I do enjoy Naim amplification from time to time, but not as my one and only amp. My personal findings: Naim is great at: -conveying the action in the music, i.e. organizing the recording into clearly separated rhythms and melodies -punchy mids -focusing on the actual notes being played as opposed to a focus on instrument tonality (overtones) To me, Naim is not good at: -lush, rich or relaxing instrumental timbres. -upper end 'air' frequencies -spatial/reverb information
Can you get the best of both worlds if you pair up Naim with speakers that do those things well? Maybe this is why I see quite a lot of Naim/Harbeth or Naim/Spendor pairings. I guess that might be one school of thought. Another would be to have everything pulling in one direction to really build on the strength of each component.
I am not sure. Even on my Harbeths I can hear the shortcomings of the Naim approach in terms of tonality. Don't get me wrong, I do enjoy my Nait XS/Harbeth combo. At least the Nait wakes up my older, somewhat polite SHL5 (non Plus version).
Don't know that I'd consider it a benefit unless it somehow hurts the sound. But you are correct. I buy a CD player to listen to it. As long as it has a good DAC section and sounds engaging, there is no reason to connect it to an external DAC, to chase after something that you already have achieved.
As a nineties Naimie, I had the common pairing of Naim kit & Linn speakers; Keilidhs in my case. A few years ago I switched them out for some Epos Epic 5s, cheap at about £800 and not as pretty but coupled with my 102/180 with all the power supplies, this was the best it had ever sounded. It was definitely made to last, my CD 3.5 again with power supply and NAT02 which is still the best tuner I’ve heard, must be around 25 years old and still going strong in the other system.
Reading some of the comments reminds me of the crazy people who were evangelical about Naim and Naim themselves were condescending preeks. I've remembered a event they did at a largish venue and it turned in to dem and what do you think question session and if you got it wrong you were obviously a idiot, one guy got some stick from them, they annoyed me and I told them you're tw @ ts and left. No wonder some people are turned off.
Irrespective of brand, this is just (to me) an important part of the audition process. First listen / short listen isn't enough often. I've heard ]gear that wows me in the first 5-10 minutes, but by the end of a weekend home audition I'm happy to send back.
